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  1. #151

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    I think one crucial component due to the IPhone and YouTube revolution. There are some amateurs that are great at self promotion. And that was something growing up in the 1970's we never had,and actually was glad of.

    I hear how great this new era is of freedom for musicians. What it really is ,is the gates keeping most of the hacks out of the business are now broken.
    You no longer need studio musicians,arrangers, producers, promoters,etc. And studio time is basically free! OH JOY!
    You hit on exactly what I was talking about. That's why it happens. The gates aren't keeping out the hacks and they're getting away with all the stuff we've tried to get out of our technique. Now I don't begrudge these guys anything specifically for myself but I see a lot of players out there who are incredible and they're not making a cent. I wonder if people really care whether or not we know our instruments.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #152
    Dick Clark famously said in the Wrecking Crew movie" People don't care how the music is actually made. But the problem is if you try that in any other field, good luck with that!

  4. #153

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    A lot of times, if you try to copy something, it can seem really difficult to nail the sound.

    But, if you finally figure out how the original player did it, it's often physically pretty easy.

    I don't need to be reminded that there are exceptions. I have seen players up close do astonishing things.

    I first learned it when trying to play Honky Tonk Women in standard tuning. Pretty much impossible to get it to sound the same. In Keith's tuning, it's easy.

    Same thing for the Rolling Stones, This Could Be The Last Time. Brian Jones had a not-obvious way of playing that lick. Once you know what he did, it's easy.

    Some of the Brazilian chording is like that (some is hard no matter how you do it). Dori Caymmi's Migration comes to mind. Impossible to nail the sound, unless you figure out what he did, and then it's easy.

  5. #154

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Tony Rice is a good example of a Professinal Guitarist who has studied and continues a path forward. Clarence White before him and Bryan Sutton currently are also great examples of true guitar heroes in my book!
    Or Craig Milner, or Molly Tuttle

  6. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    I think one crucial component due to the IPhone and YouTube revolution. There are some amateurs that are great at self promotion. And that was something growing up in the 1970's we never had,and actually was glad of.

    I hear how great this new era is of freedom for musicians. What it really is ,is the gates keeping most of the hacks out of the business are now broken.
    You no longer need studio musicians,arrangers, producers, promoters,etc. And studio time is basically free! OH JOY!
    Well Allan Holdsworth wouldn’t have made half of his records if he hadn’t done it himself.

  7. #156

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    The first time I saw a capo was with the folk group Peter, Paul and Mary in the 60's. A few Country guys also used them. I bought one, used it a couple of times and then it sat in my case for over 50 years. I still have it. It's like new. Any offers? Good playing . . . Marinero

  8. #157

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    Since this is turning into a Capo thread, may I add that Flamenco players use them all the time and they are absolutely smoking. Probably wouldn't know the chords' names, though.

    Personally, I use it on a couple of tunes to get the feel of open strings while playing in horn-friendly keys. Also, playing the Peter Gunn riff in F for four minutes straight is somewhat demanding.

  9. #158

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    Another style of music that absolutely need the open strings for the sound.

    TBH I’m starting to feel bad I don’t use a capo.

  10. #159

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    And then there are the various partial capos......

  11. #160

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    Tony Mcmanus. Alt tuning and capo. Double cheater

  12. #161

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    I think one crucial component due to the IPhone and YouTube revolution. There are some amateurs that are great at self promotion. And that was something growing up in the 1970's we never had,and actually was glad of.

    I hear how great this new era is of freedom for musicians. What it really is ,is the gates keeping most of the hacks out of the business are now broken.
    You no longer need studio musicians,arrangers, producers, promoters,etc. And studio time is basically free! OH JOY!


    Yeah .. I too long for the days where record companies would exploit hopeful musicians by tying them up in contracts that didn't pay shit to others than the record companies. All because there was no other way to be heard than thru those record companies.

    Really really miss the good old day. These days people get thru to large audiences on their own merits .. Simply disgraceful if you ask me
    Last edited by Lobomov; 04-20-2020 at 01:43 PM.

  13. #162

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    Albert Collins capoed his Tele somewhere around the 9th fret and played in an open tuning to a minor chord.

    He was an absolute master of screaming blues.

    Should somebody have told him not to do that?

  14. #163

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    Albert Collins capoed his Tele somewhere around the 9th fret and played in an open tuning to a minor chord.

    He was an absolute master of screaming blues.

    Should somebody have told him not to do that?
    Of course not, and I don't see where anyone here has ever implied that.

    The topic is "guitarist the Most ignorant": As it relates to musicians, being ignorant doesn't mean one is a lesser musician. Being told one is ignorant isn't a put-down. Every musician is ignorant of some aspect of music.

  15. #164

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    Quote Originally Posted by jameslovestal
    Of course not, and I don't see where anyone here has ever implied that.

    The topic is "guitarist the Most ignorant": As it relates to musicians, being ignorant doesn't mean one is a lesser musician. Being told one is ignorant isn't a put-down. Every musician is ignorant of some aspect of music.
    Agreed on all points.
    Many Jazz guitarist are quite ignorant as to the scope and diversity of capo use by serious guitarists in other genres.

  16. #165

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    Quote Originally Posted by jameslovestal
    Of course not, and I don't see where anyone here has ever implied that.
    .
    Post 138?

  17. #166

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    Quote Originally Posted by wengr
    Agreed on all points.
    Many Jazz guitarist are quite ignorant as to the scope and diversity of capo use by serious guitarists in other genres.
    I agree with that. I really do. Good to see we have a common understanding.

  18. #167

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    Post 138?
    Here is post #138:

    "The only time a capo is justified is if you need a song in a different key for a singer and you're trying to get that sound that results from open string chords like you're trying to duplicate an arrangement you got off a recording. Otherwise you should know how to play songs in all 12 keys".

    I agree that this statement is too broad especially as it relates to "only time a capo is justified"; First one doesn't need to 'justify' use of a capo or pedal etc... (anything used with a guitar that alters the sound). In addition the ',,, in a different key for a singer and you're trying to get that sound results from open string chords,,": that 'and' should be an 'or', as in 'one is trying to get an open string sound".

    Isn't the latter what Collins was doing with "played in an open tuning to a minor chord"?

    Bottom line; many musicians use a capo to get a certain sound and NOT because they lack knowledge of how to play movable \ bar chords or in more than the standard open chord keys. But some amateur guitarist do use a capo because of lack of knowledge, as well as ambition. I know this for a fact since these guys are my friends. I.e. we all have been playing guitar for decades and they still can only play the same 5 or 6 open string chords. E.g. If a song calls for a C minor,,,, the capo has to come out.

  19. #168

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    Post #138 was mine. You have to remember what is the primary purpose of this site is and that is playing jazz on the guitar. That's what I was referring to when I talked about the only justification. Guys who play other kinds of music do what they need to get certain effects but in jazz which is not an easy subject to master need different requirement which is the ability to play in all kinds of keys since we deal with other instruments like horns and singers. Yes, I consider the human voice an instrument. To play a lot of jazz and standards, you kind of need more skills than you do rock or country. Now that's not knocking rock or country because a lot of jazz musicians with a hell of a lot of skills play other kinds of music. But on this site, the focus is jazz. Now I'm going to stop ranting here because I don't want to dig myself into a deeper hole than I already have.

  20. #169
    There are always hurdles to get over in every job. And while record companies were pretty awful, studio time was expensive as well as marketing.
    Bu the good thing was The average Joe couldn't compete with professionals on an equal footing. You had to have earned a ticket to get in.

    Imagine an amateur golfer at a PGA tournament. Doesn't happen, so why so in music? And why is it passed off as actual recordings ? I say it's incredibly disrespectful to professional music comunity.

  21. #170

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    Classic American jazz guitar didn't use open strings much, as far as I know.

    Brazilian jazz uses open strings a lot. To get the original sound right, it helps to play those exact voicings, with the same ringing quality of open strings.
    If you want the original sound in a different key, the capo is the right tool for the job.

    If you want to know 6 chords and use a capo to know 12 or 18 etc., fine with me. Since there are too many guitar styles and too many things to know, we all have to draw a line someplace.

    That said, I think I understand the sentiment of the posts and I generally agree.

  22. #171

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    Often, "ignorant" may tend to mean "not like what I know, not like I do it, not like me".

    I play
    with my thumb behind the neck, never lopped over
    with all four fingers, always, all styles, all positions
    with a pick, reverse circular efficiency picking
    by ear exclusively, jazz and all styles
    knowing theory but never using it
    making up new chords as needed
    having read music since childhood but having never used a lead sheet
    without a capo, I've used my index finger as a capo to play cowboy chords up the neck
    etc...

    By the definition above, I should find virtually all guitarists to be ignorant.
    But notice that ignorant is cognate to ignore, which is what one should do.

  23. #172
    Technique isn't what I'm referring to. Content of vocabulary, repertoire, time in the saddle, doing it for real,not a Nintendo game. And while there are many different styles and genres of music,they all have the same 3 components.
    Melody,Rhthm,and Harmony, at least Western music does.

    No being well versed in all 3 components as well as knowing your instrument makes for a poor musician. Also not understanding repertoire in different genres of music and how it works is extremely important.
    Oscar Peterson interviewed felt history of music was younger musicians biggest weakness. Couldnt agree more!

  24. #173

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    No being well versed in all 3 components as well as knowing your instrument makes for a poor musician.
    Sorry I don't get this .. I mean, it's not like we're saving life's on a daily basis here or anything ..

    .. Why are we getting competitive about making pling pling noices over Donna Lee in 12 keys without a capo with or without a lead sheet?


    I mean unless you're actually in a position to offer work to those that you deem as not poor musicians?

  25. #174

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    this post is only a provocation made by an idiot..
    I learned music the hardest way I could,all my Life

  26. #175

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    Quote Originally Posted by emilP
    this post is only a provocation made by an idiot..
    I learned music the hardest way I could,all my Life
    That's pretty unfair, Emil. I think it has created some interesting remarks and provocative discussions. Good playing . . . Marinero

  27. #176

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    I have to concur that this thread is actually a load of old guff.

    But then I don’t run into too many idiot guitar players these days. Which is not to say they don’t exist. But they’re not working.

    And then there’s people who are basic in their guitar knowledge but songwriters primarily. I can’t do that very well. Can you?

  28. #177

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    I could,when I was working with my daughter in law,who's a singer

  29. #178
    Fair enough! I'm ranting as an old guff professional guitaristwhos done everything from playing with famous people Doc Severensen, Bonnie Raitt, Alexander Oneill. Non famous locals Debbie Duncan, The Steeles, Prudence Johnson,etc

    National jingles Target, Hormel,etc, local jingles. Church gigs, Lutheran,Evangelical,Jewish, Catholic, etc. Teaching at Votech Colleges,
    Played every Cou try Club and Bar rich to poor.
    Played almost every style form Great American Songbook, Old School R&B, Hip Hop, Blues old and newer, Country old and new Pop old and newer to Katy Perry etc.

    In other words I got paid to play music. Not saying I'm great at all of it,far from it!
    But to do that requires knowledge of how to navigate music and it's elements.
    Did I choose to learn all those styles and genre's of music ? NO, but it has broadened my abilities as a musician.

    Also true no one needs to do all of those things to be a good musician. But it definitely helps and makes you a more well rounded one.
    My bitch is the people who think they are pros just because they are popular on Youtube,etc. If that is the new litmus test,count me out and music dead!

    Caveat: Non of this is directed at amateur musicians.Just those who consider themselves pros without doing the actual work and time as a real musician.

  30. #179

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    "My bitch is the people who think they are pros just because they are popular on Youtube,etc. If that is the new litmus test,count me out and music dead!

    Caveat: Non of this is directed at amateur musicians.Just those who consider themselves pros without doing the actual work and time as a real musician." Jads57


    Sounds reasonable to me, Jads. Good playing . . . Marinero

  31. #180

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Fair enough! I'm ranting as an old guff professional guitaristwhos done everything from playing with famous people Doc Severensen, Bonnie Raitt, Alexander Oneill. Non famous locals Debbie Duncan, The Steeles, Prudence Johnson,etc

    National jingles Target, Hormel,etc, local jingles. Church gigs, Lutheran,Evangelical,Jewish, Catholic, etc. Teaching at Votech Colleges,
    Played every Cou try Club and Bar rich to poor.
    Played almost every style form Great American Songbook, Old School R&B, Hip Hop, Blues old and newer, Country old and new Pop old and newer to Katy Perry etc.

    In other words I got paid to play music. Not saying I'm great at all of it,far from it!
    But to do that requires knowledge of how to navigate music and it's elements.
    Did I choose to learn all those styles and genre's of music ? NO, but it has broadened my abilities as a musician.

    Also true no one needs to do all of those things to be a good musician. But it definitely helps and makes you a more well rounded one.
    My bitch is the people who think they are pros just because they are popular on Youtube,etc. If that is the new litmus test,count me out and music dead!

    Caveat: Non of this is directed at amateur musicians.Just those who consider themselves pros without doing the actual work and time as a real musician.
    maybe there’s something wrong with me, but I don’t care about those people.

    But the crazy thing about guitar is sometimes someone who can barely play in the formal sense can do something really good. and sometimes people who are amazing at their craft have nothing to say.

    so I’m ambivalent. Do what turns you on. Get into the things you are into.

    YouTube is dumb, but I’m on it, so I can lay into it too much haha.

  32. #181

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    I also think there’s a background to all of this which is the slow death of the live circuit.

    Online stuff is a poor replacement for that, but it might be something else. Music will evolve. This whole corona thing is pushing things forward very fast.

  33. #182

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    Oh no, the term 'real musician' has been introduced; this thread is going to do down hill fast! (ha ha).

    But I should have assumed this is where a topic related to ignorance (lack of knowledge), would go.

    To some to be a 'real musician' one has to have a certain degree of musical knowledge. While I understand this POV, I find the concept of 'real' as it relates to an art form \ artist misguided (at best).

    Of course I'm just an amateur and that shapes my perspective; My profession is in IT and programming and I admit I used to use that 'real' concept there; e.g. if one didn't know java script, they aren't a "real" programmer \ IT professional. (I don't anymore since I can't keep up with the young hot shots!)

  34. #183

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    I’m not in IT but even I know people get snotty about code.

  35. #184
    Just so Im not misunderstood. I would never ever go to someone else's job or field of endevour and and feel I'm on par with them at their job

    The difference is many people feel they are entitled to feel on par with pro musicians that have no business doing so. Why because the public doesn't care, and always say it's not brain surgery.
    Not many jobs are brain surgery, but people don't invade or allowed on the playing field. Sports,Medicine,Law,Plumbers,Carpenters, etc. Why does the public and even worse other musicians condone this?

    No harm done? Sorry but music nowadays is at an all time creative low point!
    I know you will all flame me for this statement.
    But when people especially the pros aren't paid for their services,they don't work for free.
    So name any music that is on par with any great Music of the past, pre IPhone era.

    I can't ! Genre doesn't matter either. Again the actual music not the great younger players which I agree their are plenty of.

  36. #185

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    Quote Originally Posted by jameslovestal
    My profession is in IT and programming and I admit I used to use that 'real' concept there; e.g. if one didn't know java script, they aren't a "real" programmer \ IT professional. (I don't anymore since I can't keep up with the young hot shots!)
    I use to work in systems, not really a proper programmer though, I did a bit of all kinds of things. Not long before I retired, I went to a meeting with some IT guys who all started talking about ‘Jenkins’ and ‘Git’. I didn’t have a clue what they were on about!

  37. #186

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Why does the public and even worse other musicians condone this?
    As being part of the public, I can answer that easy.

    We appreciate stuff that makes us happy or resonates emotionally with us. We don't care who you've played with or whether you've paid your dues. We're actually open to other people and give them a fair chance before dismissing them.



    But to something completely different.

    Are you ok jads57?
    You seem stressed and and maybe even depressed?

  38. #187

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Fair enough! I'm ranting as an old guff professional guitaristwhos done everything from playing with famous people Doc Severensen, Bonnie Raitt, Alexander Oneill. Non famous locals Debbie Duncan, The Steeles, Prudence Johnson,etc

    National jingles Target, Hormel,etc, local jingles. Church gigs, Lutheran,Evangelical,Jewish, Catholic, etc. Teaching at Votech Colleges,
    Played every Cou try Club and Bar rich to poor.
    Played almost every style form Great American Songbook, Old School R&B, Hip Hop, Blues old and newer, Country old and new Pop old and newer to Katy Perry etc.
    In other words I got paid to play music. Not saying I'm great at all of it,far from it!
    But to do that requires knowledge of how to navigate music and it's elements.
    Did I choose to learn all those styles and genre's of music ? NO, but it has broadened my abilities as a musician.
    Also true no one needs to do all of those things to be a good musician. But it definitely helps and makes you a more well rounded one.
    My bitch is the people who think they are pros just because they are popular on Youtube,etc. If that is the new litmus test,count me out and music dead!
    Caveat: Non of this is directed at amateur musicians.Just those who consider themselves pros without doing the actual work and time as a real musician.
    "Yeah, but what have you done for me lately?"

  39. #188

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Not many jobs are brain surgery, but people don't invade or allowed on the playing field. Sports,Medicine,Law,Plumbers,Carpenters, etc. Why does the public and even worse other musicians condone this?
    Many people engage in all of these activities, right up until licensure requirements restrict them. Are you suggesting that musicians should be evaluated and licensed by the state before they can work?
    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    So name any music that is on par with any great Music of the past, pre IPhone era.
    I could name all sorts of music that means as much to those who appreciate it as what you appreciate means to you.
    But you would only disagree, as you are not them.
    So what would be the point?

  40. #189

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    I'm willing to go with a simple definition of "pro". You can make a living at music.

    If I try to bring skill level into, I can't define it.

    How do I evaluate a brilliant player/composer who doesn't read and can't improvise, even though jazz players cover his tunes?

    Or, an absolute monster in almost every conceivable way on guitar who, when asked to play simple dance music, takes an inappropriate bop-ish solo?

    Or, Tommy Tedesco, a guitarist's guitarist, who wrote that he wasn't the right call for certain styles?

    Or, for that matter, a singer/songwriter who can barely play the guitar by certain standards, but who fills big rooms?

    Nobody can do it all. So, how do I draw a line showing who has done enough?

    I think it's impossible.

    I wouldn't have posted if I wasn't sheltering.

  41. #190
    I guess I'm sad that music is no longer an auditory experience as much as visual one mostly. And sure entertainment, especially the eye candy or circus has always been part wether it be Jimi Hendrix, etc.

    I just bemoan that actual arrangers, musicians,etc People who are actually great and have the abilities George Martin, Arif Mardin, etc. are no longer needed.
    These people and their abilities made even Pop music from Aretha, Norah Jones, Beatles ,Jeff Beck, even better!
    I haven't even mentioned Nelson Riddle, Billy May, Henry Mancini,Duke Ellington, etc.

    We are now in an almost totally narcissistic age of look at me I can do it all and sell it, so I must be great! Even the greats depended on others talents to make them their best.
    And there is a bar that was set before, that's what history does. In sports it's a fact. Art may be suggestive to taste, but I definitely tell a McDonald's Cheeseburger from a Filet Mignon. And when that no longer holds true we are all the worse off for it.

    I'm very saddened to say Music is Dead! Entertainment Won and took over completely!

  42. #191

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    The action in culture has moved to video games....

    but there’s lots of great stuff around now. Is it good as the stuff in the past? Impossible to say, the stuff from the past has been filtered by the passing years into a Pantheon of classics.

    checking out present music requires an open mind, an open heart and imagination.

    I mean I know you don’t really care, feel free go back to your enjoyable Boomer moaning.

    But I am not of the present generation, and I didn’t really appreciate a lot of the great stuff from my youth. A lot of that stuff sounds a lot better than I remember. Test of time... I think I owe it to myself to listen to what’s being done now and a lot of it is underground or just not in the cultural limelight.

    Just like always.

  43. #192
    .Can't say like always, and there in lies the problem .Will say over time music has been taken over by less knowledgeable musicians sometimes making interesting music, most time's not.

    The final death nail came with the advent of the You Tube and the Iphone. It cut out all the real interactions which make music so great. As well as plugins that do all the cleansing, and loops (legos 2 and 4 bar format) replacing drummers, bassists,etc.

    I guess like a little kid could claim being an architect amateurs can claim being musicians.
    I'm 63 and grew up in the Hendrix ,Woodstock era. And even I realize the Golden Age of Music was really the 1950's give 10 years in either direction.
    Again it goes down to real pros still coming together to make great Music.

    Show me any great song in the last 10 years,any at all,any genre? It died when the tech revolution took over. And I admit Lady Gaga is super talented but her songs are mediocre at best. Same can be said of Bruno Mars, and other younger talent.Lowest common $$$ has made it so!
    And shown people are basically clueless about appreciating the music itself from an auditory experience. Again thanks to MTV and now the Iphone and YouTube.

  44. #193

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    The difference is many people feel they are entitled to feel on par with pro musicians that have no business doing so....Why does the public and even worse other musicians condone this?
    A lot of it is the discovery of somebody new, and sharing that discovery with friends, being part of the new sensation. YouTube is a social media platform; it encourages participation by commenting and sharing. Everybody wants to be the first in their circle to know about the latest star, who is usually young and attractive. If you want musicianship, you watch videos of kids in their bedrooms pedantically copying Holdsworth solos on guitars with an odd number of strings.

  45. #194

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    As long as we're comparing eras, Woodstock was in 1969. The Billboard number one song that year was Sugar Sugar by the Archies.

    And, of all the songs in the top 100, just off the top of my head, the one I've heard the most in the last 10 years is probably Sweet Caroline.

  46. #195
    And preformed by Tommy Tedesco,Hail Blaine, Carol Kaye,etc the Wrecking Crew. Even they knew it was polishing turds musically. But they did a good job polishing a lot of them. And because they were very good at it,they were paid well!

    Again shows the public basically was ignorant to music. Nowadays we have loops that do that for people. But the turds are considered great, because it sells.
    Used to be the promoter who pushed that agenda, not the actual musicians.

  47. #196

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    " But the turds are considered great, because it sells."

    "The final death nail came with the advent of the You Tube and the Iphone. It cut out all the real interactions which make music so great."

    "We are now in an almost totally narcissistic age of look at me I can do it all and sell it, so I must be great!"

    "
    And there is a bar that was set before, that's what history does. In sports it's a fact. Art may be suggestive to taste, but I definitely tell a McDonald's Cheeseburger from a Filet Mignon. And when that no longer holds true we are all the worse off for it."

    "The difference is many people feel they are entitled to feel on par with pro musicians that have no business doing so. Why because the public doesn't care, and always say it's not brain surgery."

    "But when people especially the pros aren't paid for their services,they don't work for free."

    "My bitch is the people who think they are pros just because they are popular on Youtube,etc. If that is the new litmus test,count me out and music dead!" Jads57


    C'mon guys,
    Jads has some great lines here! I don't understand how any serious working musician could disagree. We live in a world of instant gratification and the "least common denominator" as a standard of judgment. It's infectious . . . it's endemic worldwide . . it may be irreversible. Good playing . . . Marinero





  48. #197

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I’m not in IT but even I know people get snotty about code.
    As snotty as some jazz guitarist are towards non jazz guitarist?

  49. #198

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    Watch this member of the new generation. Maybe some of you won't feel so depressed about the state of music today and the younger generation.


  50. #199
    Again agreed with level of great young players. It's the music itself that is being produced that has no real greatness or originality imo.
    Where are the Jimi Hendrix's,Jaco's, Coltrane, and this is true in every genre since the technology revolution.

    Again my contention is we live now live in the Visual Age as opposed to an Audio age when it comes to music. Also popularity is of utmost importance as opposed to actual content.
    Hard to be inventive if all you do is follow!

  51. #200

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    Quote Originally Posted by jads57
    Again agreed with level of great young players. It's the music itself that is being produced that has no real greatness or originality imo.
    Where are the Jimi Hendrix's,Jaco's, Coltrane, and this is true in every genre since the technology revolution.

    Again my contention is we live now live in the Visual Age as opposed to an Audio age when it comes to music. Also popularity is of utmost importance as opposed to actual content.
    Hard to be inventive if all you do is follow!
    Hip hop revolutionalized music. Rock music developed into different genres. I'm no expert, but it seems to me there have been massive changes in the way some types of rock or rock-influenced music are played. No blues base to the harmony, EVH and shredding styles are all innovative, whether they're to your taste or not. Funk styles are not so young anymore, but they were a revolution in the mid 60s and influenced jazz shortly thereafter.

    I can't tell what is going now which is likely to have a lasting influence in jazz. I do hear young innovative musicians. Jacob Collier leaps to mind. Dirty Loops. Some others, whose names escape me right now. Smooth jazz might turn out to have some influence. On guitar, maybe Scofield?