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he had the ability to realize his limitations yet remain completely in the real time groove...so that even when he was technically challenged he remained sweet and in the moment...and that...soul...got him thru
an early example-
elevator to the gallows (usa title) soundtrack
later he did it with jack johnson..and began his electric era..which was still much about that ^ same ethic
i'd put the great chet baker and even obscure tony fruscella in there..but they were miles disciples..he was first
cheers
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03-13-2020 07:23 PM
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I have read that that is a great movie (Ascenseur). I want to see it.
Originally Posted by neatomic
Miles could play his a$$ off. Any limitations he might have had, or maybe just a desire not to compete in the arena of which bebop artist can blow the hardest, led him to create his own sound and move in so many fruitful directions creatively.
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Like so many musicians, Miles used his horn to embody all that he was unable to be in the rest of his life. I recently listened again to Sketches of Spain after not hearing it for years. Man, what complete and total brilliance in Gil Evan's writing and what humanity in Miles horn playing! Love, pain, yearning, joy, sadness .... it's all there coming out of his trumpet. In general, I need Miles in small doses and for everyday listening, give me Paul Desmond with Jim Hall.
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One of my favourite films. Superb music throughout by all the musicians, but particularly Miles, who was treated with great respect in Paris, in contrast to what he got at home. But do seek out the film, it's a classic.
And...I'm in love with Jeanne Moreau
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Yes me too, I have a copy I recorded off the telly once, in fact I watched it again a few weeks ago!
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If you have a chance, watch the four DVDs of "JAZZ" by Ken Burn, 12 épisodes about the history of jazz music. Blues, New Orleans, Chicago, Swing, Bebop, Cool, Free, Fusion, etc ..
Miles begins to appear in Episode 9, I guess
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The whole movie's on youtube...
OK just checked & c'est disparu
merde...
'tis a great film, Louis Malle said lots of people heard the music first & then wanted to see the film - lines round the block...
I listen to music Miles made from every decade of his career but if I had to pick one period it'd be this one - the 2 volume Blue Note sessions from '52 - 54
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1st half only, with some music at least around 44:00 (didn't check all of it) Ascenseur pour l'Echafaud - 1958 ( 1ere Partie ) - Video Dailymotion
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Great. But what does the French guy say at the end? Originally Posted by grahambop
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'what was that? Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
'That was Miles Davis improvising to footage from my film Ascenseur pour l'echafaud'
Louis Malle himself...
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I admire Miles and enjoy a lot of his work, but greatest? It's a subjective judgment, I know, so it's probably fruitless to argue aobut, but I would place at least three horn players above Miles: Louis Armstrong, Charlie Parker, and John Coltrane. But that's me. And I don't want to rag on Miles. He was a rare and precious talent.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
i didnt mean literally "the greatest"..as music is not competition...but used it more in the beat sense...as in that cats the greatest!
i would say, that miles has probably influenced the way modern/current trumpet players play more than just about anyone else since he started recording...just like louie A had previously in his generation
cheers
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Which guitar players did he influence the most? I hear him in Jim Hall and Scofield - that ability to choose the right note at the right time, that can turn a composition down a different track. Every. Note. Mattered.
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frisell!!...uses silence and tone as much as notes..very miles Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
cheers
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Turner Classic Movies (TCM), will be showing Elevators to the Gallows on Saturday, March 21st at 12:00 Am EDT (USA).
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Well he influenced every guitar player who played with him. McLaughlin is particularly laudatory toward Miles. Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
I would say that at least to my ears I don’t hear a lot of Miles in their playing though. They seem to have developed their own thing when they were with Miles and then did that, rather than copying Miles.
You could say that about most people who played with Miles. Coltrane...Wayne Shorter...Chick...Herbie...Zawinul...
A contrast that comes to mind is James Blood Ulmer, who became a disciple of harmelodics when he played with Ornette Coleman and carried that forward for a couple of decades.
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What's exactly happening ? (unknown speaker) Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
Well, that's the American musician Miles Davis improvising along with watching my movie, Elevator to the Gallows (reply by Louis Malle, the movie Director)
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there is so much miles davis recorded music , that has huge value today
i can only speak for myself , but, four and more, miles smiles, milestones (trane, garland, chambers , jones), esp, stuff i cant call the name , i just dont practice with it as much, also stuff with bird and bish and what that era represents, all that stuff is a big teacher for me right now. i put those cuts on to line up my swing feel , using the differant eras to change styles , and it really tightens me up and centers me . they are massive teachers , right up into today.
but, other people may be tuned into the other miles eras .great players with him also didnt get the shot they deserved, garland, kelly come to mind...do people know how incredable paul chambers is?
its his players, special players who all were heading in those directions and laid it down and that is what miles wanted. each era had differant players, some were super groups, some were super arrangers , from gil evans to marcus miller
miles could pull them together, and , then to have trane launch his career, off that, most of the people from kind of blue , evans, adderly , most from the tony ron herbie wayne, most from the chick jack dave
just the value of having some cuts from his arquive that i can practice to and still be learning from ,pays for itself many times over
i think they will be talking about miles in 200 years...?? hopefully with his colleagues contributions recognised also...they are gigantic, many sluffed over for a free er , more about self expresion aproach than the discipline those groups took it to, that stuff was really deep
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It is like Miles always had better overall view of bigger picture, than anybody else in his surroundings. He provided tge context
Music performers produced arguably better result in context, when as contractors they played with Miles, trying to please him, then when they played in self directed projects.
In that documentary, someone cited him, something like: "... I'll take care about public/ audience, you just play ..."
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Soul.
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In my mind, one of Miles' biggest contribution to jazz was his profound conceptual influence on his own groups, and then the dominating effect his sidemen had on the jazz world when they started their own groups, and continues on exponentially through their sidemen. Modern jazz history was hugely shaped by Miles Davis alumni. Nobody else comes close.
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I can see the appeal of this framework, though I think there is a difference between the big band days (Basie, Ellington, et al) and the small-group days. John Coltrane and Cannonball Adderley were not "sidemen" in the sense of filling out a band. They were major players in their own right. Same for Bill Evans, Sonny Rollins, et al. Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo
It's not like Miles taught them how to play, or even shaped the way they played---they didn't play like him at all. Sonny's still going and he never sounded anything like Miles and his conception is nothing like that of Miles. Same for Coltrane. Same for Cannonball...
One could say that what Miles brought forth was the group that didn't have sidemen---everyone was a featured player, everyone could hold his own and contribute a unique voice. (I wouldn't say he was the first to do that but I think someone might argue that point.)
This may be in part because Miles needs a great band to make himself sound good. Sonny Rollins can sound great all by himself. (Hard to do on a horn but he has done it.)
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All this tells me is that you don't enjoy Miles as a trumpet player. He was Sonny's equal and more, so said Sonny. Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
Last edited by cosmic gumbo; 03-17-2020 at 03:19 AM.
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I think he just meant that Sonny could (and did) play beautifully unaccompanied. Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo
I love Miles playing but he benefits from having a band behind him. Other than some brief passages in some of his middle works...In a Silent Way? Jack Johnson? He rarely plays unaccompanied.
Unless there are some recordings I’m not aware of.
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