Reply to Thread Bookmark Thread
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Posts 26 to 37 of 37
  1. #26

    User Info Menu

    Hard to not feel, that PM's comment "To me, he’s the first really significant 21st century" is more like about others (meaning there was no really significant so far (after I came into the scene)) is arrogant.

    Saying "To me, he’s the first really significant 21st century" is a message, about his degrading opinion about all others, who all now know, they are not really significant. Wow :-)

    ***

    I know that is matter of taste, and the concert video is much more acceptable than his typical stuff, as an orchestra piano vocal musicis pretty average within that genre, regardless even if he composed it, I mean nothing exiting.

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Gabor
    Hard to not feel, that PM's comment "To me, he’s the first really significant 21st century" is more like about others (meaning there was no really significant so far (after I came into the scene)) is arrogant. Saying "To me, he’s the first really significant 21st century" is a message, about his degrading opinion about all others, who now know, they are not really significant.
    Oh Metheny is never shy of a bit of hyperbole is he? I don't tend to take his comments like this too seriously, in the sense that I think he is genuine in his enthusiasm, an obviously a great musician, but has a tendency to get a bit carried away haha.... I think it's one of the things that makes him an appealing communicator, both verbally and musically.

    Also, I can relate to the hyperbole thing. It's fun.

    I find musicians like Louis Cole, Chris Thile, Sam Amidon, Tigran Hamasyan and so on are also, as far as one can tell, significant musicians of the 21st century too, and you'd have to be not listening to their music to think otherwise.... All of their music I listen to a lot more than Colllier's. I'm sure Metheny loves those guys too.

    Anyway, Collier's sheer ability as a musician is never in question. The only question here is whether one particularly likes his music or not.

    In terms of whether or not his music will have a lasting influence etc - no-one can really tell. Not me, and not Pat either. Probably an 18th century musician would be gobsmacked that people in the 21st century were interested in JS Bach and not one of the then fashionable guys like his sons, or Durante, Paisello, or someone.

  4. #28

    User Info Menu

    Christian, I can not help my bad habit to edit my posts, while you answered, sorry for that. Anyway your post still appropriate. I do not take too seriously PMs statement, but I am pretty sure he takes himself dead seriuosly :-).

    Regarding the music, the symphonyc concert video is pretty average within the genre, and not represents Collier talent. With all other aspects, I did not question Colliers talent, just miss the musical result. Havind extraordinary ear, and musical intelligence, not necessary results music, and message to the listeners. Mozart had the same (or more) talent and managed to send meaningful message too.
    He wrote Jeunehomme concerto when he was 21 which it is only itself a beautiful present for many people. You are right, later works tend to have more layers, a minor rondo (K 511) is unbelievable.

  5. #29

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian Miller
    Oh Metheny is never shy of a bit of hyperbole is he? I don't tend to take his comments like this too seriously, in the sense that I think he is genuine in his enthusiasm, an obviously a great musician, but has a tendency to get a bit carried away haha.... I think it's one of the things that makes him an appealing communicator, both verbally and musically.

    Also, I can relate to the hyperbole thing. It's fun.

    I find musicians like Louis Cole, Chris Thile, Sam Amidon, Tigran Hamasyan and so on are also, as far as one can tell, significant musicians of the 21st century too, and you'd have to be not listening to their music to think otherwise.... All of their music I listen to a lot more than Colllier's. I'm sure Metheny loves those guys too.

    Anyway, Collier's sheer ability as a musician is never in question. The only question here is whether one particularly likes his music or not.

    In terms of whether or not his music will have a lasting influence etc - no-one can really tell. Not me, and not Pat either. Probably an 18th century musician would be gobsmacked that people in the 21st century were interested in JS Bach and not one of the then fashionable guys like his sons, or Durante, Paisello, or someone.
    100% this.

    Remember this Metheny quote, which got a lot of traction in the forum a while back:

    Pasquale Grasso is “the best guitar player I’ve heard in maybe my entire life,” and “he’s the most significant new guy I’ve heard in many, many years."

    As much as I love PM (OMG, just saw that he is on Rick Beato!!) I take his pronouncements on other musicians with a shaker of salt. Both Collier and Grasso are unique, possibly unparalleled talents. But my patience wears thin after a few tunes. Whereas I can set my playlist to Tigran Hamasyan (or Snarky Puppy!) and listen for hours.

  6. #30

    User Info Menu

    Can't deny his knowledge and application of it. But he's like a lab technician not a musician. I mean, of course he's a musician, but he sounds like someone mixing chemicals in a beaker as opposed to someone translating emotions into music. Vai loves this kid too.... I suppose when you are already a master, and someone comes along and knows something you DON'T, you are impressed. But being a good technician doesn't automatically = good music. If we ever need to use music as "fuel" to get us back to the moon (reference: movie, "Hidden Figures"), JC is the person for the job. Otherwise, meh.

    Just my $0.02

    PS- and this also goes for the over-hyped people who use NO musical theory to create, and pass THAT off as "genius" (this means you, Jack White).

    For the record, I don't care if theory is used or not. But I want to hear MUSIC, which to ME is more than just "doing something no one has ever done" or "being so avant-garde that the music goes back 100 years to the pool of sludge from which modern music crawled out of" (i.e., noise)

  7. #31

    User Info Menu

    PG - epic. JC - annoying as f.

  8. #32

    User Info Menu

    My unconscious mind has a sense of humor. I wrote about him playing the Royal Albert Hall in his pajamas, but only now just connected the song's title, "In The Real Early Morning"; so he's also doing a little wardrobe performance art.

  9. #33

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by ruger9
    Can't deny his knowledge and application of it. But he's like a lab technician not a musician. I mean, of course he's a musician, but he sounds like someone mixing chemicals in a beaker as opposed to someone translating emotions into music. Vai loves this kid too.... I suppose when you are already a master, and someone comes along and knows something you DON'T, you are impressed. But being a good technician doesn't automatically = good music. If we ever need to use music as "fuel" to get us back to the moon (reference: movie, "Hidden Figures"), JC is the person for the job. Otherwise, meh.

    Just my $0.02

    PS- and this also goes for the over-hyped people who use NO musical theory to create, and pass THAT off as "genius" (this means you, Jack White).

    For the record, I don't care if theory is used or not. But I want to hear MUSIC, which to ME is more than just "doing something no one has ever done" or "being so avant-garde that the music goes back 100 years to the pool of sludge from which modern music crawled out of" (i.e., noise)
    I would say Collier is more about execution than theory. It’s one thing to know you can stack chords in fifths indefinitely, or move one chord to another via intervals smaller than a semitone etc, it’s another thing to hear and use those concepts freely in ones music.

    Also his feel and groove is fantastic listen to him sing a Samba or Gnawa feel for instance ; according to a friend who had Jacob in her class when he was still in his early teens, he was playing drums at that point as his only instrument, didn’t yet have any piano skills, and then he then learned in about a year. So groove is clearly a central thing for him.

    IIRC he was a singer first, singing Bach, Britten etc with his family who are all classical musicians.

    for me the really impressive thing is his ear, which is incredible. It’s one thing to have perfect pitch but another to do that.

    As a musician I can say all of this as a more or less objective fact, an assessment. Everyone’s very impressed. So now what?

  10. #34

    User Info Menu

    A reaction from a vocal coach that had never heard of Collier:


  11. #35

    User Info Menu

    I haven't heard much of this artist but I agree with zdub. Based on a couple of clips here, this is stratospheric musical talent, period.

  12. #36

    User Info Menu

    He seems to be all over YouTube: collaborations, reactions, endorsements, Tiny Desk, guest appearances, Snarky Puppy, and so on.

    But his last two albums were flops. Is this the future of music?

  13. #37

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick

    But his last two albums were flops. Is this the future of music?
    Why does everything have to be so grand .. Future of music?

    After two records that hit the number one spot on in the Billboard "Contemporary Jazz" category and top 10 in "Jazz" he just missed the mark with his last two records (even tho he is still winning grammy's so critically he is doing fine)


    His product is exciting at first but once you've heard one album, you've heard them all?

    That is not unique as such.



    There is nothing "Future of music" here in my humble opinion. Having a successful debut followed by people losing interest is a story that is as old as music it self. But even if he doesn't reinvent himself in a way that sells records again I'm sure he will fill concert hall for quite a while to come, which is "a great success" in itself


    Just because you're great in a critical (or jazzguitar.be) way doesn't mean you can't be boring to most people ..
    Last edited by Lobomov; 08-22-2021 at 09:07 AM.