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  1. #1
    Hey - Thought of a theory question to knock off that annoying "WGs lagging behind the beat" thread that's been up far too long: Are Dameron turnarounds simply a change in chord quality to otherwise functional harmony? I mean, is there a deeper theoretical back-fill to this move?

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  3. #2

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    it's just using related dominants to get a specific bass line
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    Aren't they tritone subs (for all but the first chord) for a 1-6-2-5 turnaround?

  5. #4
    Apologies for not being more specific. I'm asking about the iteration that uses of Major 7ths, rather than dominants.

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    Ebmaj7= Eb G B D which is b5 7 9 11 of A7

    Abmaj7= Ab C Eb G which is same as above...

    that sub plus the strong bass line makes it work imo

    Edit: for instance I use C6 (CEGA) or Cmaj7 (CEGB) over D7 all the time. This isn't the same but same idea
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    Personally, I would usually approach the thing as a minor II-V resolving to major.

    | C | Dm7b5 G7 | C

    Effectively ignoring the Eb chord... (But modally, this is fine if I anticipate a little)

    With Barry Harris we practiced outlining the progression 1-2-3-5.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrooklyn View Post
    Hey - Thought of a theory question to knock off that annoying "WGs lagging behind the beat" thread that's been up far too long: Are Dameron turnarounds simply a change in chord quality to otherwise functional harmony? I mean, is there a deeper theoretical back-fill to this move?
    So I suppose, that's a no IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TommyBrooklyn View Post
    Apologies for not being more specific. I'm asking about the iteration that uses of Major 7ths, rather than dominants.
    I wonder did anyone actually do this back in the day, or is it another RB misprint?

    Bud Powell uses bIImaj7 as a type of dominant - on Cherokee for instance. Really, one does this when the melody sits on 1 and bII7 would obviously clash with the melody. It's kind of the tritone sub for V7(sus4), if you like.

    So it's melody driven... Always is... Lady Bird doesn't require the all major 7 version as the melody sits on 5 in the relevant bit, but it wouldn't be that weird. Just a C major/C minor interchange, and then that bIImaj7 phrygian thing, Neapolitan chord, whatever you like to call it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Ebmaj7= Eb G B D which is b5 7 9 11 of A7

    Abmaj7= Ab C Eb G which is same as above...

    that sub plus the strong bass line makes it work imo

    Edit: for instance I use C6 (CEGA) or Cmaj7 (CEGB) over D7 all the time. This isn't the same but same idea

    That's a Bb in Ebmaj7, so it's the b9 of A7. The chord could be written, I suppose, as Asus7b5b9. The notes that give it the sound are mainly the Eb in the root and the D, which gives it a sus quality over the A. It also works because of the back cycling to Dbmaj7 dropping a halfstep to Cmaj7.

    C6 over D7 does work partly the same way. Usually, this is conceptualized as Am7 (same notes as C6) and it amounts, in a way, to playing Dsus9. You get the sound in a iim V7 sequence by staying on the iim even when the harmony goes to V7.