1. #1
    ...well, tried to be funny there with the title.

    When in major key, its no question what those seven degrees are.
    When in minor.. when in classical system, there is a strict working rule system for treating the 1st degree as 1 and every other adjusts accordingly. No way around and it all makes good sense.
    But in jazz, I can't change the thinking (even in solid minor tune) that the 1st is actually vi.. the D7 is on III, etc. And all efforts to think "properly" feels like torturing the brain for not so many good reasons.

    So, the question is - what is the harm in thinking about minor 2-5-1 as vii-III-vi instead?
    I use the minor mode patterns as major with one note sharpened. So that they are the same thing with a sharp. Which makes it even harder to forcefully change the naming of the degrees.

    Any thoughts?

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  3. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu View Post

    So, the question is - what is the harm in thinking about minor 2-5-1 as vii-III-vi instead?

    Any thoughts?
    Nothing harmful...in fact a stroke of genius, my friend. I'd make a minor change to vii-III-I6 (Barry Harris follower... I see everything in 6ths).

    Autumn Leaves is written in G6. All you have to do is remember that the iii-7 is made a seventh III7 and the tune is a complete diatonic circle.
    If you can distinguish between rehearsing and practicing...you're better than half way there!

  4. #3

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    In my opinion, any system of organization that is held by an individual and that they find helpful is a good thing.
    One proviso, problems arise when communicating with others who are grounded in an orthodox version or perhaps
    their own individually crafted vantage point.

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  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by emanresu View Post
    ...well, tried to be funny there with the title.

    When in major key, its no question what those seven degrees are.
    When in minor.. when in classical system, there is a strict working rule system for treating the 1st degree as 1 and every other adjusts accordingly. No way around and it all makes good sense.
    But in jazz, I can't change the thinking (even in solid minor tune) that the 1st is actually vi.. the D7 is on III, etc. And all efforts to think "properly" feels like torturing the brain for not so many good reasons.

    So, the question is - what is the harm in thinking about minor 2-5-1 as vii-III-vi instead?
    I use the minor mode patterns as major with one note sharpened. So that they are the same thing with a sharp. Which makes it even harder to forcefully change the naming of the degrees.

    Any thoughts?
    I reckon it is applicability. I’d suggest one of the main functions of jazz theory is unify disparate phenomena, with eventual aim that you can play the same shit on everything.

    II V I is an obvious one. Came about because people got into practicing Parker licks in all twelve keys and then by turning tunes into combinations of II V I’s you can apply language everywhere. Started in the 1950s (AFAIK) but still a very common way to teach improvisation.

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77 View Post
    I reckon it is applicability. I’d suggest one of the main functions of jazz theory is unify disparate phenomena, with eventual aim that you can play the same shit on everything.

    II V I is an obvious one. Came about because people got into practicing Parker licks
    Let me also suggest that the guitar is a serenading instrument. Any fool, who has lost his heart, can play a ii-7- V- I across EVERY fret until he finds his voice at the window of some lovely señorita.
    If you can distinguish between rehearsing and practicing...you're better than half way there!