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  1. #1

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    This is a beautiful tune in my opinion. I bought the album in the late 60´s on a lark and was knocked out by the sax player, a little known then Wayne Shorter. At the time I didnt know Bobby Timmons either but Shorter made his mark. He wrote the tune as well. The recording quality is not the best, still there is a great feeling of freshness to the group. It is interesting how the side man, shorter, was the real main man of the album. Well,all that aside, does anyone have the changes to the tune? I can´t figure it out and have searched the net to no avail so any help with the actual changes is greatly appreciated. and if I don´t get them but have helped present a fine song to some unfamiliar with it, that is nice too.


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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    The tune is actually by Ron Carter according to Wikipedia.

    The Soul Man! - Wikipedia

    Here’s Ron’s version, the changes sound a bit clearer here.


  4. #3

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    Simplified, to me it sounds like...

    Dm7 - Em7b5 - Gm7b5 - Dm7 -> D7
    G7 - C7 - Abm7 - Db(7)
    Gbm7 - B7 - F7 - Bbm7...

    ... but there is lots going on. These guys were not fully expressing the harmony (as one might do when showing how to play something or writing a lesson book about it). Some of the harmony is suppressed - the piano a couple of times is playing "D minor" because it fits into the harmony without revealing it. Some of the harmony is misdirected - the bass on the Ron Carter video is moving the roots of some passing chords by a semitone, for example to suggest a b13th sound be heard as a 13sus4 down a half step.
    "Bent my ear to hear the tune and closed my eyes to see."

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop View Post
    The tune is actually by Ron Carter according to Wikipedia.

    The Soul Man! - Wikipedia

    Here’s Ron’s version, the changes sound a bit clearer here.

    I had not seen Carter as given the credit for the song, though I have heard Ron´s version of the song a few years ago and have completely forgotten it. The Timmons/Shorter version is quite the better of the two, invoking an airy quality I like. I will listen to it again and see if it helps me in my search of understanding its construction, an art that I was not born with.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by pauln View Post
    Simplified, to me it sounds like...

    Dm7 - Em7b5 - Gm7b5 - Dm7 -> D7
    G7 - C7 - Abm7 - Db(7)
    Gbm7 - B7 - F7 - Bbm7...

    ... but there is lots going on. These guys were not fully expressing the harmony (as one might do when showing how to play something or writing a lesson book about it). Some of the harmony is suppressed - the piano a couple of times is playing "D minor" because it fits into the harmony without revealing it. Some of the harmony is misdirected - the bass on the Ron Carter video is moving the roots of some passing chords by a semitone, for example to suggest a b13th sound be heard as a 13sus4 down a half step.

    Thanks pauln, I will have a look at your analysis. Good ear you have, I have been completely bewildered by it.

  7. #6

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    My approach to this kind of thing is simply to establish whether each chord is major, minor, or dominant. That is essentially all you need to do. You might get the occasional Diminished chord as well. If your ear can not distinguish these sounds, then that is an important skill you need to work on (in my opinion).

    By listening to the bass notes, then the chord quality (e.g. the piano) you should be able to identify the root, 3rd and 7th. That’s enough to fix the chord. Of course sometimes the bass is not on the root, so it helps to have an understanding of standard chord progressions and substitutions as well, to help ‘fill in the gaps’.

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by 0zoro View Post
    Thanks pauln, I will have a look at your analysis. Good ear you have, I have been completely bewildered by it.
    Well, the thing is really to discover if what I scribbled is close to what it sounds like to you; I'm curious to hear how it goes for you once you voice the altered chords (there are some sharp and flat nines, sharp eleven/flat five, and flat thirteen things going on I left out).

    As has been recommended, try to hear the progression roots in spite of the bass, try to distinguish major and minor in spite of the piano, and let the melody line suggest how the chords are altered.
    "Bent my ear to hear the tune and closed my eyes to see."

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by pauln View Post
    Well, the thing is really to discover if what I scribbled is close to what it sounds like to you; I'm curious to hear how it goes for you once you voice the altered chords (there are some sharp and flat nines, sharp eleven/flat five, and flat thirteen things going on I left out).

    As has been recommended, try to hear the progression roots in spite of the bass, try to distinguish major and minor in spite of the piano, and let the melody line suggest how the chords are altered.
    Oh, this sounds like I have been left with a challenge, ie get back with my own assessment! I am already shaking in my shoes. No promises. Off for the weekend but will give it a try.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by 0zoro View Post
    Oh, this sounds like I have been left with a challenge, ie get back with my own assessment! I am already shaking in my shoes. No promises. Off for the weekend but will give it a try.
    I didn't mean it as some kind of challenge to you. If you were knocked out by the song but have been completely bewildered by it for the last 50 years, I'm supposing you will be making another go at it in earnest. I'm just encouraging you to do that, anticipating your success, and hoping you relate back how that goes.
    "Bent my ear to hear the tune and closed my eyes to see."

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by pauln View Post
    I didn't mean it as some kind of challenge to you. If you were knocked out by the song but have been completely bewildered by it for the last 50 years, I'm supposing you will be making another go at it in earnest. I'm just encouraging you to do that, anticipating your success, and hoping you relate back how that goes.
    Unfortunately my dry humour doesn´t always come across over the digital. I haven´t actually been working on it for the past 50 years, and in fact only began to try to learn the guitar the most recent 5 or 8 of those, so indeed much of music, its theory and practical application is for me quite mystical. Still I will give it a shot, though it may take several more years.