The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
Reply to Thread Bookmark Thread
Page 2 of 7 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Posts 26 to 50 of 156
  1. #26

    User Info Menu

    Studying with Steve must be great. I love his playing, his whole approach, and through him I've come to a realisation of how unique Van Eps was. I have a couple of Steve's lessons from Mike's Masterclasses - Shout Choruses and Chord Melody inspired by Van Eps.

    I thought I would start with the Method before approaching the Harmonic Mechanisms. There is an awful lot of stuff in the Method, and it will take some time not only to learn the fingerings, formations, etc, but then to find ways of using this material.

    I wonder how much Van Eps' thinking changed - if at all - between the Method and the HM?

    Anyway, those of you who are working through the Method, bring your thoughts and experience here. Let's discuss problems we might encounter, breakthroughs we have, etc, generally help each other out. Videos welcome too!

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

    User Info Menu

    Yes, studying with Steve is indeed a real privilege. I wish I could say I've been one of his better students over the past year, but I've been sidetracked with life and I often don't play and practice as much as I should. But he is super-supportive, very flexible and an all around great person. Not to mention a wicked player and a great teacher.

    I played through the 6 variations on Exercise 1 last night in all keys. I'm also a little confused by the use of the IV chord on the 6th scale degree instead of just vi, but I'll keep playing it his way and see if a lightbulb goes on at some point.

    A question for those of you playing these exercises in all keys: do you just start on the tonic for each new key? Or do you "extend" the exercise as far down (and up) the neck as is possible within the key? In other words, let's say I'm playing Ex 1 (either versions 1 or 2) in the key of Eb. Do you just start out playing the Eb major triad (fingered xxx534), or do you start lower on the neck, and include the D dim triad (fingered xxx313)? I'm doing the latter, but it wasn't clear to me from the instructions in the text what was expected.

  4. #28

    User Info Menu

    And incidentally, this stuff is going to make an excellent introduction to the HM books. It introduces his unusual string-designation system (e.g. 1/3, 2/3, 2/B3, etc.), and the overall thought process he used in conceptualizing the instrument. I hope that after we get through this "slim" volume (which is incredibly dense), we can "graduate" onto the HM books and take it to the net level.

    Steve Herberman told me once that the HM volumes are actually just a distillation of GVE's collected works, which he kept in his house in several huge stacks that extended almost floor to ceiling. It took some dedicated advocates years to distill these down into the HM books after GVE's death. Can you just imagine the sheer volume of knowledge that Van Eps had to draw on as a guitarist and musician?

  5. #29

    User Info Menu

    Wow. Scary thought.

    Regarding playing Ex1 in other keys - I started with the 'tonic' chord, but after a while I started going below it. Now I start on the tonic, go up, down, below, back up. Hope that makes sense. I'm now definitely seeing the chosen harmonies as a sequence of ii-V chords, so returning to the I is important - not life-saving important, but getting there

  6. #30

    User Info Menu

    The main reason I asked about extending the diatonic triads is that when you start getting into the HM material, that's something GVE does. It really serves to solidify those triads in the brain...not only the physical aspect (where they lie on the fretboard, the patterns, and moving smoothly from one string set to another), but the mental aspect ("OK, I'm moving from C harmonic minor to F melodic minor - what are the differences in scale tones, and how do those play out as triads in the particular place I'm at on the fretboard right now?"). Perhaps if one begins this extension of the current exercises, it will be less of a transition later.

  7. #31

    User Info Menu

    Diminished...

    Exercises 48 to 52



    Exercises 53, 55, 56 and 58 - lots of exercise in flattening your left-hand second finger...

    Last edited by Rob MacKillop; 12-16-2013 at 04:15 PM.

  8. #32

    User Info Menu

    Jeez Rob, don't you have anything better to do than sit around playing these GVE exercises all day long? :-) You're making the rest of us look bad with your rapid and thorough progress!

  9. #33

    User Info Menu

    Ha. Sorry! I can read quite well, just look through something once or twice, then get the camera out. Once I've read through the book, I plan to go back and work on various bits that interest me, find ways of using them in various contexts.

  10. #34

    User Info Menu

    Great! i think I'll start with this.

    I think we could talk about the application of this stuff in a real situation


    Thanks!

  11. #35

    User Info Menu

    Micuentita, one application of diatonic major scales is in comping. You can fill in static tonic bars with an ascending/descending diatonic line (e.g. 2 measures of IMaj7 might be replaced with Imaj7 - iim7 - iiim7 - iim7 - Imaj7). This lends some movement, and more interest, to a static harmonic section, and is especially useful behind a melody line that is held for a whole note or more. Examples are often found at the end of the different sections of many standards.

  12. #36

    User Info Menu

    Micuentita, have a look at the video I did for 7th chords above (post #9 in this thread) - I show a few ideas from chord soloing to single-notes lines derived from the chords. I only explore it a little bit, as my main point at the moment is to record many of the exercises as written.

  13. #37

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by FatJeff
    Steve Herberman told me once that the HM volumes are actually just a distillation of GVE's collected works, which he kept in his house in several huge stacks that extended almost floor to ceiling. It took some dedicated advocates years to distill these down into the HM books after GVE's death.
    You may have misunderstood him. GVE died in 1998 and was still playing in the early 1990s, at least. Harmonic Mechanisms was published by Mel Bay 1980-82 (one volume/year). The "huge stacks" is probably right, though. Take a look at the videos of Ted Greene giving lessons in his apartment and look at the background - paper everywhere.

    There is also Guitar Solos published in 1993 by Mel Bay. The last is basically the scores for eight or ten solo pieces written by GVE and a CD of him playing them (I don't know if they're for six or seven string).

  14. #38

    User Info Menu

    Rob have you looked over Eddie Lang's Fingerboard Harmony? Seems like something you might want to check out given your love of old methods, which I am beginning to share with you. It might be interesting to compare it to the GVE method.

    I have a PDF if you can't locate it and the Lang Method as well.


    Anyway these GVE videos are great, thank you.
    Last edited by mjt; 12-17-2013 at 05:07 PM.

  15. #39

    User Info Menu

    Thanks, mj (if that's what we call you) but I already have a PDF of the Lang. One book at a time! I'm sure it will be an interesting book, but maybe, just maybe, if there is life left in me after the Van Eps Method and the three volumes of the Harmonic Mechanisms, I might take a look at it!

    Enjoying reading through Van Eps' exploration of the diminished chords, which form the biggest part of his Method...more to follow.

  16. #40

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
    Thanks, mj (if that's what we call you) but I already have a PDF of the Lang. One book at a time! I'm sure it will be an interesting book, but maybe, just maybe, if there is life left in me after the Van Eps Method and the three volumes of the Harmonic Mechanisms, I might take a look at it!

    Enjoying reading through Van Eps' exploration of the diminished chords, which form the biggest part of his Method...more to follow.
    Oh boy, I can't believe you're going to tackle Harmonic Mechanisms!

  17. #41

    User Info Menu

    Can I say your vids of the Baker method have been VERY helpful

    My brother had the Van Eps book that he bough used (and old) in the late 70s. wish I still had it.

    You could make second career out of doing these books? Who is next Exploring Jazz guitar by JHall? Any Ted Greene.

    Just have to figure out how to get paid for it

  18. #42

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by jwp

    There is also Guitar Solos published in 1993 by Mel Bay. The last is basically the scores for eight or ten solo pieces written by GVE and a CD of him playing them (I don't know if they're for six or seven string).
    Is this the one? http://www.amazon.com/George-Van-Eps...+solos+van+eps

  19. #43

    User Info Menu

    All six string stuff....can be downloaded as PDF with audio tracks. Some pretty tough stuff...


    http://www.melbay.com/Products/94822BCDEB/george-van-eps-guitar-solos.aspx?classificationSId=G30!GB7

  20. #44

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by FatJeff
    Yes, I think so. I don't think I've ever actually seen it, and don't know why I had a note about it clipped to another book. Maybe because there was a CD with it and Van Eps recordings aren't all that common.

  21. #45

    User Info Menu

    I like these GVE exercises so far, very musical.

  22. #46

    User Info Menu

    Good point, Sam. Mel Bay did pay me nicely to record sound files for their classical banjo method from the 1940s. I wonder if they still own the rights to the Van Eps Method, which I know they used to publish. I'll ask.

    mj, I'm not about to start 500 videos of the HM book, but I might have a look at it...

  23. #47

    User Info Menu

    More diminished fun! I can definitely use this stuff...

    And now I have my own hard copy of the book...

    Ex.60 to 66



    67 and 68



    69


  24. #48

    User Info Menu

    Hello Everyone,
    I thought I would chime in with a few comments regarding this discussion.

    @Rob: It's a wonderful thing that you're doing here. Helping keep this material alive and in the consciousness of guitarists is most commendable.

    @FatJeff: Harmonic Mechanisms was published two decades before Van Eps' death. The distillation of GVE's lifes work work to which you refer was personally done by George and his daughter, Kay.

    The question regarding the harmonization of the sixth degree was discussed in another thread on this forum some time back. If you go to the Ted Greene website, the taped interview TG did with GVE is available for listening. Van Eps reveals why he did that.

    As for any changes in Van Eps' thinking over the years, I can't pretend to know what went on in his mind but he does stress many times throughout Harmonic Mechanisms the continued importance of triads.

    Many guitarists who have only heard GVE's mellower fingerstyle recordings from the 1960s sometimes have difficulty understanding why Van Eps was considered the BEST guitarist of his generation as well as his emphasis on the importance of triads. By listening to earlier recordings, we can hear that he possessed not only a staggering command of his instrument but also an understanding of harmony that was deeper than most of his contemporaries.

    Here is a clip of GVE playing Back Home Again in Indiana with Jess Stacy. Notice some of the things he does with triads.
    In the pickup measure he plays a Bb triad over C7 to create a C9sus4 sound followed by an Am triad for a C13 sound.
    In the first measure he plays a C triad over F for an Fmaj9 sound then a Bbm triad over Eb7.
    The second measure begins with an Am over D7 followed by a nod to the dominant seventh exercise from his method book.
    The third measure begins with a half-step slide from Ebm to Em then Fdim triad all played over G7.
    All in all, some really slick playing. I'll leave you to delve deeper into the tune as you wish.
     
    Attached Files Attached Files
    Last edited by monk; 12-18-2013 at 02:52 PM. Reason: spelling

  25. #49

    User Info Menu

    The George Van Eps Guitar Solos book from Mel Bay features a CD with all the tunes played by the late Charles Chapman not by GVE. Chapman recorded the CD after Van Eps death.

  26. #50

    User Info Menu

    Thanks, Monk. I'm enjoying the exploration.

    That's a great recording! Many thanks for uploading it. He clearly was not only a great guitar player, but clearly different from the other name players of his day. He created his own world, and it's a privilege to spend some time on the outskirts of it.