Herbie Hancock - Let me in on your secrets!!

**JonnyPac** · 04-06-2011, 05:36 PM

Hey guys, I think Herbie Hancock had some of the best ears and chops in the 20th century. Now, I want to know if any of you know much about how he did what he did musically (in the 60's especially). His recordings as a leader and sideman and so flipping amazing and fresh sounding to this day... If I played piano, I'd be going nuts trying to figure it out.

Have any of you worked his methods onto the guitar???

I want insights on his voicings, chord/scale/modal ideas, rhythms and polyrhythms, outside motif exploration/development, licks, compositional devices and so on... anything signature of Herbie.

Please post what you know... Thanks!!

**princeplanet** · 04-07-2011, 12:12 AM

Even an analysis of his very early work (eg. Takin Off) would take years of analysis! Sorry I can't offer anything except to say that I too would like any insight.....

**cosmic gumbo** · 04-07-2011, 12:55 PM

Herbie was a child prodigy, so his chops and mind are kinda supernatural.

**docbop** · 04-07-2011, 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo

Herbie was a child prodigy, so his chops and mind are kinda supernatural.

Add in his Zen Meditation he's been practicing for decades he is calm relaxed Music Genius that just lets the music flow out of him.

**JonnyPac** · 04-07-2011, 02:11 PM

Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo

Herbie was a child prodigy, so his chops and mind are kinda supernatural.

Seriously.

**oneworld** · 04-07-2011, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by docbop

Add in his Zen Meditation he's been practicing for decades he is calm relaxed Music Genius that just lets the music flow out of him.

not zen, but nichiren...

Nichiren - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

**paynow** · 04-07-2011, 02:46 PM

Something cool from Steve Kahn's site:

Herbie Hancock Solo Transcription and Analysis by Steve Khan

**oneworld** · 04-08-2011, 06:26 AM

@JonnyPac...

did you check out the dropbox link that i've sent you ?

later, paul

**JakeAcci** · 04-08-2011, 10:48 AM

I've trascribed a few things, if i remember correctly, and they both gave me a lot of cool stuff to work on. I did some of the solo for Wayne Shorter's "Dance Cadaverous" and herbie's solo on "502 blues."

For the former:

The tune is in 3/4, but he's hearing and playing off of the 8th note triplets within each beat, so, for explanation's sake, I could say he turns it into 9/8 as three groups of three. So playing triplets in 3 is nothing crazy, but he does a lot of stuff in that solo where he will group the notes in 4, kinda of like:

ONE two three one TWO three one two THREE | one two three ONE etc. - but not necessarily starting on beat one! (he does this in 502 blues as well, also in 3/4)

or a different grouping that goes over the bar line. Similarly, he'll play of the subdivided triplets - accented the 2nd or 3rd partial in the group of triplets. The 2nd one, (one TWO three) I think, has a particularly cool sound, as the first is just the downbeat, and the third is similar to an 8th note upbeat in swing feel. If you play consistent quarter note triplets over 3/4 you automatically get a phrase that goes over the bar line, with some of those notes landing on that second funky partial.

solo starts at 1:50. dig the line at 2:08

he also will imply 4 a few times by playing groups of 4 or 8 that fit evenly in the measure.

**JonnyPac** · 04-08-2011, 02:19 PM

Thanks guys... looks like I'll have some work to do! I've been really diggin HH's crazy polyrhythms. The 4 and 8 over 3 is getting easier for me in the last few months.

Are there any guitarists who claim HH as a major influence?

**paynow** · 04-08-2011, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by JonnyPac

Thanks guys... looks like I'll have some work to do! I've been really diggin HH's crazy polyrhythms. The 4 and 8 over 3 is getting easier for me in the last few months.

Are there any guitarists who claim HH as a major influence?

Steve Kahn, from the link I posted, is a guitarist. He seems to have been.

**JonnyPac** · 04-10-2011, 05:54 PM

Thanks! I'll dig into this tomorrow at wk...

**JonnyPac** · 04-14-2011, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by paynow

Something cool from Steve Kahn's site:

Herbie Hancock Solo Transcription and Analysis by Steve Khan

That's an interesting read. Thanks! I have not tried the solo, but the text really confirmed my own interpretation of that Miles quintet era. It's seems even more atmospheric and disorienting when you really try to nail it down... Beyond me. It took me a long time to figure out Nefertiti in my own way... Intense stuff.

**paynow** · 04-15-2011, 12:30 AM

Originally Posted by JonnyPac

That's an interesting read. Thanks! I have not tried the solo, but the text really confirmed my own interpretation of that Miles quintet era. It's seems even more atmospheric and disorienting when you really try to nail it down... Beyond me. It took me a long time to figure out Nefertiti in my own way... Intense stuff.

Hey, JP, you got it. Yeah, that's a good site; glad you found it helpful. Steve Kahn put out that "Wes Montgomery Folio" which is great if you don't have it.

**Badge** · 05-06-2011, 12:04 AM

I saw Herbie live last night. He had us all in his hands. It was Herbie on keyboards with just a bass, drums and, on a few tracks, a female vocalist. He's clearly a genius.

**JonnyPac** · 05-06-2011, 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by Badge

I saw Herbie live last night. He had us all in his hands. It was Herbie on keyboards with just a bass, drums and, on a few tracks, a female vocalist. He's clearly a genius.

Lucky you! Awesome! Must have been great.

**the*doctor** · 05-07-2011, 06:22 PM

Hey Badge, did you happen to see him at the opera house, cos I saw that advertised, but had half yearly exams over those few days! Unlucky hey!
It would have been great with horns though. All of my favourites have them in it