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  1. #1

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    This is my 2nd arrangement of the beautiful song Estate'---as I perform it on guitar. (I like it better than the 1st).
    Have fun!

    (Edit): I goofed and left out some changes, end of B. Today's version is corrected...
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    Last edited by joelf; 07-30-2020 at 01:03 PM.

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  3. #2
    Viva Shirley and Mr. Mandel!


  4. #3

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    Quite a song, Joelf.

    There are some very nice performances of it on Youtube. I have to be in the mood for a ballad, but on those rare occasions that I am, it fulfills my needs, that's for sure.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    Quite a song, Joelf.

    There are some very nice performances of it on Youtube. I have to be in the mood for a ballad, but on those rare occasions that I am, it fulfills my needs, that's for sure.
    I conceive it as a bossa---like most people. (Actually, Shirley's is kind of a slow, simmering bossa---she was masterful at those tempos. And Johnny, of course, framed her to perfection).

    My lead sheet is a bossa, though, alas, written in 4/4, like a true gringo. Trying to write sambas and bossas, and Afro-Cuban material (including my own) more in 2/2, or the other meters the creators write in, to honor them and learn something.

    It was a revelation seeing especially Jobim's lead sheets. (I believe many are posted on his official site). He typically wrote in 2/4 and 6/8, for just 2. Americans, with typical arrogance (and, I think, ignorance) don't even bother to do the research required to get it right---just roll right over other cultures and Americanize.

    OK, off the soapbox (:. Thanks for your comments...

  6. #5

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    If you don't mind me adding a video, this was my first exposure to the song, posted on here by member "2BorNot.." I really liked it how relaxing it was. It has that bossa rhythm...


  7. #6

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    One more


  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    If you don't mind me adding a video, this was my first exposure to the song, posted on here by member "2BorNot.." I really liked it how relaxing it was. It has that bossa rhythm...

    He's beautiful---even if the background is a bit over-saturated for my taste, Love his sound, ideas---and that ahead-into-the-next-bar phrasing is very Brasilian---listen to Elis Regina sometime.

    I was 1st drawn to Estate via Chet Baker's Live at Capolinea rendition. (I stole the G7 in my chart from that recording. And I think they use the exact chord in the exact place here).

    Always heard good things about Till Bronner. Now I know they're true...

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    He's beautiful---even if the background is a bit over-saturated for my taste, Love his sound, ideas---and that ahead-into-the-next-bar phrasing is very Brasilian---listen to Elis Regina sometime.

    I was 1st drawn to Estate via Chet Baker's Live at Capolinea rendition. (I stole the G7 in my chart from that recording. And I think they use the exact chord in the exact place here).

    Always heard good things about Till Bronner. Now I know they're true...
    You mentioned, Chet Baker. He has been my segue into more somber songs, via DB's JazzGuitar Blog videos. A whole new world to explore.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    You mentioned, Chet Baker. He has been my segue into more somber songs, via DB's JazzGuitar Blog videos. A whole new world to explore.
    Dick is a good man---and hard worker on all his various studies. We were supposed to hook up at a session he ran when I lived in Holland. Maybe I'd be featured on some things, don't quite remember. It was in another city and I never made it, but wish I did...

  11. #10

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    Love this tune, not sure where I first heard it. Possibly the recording sung by Suzanna McCorkle with Scott Hamilton and Emily Remler, I have that CD. Also the Shirley Horn CD. Pat Martino did it as well I think, got that on vinyl.

    It’s the first tune I ever recorded for the practical standards thread on the forum, 5 years ago:


  12. #11
    I'm curious: did anyone read through my sheet?

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    I'm curious: did anyone read through my sheet?
    I just did, very nice, although I usually do it in Bm, since it fits my vocal range.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    I'm curious: did anyone read through my sheet?
    Joel, I wonder how many are motivated to review the leadsheet, especially since it has been up for such a short time. I kind of think that the value in your posting that sheet is better appreciated over time, as others discover the song and want more info, eventually finding your hard work through Google or some other search engine.

    Still, I looked at it to see the basic form, and where 2-5s may be or vamps. Very enlightening from what I, with my limited skills, could decipher.

  15. #14

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    It's a wonderful song, a beautiful melody. When I was a boy I herard it from my parents or from the TV set. It was a best selling hit in the sixties, juke box stuff always on air. Your arrangement is a little different, listen to the original by Bruno Martino. It's a sad song, it talks about love, gone. There is something curious and unusual for me about this song: in summer (Estate) love and struggle happen, it's tragic, so the key and mood is minor (Odio l'estate, I hate summer). When a new winter comes with snow (Tornerà un altro inverno, cadranno mille petali rose, la neve coprirà tutte le cose, e forse un po' di pace tornerà ...) the key is major, more joyful, peaceful, 'cause now it's over and something new will begin.
    It's the right and less obvious opposite of what my fellow citizen Antonio Vivaldi did with the Four Seasons, Estate and Inverno, respectively major and minor keys. Bravo Bruno!
    I also like to play it in Em on guitar, Joao sang and played it in Bm.
    Last edited by HrundiV.Bakshi; 07-24-2020 at 02:09 AM.

  16. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by HrundiV.Bakshi


    It's a wonderful song, a beautiful melody. When I was a boy I herard it from my parents or from the TV set. It was a best selling hit in the sixties, juke box stuff always on air. Your arrangement is a little different, listen to the original by Bruno Martino. It's a sad song, it talks about love, gone. There is something curious and unusual for me about this song: in summer (Estate) love and struggle appen, it's tragic, so the key and mood is minor (Odio l'estate, I hate summer). When a new winter come with snow (Tornerà un altro inverno, cadranno mille petali rose, la neve coprirà tutte le cose, e forse un po' di pace tornerà ...) the key is major, more joyful, peaceful, 'cause now it's over and something new will begin.
    It's the right and more obvious opposite of what my fellow citizen Antonio Vivaldi did with the Four Seasons, Estate and Inverno, respectively major and minor keys. Bravo Bruno!
    I also like to play it in Em on guitar, Joao sang and played it in Bm.
    I always go to the source, when possible. This time I went through interpreters I trust.

    I don't think I had a 'happy' view of the song's minor part---though I admit I didn't know the original Italian lyric (and now that I've paid closer attention to the American lyric, it doesn't tell that story at all---pretty 'summery' imagery notwithstanding). To me, the vamp and the A section, the way I wrote them, are kind of dark. I guess you heard it not close enough, and that's cool w/me.

    It's really funny---I'm always telling people that Here's That Rainy Day is always violated for that same reason---it's a sad song, so why would the 1st chord be major? (Not to mention that vanilla I IV major ('told me about'...). That's not what Van Heusen/Burke wrote! It gets handed down b/c people never bother to go to the source. People can interpret songs any way they hear them---but IMO should give the composer (and their own desire for knowledge) that respect 1st. That's what gives license to take it more out, or whatever.

    Rainy Day was written for Sinatra, and I feel he brought the composer/lyricists' intentions the best I've yet heard (until I heard Natalie Cole's!). Wes Montgomery had a hit with a sunny Americanized bossa treatment---but I'd bet anything he knew the lyrics and original feeling of the song. He had too much heart not to.

    Back to Estate: you did me a favor. I'll think more deeply about the song, and listen to Mr. Martino's rendition, as I do with all the songs I learn and perform. But this arrangement for myself will stand---until I decide it shouldn't---LOL...
    Last edited by joelf; 07-22-2020 at 05:49 PM.

  17. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    Joel, I wonder how many are motivated to review the leadsheet, especially since it has been up for such a short time. I kind of think that the value in your posting that sheet is better appreciated over time, as others discover the song and want more info, eventually finding your hard work through Google or some other search engine.
    Good point. When it's there it's there.

    I was just curious, even at this early stage...

  18. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop
    Very nice job---in sound, relaxation of time feel, and melodicism and pacing of your ideas. Enjoyed it...

  19. #18

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    Thanks!

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    Good point. When it's there it's there.

    I was just curious, even at this early stage...
    A gift that keeps on giving...

  21. #20

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    I’ve had that Shirley Horn CD since it was released. Shirley milks that tune ever so slowly. Love it!

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by AlsoRan
    If you don't mind me adding a video, this was my first exposure to the song, posted on here by member "2BorNot.." I really liked it how relaxing it was. It has that bossa rhythm...

    That’s because someone was a trumpet player before becoming a pianist too. Estate is as good as it gets. I never tire of hearing so many different interpretations of it. I think guitarist Matt Otten is one of my favorite. Even though he takes liberties with the melody. It’s legitimately different.


  23. #22

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    Hey Joelf.... yea mentally read through, love you stories.... but your notation sucks. Just having fun... pretty normal.

    Don't really like changes... the C9's sounds out. I didn't say wrong... do you really want a review.

  24. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Reg
    Hey Joelf.... yea mentally read through, love you stories.... but your notation sucks. Just having fun... pretty normal.

    Don't really like changes... the C9's sounds out. I didn't say wrong... do you really want a review.
    Go ahead. We're friends here, right? The C9 was something I heard at the time. I worry enough w/o censoring everything, dig?

    Anyway, a lead sheet is nothing but a menu, subject to change according to what you or your co-performers hear in a live situation---or you're married to it, and that's the antithesis of creativity. It's just a snapshot of what you're feeling and hearing at the time you do it. You can use whatever of the clay you like later and chuck the rest...

  25. #24
    To expand on that a little (then yield the floor, don't want to make this about me), I went through a long phase of trying to get songs 'right' (read: honoring the composer and lyricists' intentions). I learned a lot doing that, but realized I was stifling my own voice and feelings about a song. So, moving on...

    I think we all have to look in the mirror and check what the image shows us, or not learn and grow...

  26. #25

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    I don't have it, but it appears this version of Matt's Estate is available with backing track and transcription in this book. I think they are the same as what you see on Youtube.

    Some reviewers found it to be too hard, while others embraced it. Maybe not for "rank" beginners...

    Sorry! Something went wrong!

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    Go ahead. We're friends here, right? The C9 was something I heard at the time. I worry enough w/o censoring everything, dig?

    Anyway, a lead sheet is nothing but a menu, subject to change according to what you or your co-performers hear in a live situation---or you're married to it, and that's the antithesis of creativity. It's just a snapshot of what you're feeling and hearing at the time you do it. You can use whatever of the clay you like later and chuck the rest...
    Hey joelf...yes I would like to think we're friends... we're both way to old and probable have history neither one of us can remember....

    yes... lead sheets are,(with jazz players who sight read well), just a menu, (I like that).... but typically unless I've performed with someone... I try and take notation as a menu with sides.... I don't throw in what I like until I know what the comp/arr. etc... So your intro implies... well you probable know... the voicings and bass line say a lot.
    Then you throw in C9... we're on a new menu, maybe C9sus, keep the open and not define tonal implications going. Then were back with b9's and Dim. harmonic.... traditional... but man it's just really hard to still use, but the menu's old school.... so anyway.... I could make it work and all the other BS. Your a percussionist and the form and balance of shape and use of time... all very natural and as good as it gets. You know Eliane Elias, I meet here way back... Steps ahead days.... anyway her version is cool... it's a pop tune, Toots also took the solo , although i always think of Favela when ever it was called. And yea... snap shots.... Arrangements.... I'm an arranger, composer and all the other BS.... an arrangement has it's own reference... right.

    Sorry to BS I see music and I can't help hearing what's on the page.... I did see some of you also in the other pop tune you posted. Thanks man...

  28. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    This is my 2nd arrangement of the beautiful song Estate'---as I perform it on guitar. (I like it better than the 1st).
    Have fun!

    (Edit): I goofed and left out some changes, end of B. Today's version is corrected...
    Can't change an original file here, or add one on the OP, so...
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