Reply to Thread Bookmark Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Posts 51 to 73 of 73
  1. #51

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by takefive
    No guitars, but it's great for jamming along to.
    Grant Green with Sonny Clark.




  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #52

    User Info Menu

    that's the spirit.

  4. #53

    User Info Menu


  5. #54

    User Info Menu

    longest trading of 12 in jazz?


  6. #55

    User Info Menu

    The ratio of hard bop guitarists to saxophonists or trumpet players is (or was) at least 1/5.

    Hard bop is more about drums and the rhythm than anything imo. You could take any good guitar player and put them in a session with Art Blakey and it'd be hard bop guitar.

  7. #56

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by arielcee
    The ratio of hard bop guitarists to saxophonists or trumpet players is (or was) at least 1/5.

    Hard bop is more about drums and the rhythm than anything imo. You could take any good guitar player and put them in a session with Art Blakey and it'd be hard bop guitar.
    I refute your statement thus (sorry for
    the repeat post, but people aren’t listening to it and they NEED TO BE TOLD.):



    I cannot imagine Johnny Smith, Jim Hall, Jimmy Raney or any of those - or even Wes - thinking to play this way. It’s just - raw.

  8. #57

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I refute your statement thus (sorry for
    the repeat post, but people aren’t listening to it and they NEED TO BE TOLD.):



    I cannot imagine Johnny Smith, Jim Hall, Jimmy Raney or any of those - or even Wes - thinking to play this way. It’s just - raw.
    absolutely. it's is playing like lee morgan/hank mobley. guitarists usually dont play off drummers like grant. thats why elvin and blakey loved him. and thats also why he spoils you for most of those other guitar players.


  9. #58

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    You wot m8?


    I suppose horn singular. But Green was basically a horn.
    As for horn singular, Kenny Burrell with Stanley Turrentine made quite a pairing.



    And here's a great outing with trumpet (Freddie Hubbard) and flute (Hubert Laws)


  10. #59

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Neon Scribe
    "Hard bop" was a label used to contrast with "cool jazz".

    Cool jazz was mostly West Coast, L.A.-based, while hard bop was East Coast, N.Y.-based.

    Subtext was that the L.A. scene was a lot whiter than the N.Y. scene.

    Cool jazz had more prominent guitarists, including Johnny Smith, Barney Kessel, and Jim Hall.
    I think of Joe Pass as the hard bop guitarist par excellence. Herb Ellis too. Barney Kessel, probably, but he was also a bit earlier. Mundy Lowe. How about Chuck Wayne- or was he more a bebopper? I have not heard a lot of him.

    I think of Johnny Smith as cool jazz- although he was New York based for the best-known parts of his career and was never really a West Coast-er. He was never a bebopper as such, although Charlie Parker was a fan of his. Seems like there was always a cool jazz sensibility to JS, even when he was playing on the New York scene at Birdland, etc. He usually denied being a jazz musician as such, noting that he played too much non-jazz to be a jazzer. I don't think anyone believed him. The Roost recordings are marvelous documents and there are a couple of live sets from his later years as a performer on YouTube. After he moved to Colorado, he referred to it as "being as far away from New York as you can get without being too close to Los Angeles." There is always debate about how much his solos were worked out in advance; I think that he had arrangements worked out but that solos tended to be improvised even when they sounded planned. He had a great ear and a huge harmonic vocabulary that was pretty pianistic.

    Jim Hall first rose to prominence with Chico Hamilton and then Jimmy Guiffre, but most of his career was New York based. His first solo album in 1957 is straight ahead bebop/hard bop- one can be forgiven for thinking it's Tal Farlow or Jimmy Raney at first. It sounds almost nothing like the rest of his body of work. One of my very favorite jazz guitarists, like most of us here. He had his own sensibility that was so personal and seemingly free of artifice.

    Ed Bickert might have been a cool jazz player. Not a hard bopper by any means.

    Was George Van Eps a cool jazzer? To my ears he seemed to exist outside of those movements and played his own thing, more swing than bop.

  11. #60

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Cunamara
    I think of Joe Pass as the hard bop guitarist par excellence. Herb Ellis too. Barney Kessel, probably, but he was also a bit earlier. Mundy Lowe. How about Chuck Wayne- or was he more a bebopper? I have not heard a lot of him.
    joe pass has played in some hard-boppish settings with les mccann and groove holmes. the others you mention are at least a whole generation away from the hardboppers, musically speaking, and are not usually associated with this style of music. i wouldnt even call ellis a bopper.

  12. #61

    User Info Menu

    For me hard bop is so closely associated with Blue Note it can be hard to separate the two.

    But that soul jazz/bluesy/churchy/heavy swinging/groove jazz late 50s/early 60s is always what I associate with hard bop. Influenced by bebop, sure, but less.... frilly? Complicated?

  13. #62

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I refute your statement thus (sorry for
    the repeat post, but people aren’t listening to it and they NEED TO BE TOLD.):



    I cannot imagine Johnny Smith, Jim Hall, Jimmy Raney or any of those - or even Wes - thinking to play this way. It’s just - raw.
    Sure, Grant may be the Epitome. Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it couldn't happen.

  14. #63

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by arielcee
    Sure, Grant may be the Epitome. Just because you can't imagine it doesn't mean it couldn't happen.
    not in this universe.

  15. #64

    User Info Menu

    Why doesn't Jimmy Raney get any votes here? Wikipedia lists hard bop as one of his music genres.

  16. #65

    User Info Menu

    Jimmy Raney! absolutely --very modern player at the time!

  17. #66

    User Info Menu

    How about this guy? Bill D'Arango. Listen to Dizzy Gillespie's recording of 52 Street. theme. If you type into the browser Dizzy Gillespie 52 Street Theme, it's the first one up. The solo is crazy good.

  18. #67

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    GRANT GREEN

    (also there was a guy called Wes something?)

    No bloody Easter eggs for you, a damn cheek, snarky quips about my Wes

  19. #68

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by jazzimprov
    Jimmy Raney! absolutely --very modern player at the time!
    I love Raney, but no.

  20. #69

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I love Raney, but no.
    I agree—Raney is a classic bebop player. If there is a distinction between bebop and hard bop, Raney would be the baseline standard for bebop, I would think.

    Says a guy who still isn’t quite sure what “hard bop” or “post bop” even mean.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  21. #70

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I refute your statement thus (sorry for
    the repeat post, but people aren’t listening to it and they NEED TO BE TOLD.):


    I cannot imagine Johnny Smith, Jim Hall, Jimmy Raney or any of those - or even Wes - thinking to play this way. It’s just - raw.
    A complete head swivel, that is just something else, you are 101% spot on, dont think i have heard anything with that groove for ages, Wes move over. I always liked Grant, i have a couple things that i am not fond of. But its the same for Barney K , there are many records not that great simply because both record a lot and have many many dates/sessions etc


    This is IT. Raw sloppy, yet fresh inventive lots of cliche phrases that just sound killer. Sounds like John Lewis piano.

    This is the game changer is that In your own sweet way piano quoting 7.36- 7.42, When Grant returns 8.32 that guitar is so distorted, it sounds incredible all up to 8.42 then sounds like Blakey drums kick. I dont think i have been so excited in a track for a while. I finally get it.

    As Pappa Lazarou . said You're My Wife Now!



  22. #71

    User Info Menu

    It’s actually from the Complete Grant Green quartets with Sonny Clark on piano. Blakey is on drums.

    Wonderful stuff, one of my favourite Grant Green CDs:

    The Complete Quartets with Sonny Clark - Wikipedia

  23. #72

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop
    Hell yeah, tonight I’m going to pour myself a large scotch and listen to the rest of the CD!

    Great photo of Pat on the CD cover:

    Attachment 70506
    That album is smokin!

  24. #73

    User Info Menu

    2Bop! Hey man! Sunny in the hood!