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The main reason I picked up jazz guitar is to try out for my school's jazz band. Now, this is much more big band than combo- somewhere around fifteen horns, drums, keys, bass, and two guitarists.
Now, obviously there are plenty of people I could be listening to for solo guitar or in a small combo context. What I want is essential guitarists or recordings for somebody playing guitar in a mostly-rhythm context. I'll be lucky to get more than one solo per gig, so that's more important to me than studying the ins and outs of Wes or Joe Pass, at least right now. I know Freddie Green is the obvious start, but who else should I be hearing?
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05-22-2011 09:58 AM
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Check out the following rhythm players besides Freddie.
Allan Reuss, Freddie Guy, Bucky Pizzarrelli (he's all over you tube), John Pizzarrelli, Danny Barker. That's all I can remember now. There are a lot more good players that do rhythm guitar correctly. I'll see what I can find and add to the list.
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Check out Ranger Doug with Riders in the Sky. He plays very much in the Freddie Green style, but because it's a small band, his playing is much more audible.
Brad
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Check out some of the modern guys doing the "gypsy jazz" thing too. Better recordings than with django, so you can hear what's going on.
I highly reccommend a record by adrien moignard called "selmer #607"
All the other advice in this thread is great, and +100 on bucky. Check out a record he did with scott hamilton called "behind the red door." You can really here his rhythm chops there, as well as on a record called "Sunday at pete's"
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Nice pointers Mr. B. Here's the amazon links to the CDs you were talking about. Looks like the first one can be had for a song:
Amazon.com: The Red Door (...Remember Zoot Sims): Scott Hamilton, Bucky Pizzarelli: Music
Amazon.com: Sunday at Pete's: Pizzarelli Boys: Music
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To the OP (Hot Ford knows it already):
Originally Posted by hot ford coupe
Al Casey and Carmen Mastren are two more who come to my mind. But there were hundreds if not thousands of them in US in the big band days. For all of those players, you will want to seek out prewar recordings, as most of them switched to electric guitar during the 40's. Of course, that doesn't apply to Freddie Green who continued to play acustic rhythm guitar with the Basie orchestra until his death, 75 years old. He thus was constantly exposed for many years - also in later years when recording technique had improved - and therefore he is by far the easiest one to study on records. In contrast, Alan Reuss, who was also an excellent rhythm guitarist, can be difficult to hear clearly on say the Goodman records. BTW, Freddie Green took lessons from Alan Reuss back in the 30's.
Don't expect to become sounding just like Freddie Green. He used a highly ideosyncratic technique which included a gruelsome instrument setup with a string action about ½" at the 12th fret. In later years, he used one and two note chords, sometimes with other notes half muted/half sounding, sometime with strings buzzing against his calloused fingers. To this day people are puzzled and discuss what he did and how.
Personally, I have found the following book very helpful: Amazon.com: Swing and Big Band Guitar: Four-To-The Bar Comping in the Style of Freddie Green (0073999951479): Charlton Johnson: Books
You may also find the following web site helpful: The Freddie Green Web SiteLast edited by oldane; 05-22-2011 at 12:08 PM.
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Power Guitar by Bucky is supposed to be great for this style too
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ARRRRRGGGHHHH !!! How could I have forgotten Ranger Doug, Carmen Maestren and Al Casey. They're some of my favorite rhythm guys. Oh, my memory doesn't seem to be like it was. There are some great Ranger Doug clips on YouTube as well as a few good ones of Freddie Green. Also, Ranger Doug has a book out showing the chord forms and progressions. It's a really good investment. Don't forget to check out Freddie Green's site. http://www.freddiegreen.org/index.html There are a number of good recordings as well as lessons and transcriptions. http://www.classicjazzguitar.com/artists/artists.jsp Is another good site. There are some good recordings here too.
As an aside, Carmen Maestren was the guitarist for Glenn Miller's USAAF band during the War. There's a picture of him in his uniform with the band holding a big old Epiphone Emperor. That's one reason I held onto my Emperor as long as I did. Selling that guitar was the dumbest thing I ever did second to marrying my first wife.Last edited by hot ford coupe; 05-22-2011 at 12:58 PM.
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Here are a few more.
Al Hendrickson, Teddy Bunn, Bernard Addison,
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Ah yes, Teddy Bunn. He was with John Kirby, and he also recorded with Edmund Hall. He played with his thumb like Wes Montgomery. And then there was Clarence Holiday who played with Fletcher Henderson for a while - and was the father of Billie Holiday. Originally Posted by hot ford coupe
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Jim Hall is a great rhythm guitarist, probably my favorite, locks in well with Ron Carter and comped well with Bill Evans, not to mention his other work.
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I'm certainly not going to be duplicating his exact style- for one, I'll be playing electric, or very rarely an amplified electric-acoustic if the circumstance calls for it. But his role as a rhythm player in a big band setting is important to me. Originally Posted by oldane
I'm ashamed I forgot about Bucky. I had an opportunity to see him once but couldn't make it to the venue because of heavy storms- I regret not risking it to this day.
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If you're playing in a big band context, I'd be careful about getting into the gypsy style rhythm playing too much. While the gypsy style players are awesome rhythm players I think you'll find their gypsy style "pomp" rhythm style does not really fit the traditional big band style rhythm playing. I used to play in big bands for a long time, I had one leader who always used to give me grief if I ever put in an upstroke while doing a 4 to the bar Basie type tune. He said Freddie Green never used an upstroke, and of course he was right. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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But the voicings are gold.
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That's for sure!! Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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Some were named above, but here is a quick list of some of my favorite rhythm keepers (besides Freddie Green):
Marty Grosz
Bucky Pizzarelli
(Ranger) Doug Green
Tony Marcus
Mike Dowling
Kathie Cavera
Homer Haynes
Al Casey (with Fats Waller and also his own very few recordings)
Oscar Moore
John Collins
Teddy Bunn (especially, but not exclusively, his work with The Spirit Of Rhythm)
Howard Alden
John Pisano
EDIT: Of course I could have added Eddie Lang, Carl Kress and Dick McDonough but they are clearly from another era and their playing may or may not be relevant for the original poster.Last edited by Eddie Lang; 05-23-2011 at 06:09 PM.
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George Van Eps with Adrian Rollini, Benny Goodman, Ray Noble and countless Hollywood recording sessions with Peggy Lee, Frank Sinatra, Sarah Vaughn, Paul Weston, Hoagy Carmichael, Rosemary Clooney and others.
He was also Allan Reuss' guitar teacher.
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Van Eps taught Allan Reuss? Oh man, he did a great job.
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Van Eps taught Reuss who later gave lessons to Freddy Green.
When Van Eps left the Goodman band for Ray Noble, he persuaded BG to hire Reuss.
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Will you look at that. That's the kind of history I love to see. I wish one of them could have taught me. At least I have the Van Eps book series. Originally Posted by monk
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Art Ryerson as well, and Kenny Burrell plays some great slightly-amplified rhythm guitar with Jimmy Smith, check out Satin Doll on Organ Grinder Swing.
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I checked out both Jimmy Smith/Kenny Burrell cuts and they're definitely worth listening to. Both rhythm parts are clean and well done. I still have to listen to Art Ryerson. Originally Posted by ronjazz
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