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  1. #1

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    I grew up on his records. CTI records had a very good run until the late 70’s.

    His gatefold album jackets were some of the best ever.

    He started Impulse Records, a legendary record company.

    Would Bossa Nova have even become a thing without CT?

    He was a real visionary. There won’t ever be another jazz producer like him.

    What a good long life he had. RIP.

    First Joey, now Creed. That’s the news for jazz this week!

    Creed Taylor, legendary producer who guided and expanded jazz, dead at 93 : NPR
    Last edited by 2bornot2bop; 08-27-2022 at 01:59 PM.

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  3. #2

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    RIP. His recordings certainly rank among my favorites. Wes, Benson, Turrentine, Hubbard etc. all made great records under his production. His contribution to jazz was mighty.

  4. #3

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    He always seemed to be centered around bringing jazz to a wider audience, which had some good and bad sides to it. Because of him, as 2B said, Bossa Nova took off in the 60s.
    You're not going to find real straight ahead jazz on too many of his productions, although he would usually have some as a contrast. He started that trend on Impulse to a small extent, but then really pursued it on CTI.
    A good example of that was with the Thad Jones/Mel Lewis Band.
    He was the first producer/record label Mel went to when he wanted to put out the first TJML record. Mel knew him from Verve, and figured he'd be honored to put out the first album of the top big band in the country.

    He gave Creed a demo from the Village Vanguard, and Creed immediately turned it down, because he didn't think it was commercial enough. Mel was quite upset with him, and wound up getting the great Manny Albam's help to put it on Solid State. The rest is literally Jazz history.

    OTOH, through his use of arrangers like Don Sebesky and Deodato, he was able to get people like Wes, Turrentine, Hubbard, Washington, etc.. to expand into funk/pop tunes with strings, Latin percussion, and superior sound technology that gave Wes some of his best recorded guitar sound.
    All this gave the above mentioned jazz artists the largest audience they ever had, but others (like Mel Lewis) complained that it diluted 'real' jazz.

    The unusual thing about CTI was that it was created with the intention of featuring Ron Carter as the bedrock of the label. With that in mind, CT put out some great albums like Pure Desmond, Red Clay, and others, all featuring RC on bass.
    I loved the album Blue Moses by Randy Weston, but Weston hated the album with a passion, and has disowned it. I think it had something to do with RW playing Fender Rhodes on the whole thing.
    From the beginning CT had a unique approach to jazz. He released a few albums under his own name featuring very little improv, mostly Mood Music with names like "Shock", "Panic" and "Lonelyville", using the great composer/arranger Kenyon Hopkins and the CT Orchestra.

    In the end, I think George Benson's conclusion in his autobiography that Charlie Parker killed jazz, but people like him (and Creed Taylor) were taking Parker's innovations, and transforming them into a new type of jazz that appeals to a wider audience, would be a good way to sum up Creed Taylor's mission in jazz record production.

  5. #4

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    Please indulge me in a re-post of my comment on TGP:

    CTI launched zillions of quiet storms.
    There are probably people named "Creed" because their parents did not want to name them "Grover."


    + + +

    Creed Taylor blazed his own path. In the process he brought a lot of people along with him, including me.
    Rest easy and thanks.
    Last edited by Sam Sherry; 08-28-2022 at 10:13 AM.

  6. #5

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    Those early 70’s records with Benson and Hubbard and Turrentine are great and still stand the test of time.

  7. #6
    If CT only ever existed to produce this recording, he’d have done the world a very good thing. I’ll never forget this one. It’s so beautiful, I play it regularly.


  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Sam Sherry
    Please indulge me in a re-post of my comment on TGP:

    CTI launched zillions of quiet storms.
    There are probably people named "Creed" because their parents did not want to name them "Grover."


    + + +

    Creed Taylor blazed his own path. In the process he brought a lot of people along with him, including me.
    Rest easy and thanks.
    Legendary producer Creed Taylor passes at 93-unnamed-jpg

  9. #8

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    my local pre-set punched CTI hard and often..while RC was a jazz staple..he stretched out

    new flavors were taking shape..melodies with twists and turns..electric feel and surprise chords

    and a guitarist playing his ass off!

    formula..not quite,,but could be a precursor to formula "soft jazz"

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
    If CT only ever existed to produce this recording, he’d have done the world a very good thing. I’ll never forget this one. It’s so beautiful, I play it regularly.

    I feel exactly the same way about this one:



    45 years or so this and I'm still learning from this album.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    He always seemed to be centered around bringing jazz to a wider audience, which had some good and bad sides to it.

    The unusual thing about CTI was that it was created with the intention of featuring Ron Carter as the bedrock of the label.
    Yes totally, you know when you love something and have a passion for it, you want others to love it as well.

    In his 1947 yearbook Creed, among other things listed his hobby as music and his ambition as 'Orchestra Arranger'. I still find it mind boggling that in 7-years from Graduation, Creed did 2-years at Duke, went to Vietnam for 18-months, did another year a Duke, and produced Chris Connor...

    I'm fascinated by the claim about Carter. Yes, Taylor had envisaged having a core ensemble, of which Carter was obviously one. I've never heard that claim before and would love to know if you have any details to support it. Sadly Ron's "people" have so far declined the request for an interview.

    ++Mark. https://ctproduced.com

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    He released a few albums under his own name featuring very little improv, mostly Mood Music with names like "Shock", "Panic" and "Lonelyville", using the great composer/arranger Kenyon Hopkins and the CT Orchestra.
    This was only because in between doing the early ABC Recordings Hopkins wasn't signed to a label, but by the time these came out he was signed to Capitol Records.

    There is a whole fascinating story about Hopkins and especially around his divorce which includes using binoculars to peep on neighbors, hitting his wife and more. One day.

    If you are interested in Creed's ABC Paramount recordings, I covered them extensively here The ABC of Specialty Recording – Creed Taylor Produced (ctproduced.com)

    ++Mark.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
    Legendary producer Creed Taylor passes at 93-unnamed-jpg
    from Happy Born Day: Grover Washington, Jr. – Creed Taylor Produced (ctproduced.com) Enjoy the mix!

    ++Mark.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4mc@duck.com
    This was only because in between doing the early ABC Recordings Hopkins wasn't signed to a label, but by the time these came out he was signed to Capitol Records.

    There is a whole fascinating story about Hopkins and especially around his divorce which includes using binoculars to peep on neighbors, hitting his wife and more. One day.

    If you are interested in Creed's ABC Paramount recordings, I covered them extensively here The ABC of Specialty Recording – Creed Taylor Produced (ctproduced.com)

    ++Mark.
    Do you recommend buying the re-issue of a lot of KH's stuff called "Rooms in NY", a kind of NYC album that was reissued by the Brits.:
    Sorry! Something went wrong!
    Hopkins is a complete cypher to me, and you seem to know a bit about him. Is there anywhere I can read about him?

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4mc@duck.com
    Yes totally, you know when you love something and have a passion for it, you want others to love it as well.

    In his 1947 yearbook Creed, among other things listed his hobby as music and his ambition as 'Orchestra Arranger'. I still find it mind boggling that in 7-years from Graduation, Creed did 2-years at Duke, went to Vietnam for 18-months, did another year a Duke, and produced Chris Connor...

    I'm fascinated by the claim about Carter. Yes, Taylor had envisaged having a core ensemble, of which Carter was obviously one. I've never heard that claim before and would love to know if you have any details to support it. Sadly Ron's "people" have so far declined the request for an interview.

    ++Mark. https://ctproduced.com
    I'm really not sure where I read it, but one possibility was in that book about Impulse Records at the library. I subscribed to your fascinating website, and predict that another guy I know online will subscribe tomorrow when he gets the link I sent him to your site.
    He's got an obsession with CT and KH being the creators of what he calls "Jet Set Music".
    I'm more fascinated with the great film music Kenyon did for movies like The Hustler, Lillith, and other projects he worked on that featured the great Phil Woods

  16. #15

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    "I'm more fascinated with the great film music Kenyon did for movies like The Hustler, Lillith, and other projects he worked on that featured the great Phil Woods"

    Me too, took me years and years to find a playable copy of The Hustler soundtrack, and Lilith is great too. Probably much easier to find since ebay etc
    For me my favorite soundtrack is probably the Hustler, though I like Lalo Schiffren's Cool Hand Luke too.
    Must be a coincidence that they're 2 of my all time fave flicks too.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by wintermoon
    "I'm more fascinated with the great film music Kenyon did for movies like The Hustler, Lillith, and other projects he worked on that featured the great Phil Woods"

    Me too, took me years and years to find a playable copy of The Hustler soundtrack, and Lilith is great too. Probably much easier to find since ebay etc
    For me my favorite soundtrack is probably the Hustler, though I like Lalo Schiffren's Cool Hand Luke too.
    Must be a coincidence that they're 2 of my all time fave flicks too.
    What I find incredible about CHL's theme song, DHOTG, is what Wes, Herbie and Eumir Deodato did with it. From a folk song thing for acoustic guitars, they made it into a jazz classic.
    The rocker from Texas, Eric Johnson has a live recording of it on you tube, where he not only plays Wes' interpretation of it note for note, but also plays Deodato's arr. of it, Herbie's fills, and even Wes' solo on it- note for note!
    Benson did a funk abortion of it which I had to play in a band I used to play in. Thank God the vocalist gave it up after a few gigs.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    Do you recommend buying the re-issue of a lot of KH's stuff called "Rooms in NY", a kind of NYC album that was reissued by the Brits.:
    Sorry! Something went wrong!
    Hopkins is a complete cypher to me, and you seem to know a bit about him. Is there anywhere I can read about him?
    Brit' here, well not anymore since I became a US Citizen last year ;-)

    The second CD in that set is a bit cheezy with the sound effects thrown in. It was quite a success at the time and was the first album that used a picture from the then unknown photographer, Pete Turner. It was such a success at the time, they went on and did the "Sound Tour Series" on Verve with Esquire magazine. There were tours of Spain, Italy, France & Hawaii with a compilation/sampler/promo album given to dealers.

    The musicianship is fine, but I find them all a bit contrived. I have all five, and two of them on reel to reel tape. They are though a great statement of the times. Apart from his time in the Royal Engineers, my parents never left the UK until 1972, most Americans couldn't fly across the country, much less across the world, so these were somehow "exotic".

    You can sample most of these albums on the Internet Archive. Internet Archive Search: creator:"Kenyon Hopkins" While at it this Creed Taylor Orchestra album is available for "download" from the archive until correctly classified. https://archive.org/compress/lp_ping-pang-pong-the-swinging-ball_the-creed-taylor-orchestra/formats=VBR%20MP3&file=/lp_ping-pang-pong-the-swinging-ball_the-creed-taylor-orchestra.zip

    Like you I prefer his soundtrack albums, a favorite being Mister Buddwing (Sountrack). Also "This Property Is Condemned - Original Sound Track Album" contains a relatively unknown, uncredited track by Astrud Gilberto. Happy Birthday – Astrud Gilberto – Creed Taylor Produced (ctproduced.com)


    I'm not aware of any written material, I have a lot of research notes and plan to write something when I can. As far as I'm aware, the last thing he recorded was the music to a 1970 ABC News documentary, which according to my notes included "an underwater rock session in which Jack Cousteau's divers and crew demonstrate how they entertain themselves during long arduous months at sea. Among the Hopkins soundtrack is a jazz-rock version of the "Camptown races" with new words by the sailors and divers on the show."

    Legendary producer Creed Taylor passes at 93-the_montgomery_advertiser_fri__may_16__1969_-jpgBefore that, he did the soundtrack for the 1968/9 film "A Lovely Way To Die" featuring Kirk Douglas and Eli Wallach. The film was released, and Jackie Wilson sang the title song, but an album was never available.

    I wanted to research both these things before writing anything substantial about him. I'll get back to it one day.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4mc@duck.com
    As far as I'm aware, the last thing he recorded was the music to a 1970 ABC News documentary, which according to my notes included "an underwater rock session in which Jack Cousteau's divers and crew demonstrate how they entertain themselves during long arduous months at sea. Among the Hopkins soundtrack is a jazz-rock version of the "Camptown races" with new words by the sailors and divers on the show."
    Turns out this is on youtube, the full episode.

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by 4mc@duck.com
    Brit' here, well not anymore since I became a US Citizen last year ;-)

    The second CD in that set is a bit cheezy with the sound effects thrown in. It was quite a success at the time and was the first album that used a picture from the then unknown photographer, Pete Turner. It was such a success at the time, they went on and did the "Sound Tour Series" on Verve with Esquire magazine. There were tours of Spain, Italy, France & Hawaii with a compilation/sampler/promo album given to dealers.

    The musicianship is fine, but I find them all a bit contrived. I have all five, and two of them on reel to reel tape. They are though a great statement of the times. Apart from his time in the Royal Engineers, my parents never left the UK until 1972, most Americans couldn't fly across the country, much less across the world, so these were somehow "exotic".

    You can sample most of these albums on the Internet Archive. Internet Archive Search: creator:"Kenyon Hopkins" While at it this Creed Taylor Orchestra album is available for "download" from the archive until correctly classified. https://archive.org/compress/lp_ping-pang-pong-the-swinging-ball_the-creed-taylor-orchestra/formats=VBR%20MP3&file=/lp_ping-pang-pong-the-swinging-ball_the-creed-taylor-orchestra.zip

    Like you I prefer his soundtrack albums, a favorite being Mister Buddwing (Sountrack). Also "This Property Is Condemned - Original Sound Track Album" contains a relatively unknown, uncredited track by Astrud Gilberto. Happy Birthday – Astrud Gilberto – Creed Taylor Produced (ctproduced.com)


    I'm not aware of any written material, I have a lot of research notes and plan to write something when I can. As far as I'm aware, the last thing he recorded was the music to a 1970 ABC News documentary, which according to my notes included "an underwater rock session in which Jack Cousteau's divers and crew demonstrate how they entertain themselves during long arduous months at sea. Among the Hopkins soundtrack is a jazz-rock version of the "Camptown races" with new words by the sailors and divers on the show."

    Legendary producer Creed Taylor passes at 93-the_montgomery_advertiser_fri__may_16__1969_-jpgBefore that, he did the soundtrack for the 1968/9 film "A Lovely Way To Die" featuring Kirk Douglas and Eli Wallach. The film was released, and Jackie Wilson sang the title song, but an album was never available.

    I wanted to research both these things before writing anything substantial about him. I'll get back to it one day.

    Thanks for reminding me of another great Creed prod., the album where he got Stanley Turrentine and Astrud Gilberto together, along with some great arrangements by Deodato. It's more consistent that the other ST album he did (other than the title track), and has fine work by ST and AG.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by sgcim
    What I find incredible about CHL's theme song, DHOTG, is what Wes, Herbie and Eumir Deodato did with it. From a folk song thing for acoustic guitars, they made it into a jazz classic.
    The rocker from Texas, Eric Johnson has a live recording of it on you tube, where he not only plays Wes' interpretation of it note for note, but also plays Deodato's arr. of it, Herbie's fills, and even Wes' solo on it- note for note!
    Benson did a funk abortion of it which I had to play in a band I used to play in. Thank God the vocalist gave it up after a few gigs.
    What is DHOTG? I thought the theme song was just entitled Main Title or something like that?

    Great song, which fits in with a lot of the movie music of the era which emphasized major 6/7s and descending figures, i.e., Midnight Cowboy, Summer of ‘42, etc. Those songs create a sense of wistfulness, which is so much a part of what I remember and appreciate about those movies.

  22. #21

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  23. #22

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    So much music produced by Creed Taylor has been a huge part of my musical development and pure enjoyment as a listener - the Bossa stuff, Jim Hall's Concierto, Pure Desmond, all the Wes and Benson stuff on CTI, A&M, and Verve - even the Deodato and Grover Washington records, and many others...

    I started a thread linking to a story I published on Medium highlight some great jazz records on CTI:

    My Medium Story featuring Five Great Jazz Guitar Albums on CTI Records

    Here's a direct link to the story:
    RIP Creed Taylor: Five Great Jazz Guitar Albums on CTI Records

  24. #23
    Max, what a great read! 3 of those are some of my favorites! Concierto, was one hot album. Everyone on the album brought the smoke!

    I’d read the story of Wes and the string section. But that only displayed the respect he had for classically trained musicians. Sebesky made it work. And those albums would bring Wes to the world. And finally brought him a living! So, get over the fact that he’s not being true to his jazz roots.

    And Wes did have a marvelous smile!

    But I’m afraid my favorite movie track album was Lalo’s Bullitt!


  25. #24

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    A tune I wrote a few years ago, inspired by Kenny, CTI, and the God Bless the Child album:

    Last edited by maxsmith; 09-01-2022 at 10:26 PM.

  26. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by maxsmith
    A tune I wrote a few years ago, inspired by Kenny, CTI, and the God Bless the Child album
    Hey Max, that’s exceptionally good. You should do more writing!