The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    Anybody here work with this? My wife overheard me discussing BIB with a friend and she went out to try any buy it for me for Christmas. The store clerk told her nobody's using BIB anymore, it's bevome passe. Everyon's switching to Reason. I did a quick Google search on it and it looks like an unmitigated cluster f***. Far more than I'm looking to do.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    It looks to be more recording software than backing track program.

  4. #3

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    LOL, its an all-in-one recording/compositional program. Not so much band in a box, but a fully featured recording studio....in a box. And no, not everyone is switching to Reason....they're switching to FLStudio and Ableton Live.

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick2
    The store clerk told her nobody's using BIB anymore, it's bevome passe. Everyon's switching to Reason.
    Oh yes, I have heard that kind of answer before in many variations. That just means they tried to push it onto her because they had that and not BiaB in stock. Apart from that, it seems that "Reason" is not serving the same purpose as BiaB. "Reason" seems to be a digital recording software and not a practice tool.

    I find it really annoying when shops - not only music shops - are ridiculing or speaking badly about goods they don't have in stock in a bad attempt to push what they do happen to have.

    A few years ago, when I was caught short of a set of Chromes strings, a seemingly 16 year old boy working in our local music shop told me that flatwound strings had been out of production for many years since everybody used slinky roundwounds. He told me that flatwounds had a horrible sound and felt awful to the touch because they were way to thick. I told him that I had flatwounds on three archtop guitars as we were speaking and flatwounds were readily available on the internet. He then proceded to teach me how completely outdated and useless archtops were, but he'd be delighted to show me the latest Strat color variation which had just arrived the same morning. I could have told him that sometimes I actually played jazz on a Strat set up with 14-56 flatwounds and a blocked tremolo - but I didn't. I just said "Oh Yeah?" and left.

    The success of web shops is hardly surprising.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by oldane
    Oh yes, I have heard that kind of answer before in many variations. That just means they tried to push it onto her because they had that and not BiaB in stock. Apart from that, it seems that "Reason" is not serving the same purpose as BiaB. "Reason" seems to be a digital recording software and not a practice tool.

    I find it really annoying when shops - not only music shops - are ridiculing or speaking badly about goods they don't have in stock in a bad attempt to push what they do happen to have.

    A few years ago, when I was caught short of a set of Chromes strings, a seemingly 16 year old boy working in our local music shop told me that flatwound strings had been out of production for many years since everybody used slinky roundwounds. He told me that flatwounds had a horrible sound and felt awful to the touch because they were way to thick. I told him that I had flatwounds on three archtop guitars as we were speaking and flatwounds were readily available on the internet. He then proceded to teach me how completely outdated and useless archtops were, but he'd be delighted to show me the latest Strat color variation which had just arrived the same morning. I could have told him that sometimes I actually played jazz on a Strat set up with 14-56 flatwounds and a blocked tremolo - but I didn't. I just said "Oh Yeah?" and left.

    The success of web shops is hardly surprising.
    Well, jazz players haven't been the majority guitar purchasing market since...? When your customer base is mostly young emo/punk scene kids and aging buttrockers and blues doctors, what do you expect, lol?

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Broyale
    Well, jazz players haven't been the majority guitar purchasing market since...? When your customer base is mostly young emo/punk scene kids and aging buttrockers and blues doctors, what do you expect, lol?
    Well, he could have told me "Sorry, but we don't have them in stock because so few asks for them, but we will be happy order them for you. They will be here the day after tomorrow." If he had done that, I might even have said "Make it ten sets then". He shouldn't have implied I was an old fossil (even though I am) who didn't know a thing (IMHO, I believe I do know). He threw me right in the arms of Thomann. They never argue, has the goods in stock at fair prices and ship immediately.

  8. #7

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    Reason is mainly used for dance and electronic music as far as I know.I tried a demo version a couple of years back and quickly decided it wasn't for me.A lot of these programs come with synth,drum and bass loops that sound pretty monotonous after a while, at least for me.

  9. #8

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    Reason isn't for you. As previously stated it's mainly an electronic/Djing style music creation software and unless you have a good sound card and into learning recording software it's pretty much usless for the Jazz Guitarist.

  10. #9

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    I consider myself extremely lucky that my local music shop caters to jazz musicians. When I go into GC, there are about 11 archtops in the store, mostly Gretsch guitars and about 100 to 150 solid body guitars. One salesman hammered me on how I needed a new Les Paul to get the job done. When I go into my local shop, they have Heritage, Gibson, Hofner and Eastman archtops. They sell TI strings and know how to make repairs and do set ups. In fact, this was the shop Jimmy Raney used to go into to get his guitars worked on. I don't even know why I keep going into GC anymore.

  11. #10

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    Thanks for the replies. Pretty much confirms what I thought . . . not for me. I'll just pick up the most recent vbersion of BiaB. After what fep and wiz posted it appearst to be just what I need right now . . . in lieu of the time to actually jamm with real people.

  12. #11

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    IMOP Band-In-A-Box is a terrible program with a terrible designed interface/GUI. iReal B has a more modern feel and far better interface.

    When that is said, I also need to say that if you want a program for backing/rehearsal you still don't get a better app than BIAB when it comes down to the quality of sounds. I have both apps and in this diciplin BIAB is a clear winner.

    The latest versions of BIAB includes realtracks. This means you don't have to listen to these sterile miditracks anymore. Realtracks are played by real musicians on real instruments. The tracks are very well played, you have enough variations and they sound terrific.
    And if you only need to make an arrangment of drums, bass and piano for backing/rehearsal it's not a big deal to set up the arrangements.

    As others already have said, Reason is quite a different animal aimed mostly towards electronic music. (I wonder why the guy in the musicstore gave your wife that advice, but that's another story).

    If you really want to dip your toes into the world of digital recording I can strongly recommed Presonus StudioOne. It is both pc and mac and comes in 4 versions.
    The smallest version will cover most grounds a jazzguy needs and it comes at fair price, - it is simply free, hence the name StudioOne Free. Can be downloaded from Presonus website. (I have no stock in Presonus ;-)).
    The other/bigger versions can also be downloaded and will run as demos with no limitations for 30 days.
    Last edited by bluefonia; 12-20-2012 at 08:25 PM.

  13. #12

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    I had an older version of BiaB and hated using it. Is it a rule that music programs for musicians (not beat-makers/producers) must have crappy user interfaces? I love iRealB, though. Great, intuitive interface. Just wish it was a bit more fully featured liked BiaB.

  14. #13

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    Patrick, if you have a Mac or an iPad, the iRealB app is a must have, and it's the very simplest and best for practicing jazz standards. Listen to the last couple of recommendations and avoid BiAB. I have over 900 songs for iRealB that can be shared with you, hint hint.

  15. #14

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    Hey Roger, I've got an iPad 2. How much does the app run? It looks pretty interesting. Thanks in advance.

  16. #15

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    I use it on both my Mac (for practicing in my studio) and on my iPad (for lead sheets at the improv thing I go to). I think it was, what, $10 on the Mac and less on the iPad? Check it out in the App Store and see the latest price. It's a virtual Real Book - worth far more in practical value than what the author charges.

  17. #16

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    iRealB is also availble for Android. The app costs around $5. There are many hundreds downloadable jazz tunes available directly from your phone/tablet via the app. It doesn't have all the options of BiaB, but it's so convenient to use.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpguitar
    I use it on both my Mac (for practicing in my studio) and on my iPad (for lead sheets at the improv thing I go to). I think it was, what, $10 on the Mac and less on the iPad? Check it out in the App Store and see the latest price. It's a virtual Real Book - worth far more in practical value than what the author charges.
    Thanks Roger. I'm definitely going to get it on that iPad. Thanks also to you, oldane for that info.

  19. #18

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    I've said it before, and I'll say it again:

    BIAB is the best back-tracking and practice tool there is.

    Period.

    You can argue about shortcomings 'til the cows come home, but simply nothing changes the forementioned fact.

    HTH,

  20. #19

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    I use Propellerhead Reason.
    This is a great recording software!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak
    ........
    BIAB is the best back-tracking ........
    If you have a lot of time you can have pretty good results, that's true. BTW, if you use a multitrack recorder and record your own comping, you can even have better results and you are learning of it!

    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak
    ........
    and practice tool there is.
    Sorry, I completely disagree! There are many reasons for that, but the main reason is: the worst user interface I have seen in the last 20 years makes switching between songs and setting up the options a pain, all that what can be done in iRealb with a few touches. It is also a big advantage, that iRealb runs on a tablet. Practicing and making a backing track are not the same thing!

    Yes, it is true, that the results of BIAB can sound better, but only when you have enough time. If you only have a short time (and want to practice and nothing else) BIAB sounds often worse!

    I am both a user of BIAB and iRealb and I am a experienced programmer. My opinion is, that for me even a command line interface would be better suited than the current BIAB "graphical user interface"!

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak
    I've said it before, and I'll say it again:

    BIAB is the best back-tracking and practice tool there is.

    Period.

    You can argue about shortcomings 'til the cows come home, but simply nothing changes the forementioned fact.

    HTH,
    Agree with that.The BIAB user interface may not be the best, but you can get over that. It is the functionality and quality that counts. That's where BIAB really wins over iReal.

  23. #22

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    I have Ireal-B, BIAB, and Ableton Live. In terms of simplicity Ireal-B is hard to beat IMHO. Most other programs do a lot more than most people need. It's also frustrating to keep up with the upgrades and be bogged down with software glitches. I call it the technology trap. You almost have to be an IT ( Information Technology ) expert. The quality of the backing tracks in programs such as BIAB is only as good as your sound card unless you midi into a keyboard or sound module. Real Tracks are great but just how many do you have to buy if you enjoy playing different genre of music? I'm slowly trying to keep technology to a minimum in my music projects. It's frustrating when programs I paid good money for won't work on my new computer.

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by LtKojak
    I've said it before, and I'll say it again:

    BIAB is the best back-tracking and practice tool there is.

    Period.

    You can argue about shortcomings 'til the cows come home, but simply nothing changes the forementioned fact.

    HTH,
    I use the same half dozen of real tracks for my practice sessions. I enjoy playing with the sound of real instruments and not midi or the artificial sound of iReal. BIAB real tracks sound just fine through a normal laptop sound card.iReal is great on my iPad when I don't have my laptop, but BIAB is my first choice.By the way, I find very little diference between entering chords of a song on either application.

  25. #24

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    irealb is great , great for practice
    really quick to use , key transpose , tempo
    loads of charts (1400 +) for free
    costs almost nothing

    If you want to make half way realistic sounding tracks
    for actual performance situation then
    BIAB with real tracks is better
    but alot more time and dough commitment

    irealb works great for my needs which is practicing
    also great to take onto the gig for those moments when
    nobody can find the chart !

    so both great but fullfill different needs .... its horses for courses

  26. #25

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    I agree with pingu.

    IRealB is a simple and effective application with limited possibilities - but often just the ones that are needed.

    BandInABox is a great, powerful tool but with an exceptionally outdated and crappy user interface. And yes, it is very expensive and their version and update policies irritate me too. However, the realtracks sound really great and at least for me that makes practicing much more enjoyable (of course you can only take full advantage of the sounds if you connect the computer to a good sound system - but then it almost has the feel of being in the practice room with a (very patient) band .... Until your neighbours think so too and ask you to turn down the volume :-)). I wish i would know more about the program to also make use of the more advanced features. But even on a superficial level it works great for me.