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  1. #101

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    When we're practicing our instruments, we're working on a very different set of skills. We learn how to swing, how to improvise, and most importantly how to communicate with other guys in the ensemble setting. This is all very important for jazz, or a rock player. The solo acoustic players like Marcin take the guitar in totally different direction. They dont need those skills, so the showmanship is the ultimate goal.

    I can still learn a thing or two from them, but in general this kind of playing is in a parallel world, and like Christian said, life is too short and you need to filter things out.

    One thing though, as a teacher I have to deal with it because some kids are into it, and I do need to teach them the basics. I transcribed a few arrangements of Sungha Jung, the original Youtube guitar child sensation. It works, but I do my best not to take anyone that direction unless they persist.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #102

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    This is very strange in my opinion.
    Young people, fascinated by Marcin's playing, want to become more like him, but they don't know how difficult it is.
    Or maybe I am too old.

  4. #103

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    Teenage YouTube virtuosos come and go.
    Yes they do....a dime a dozen are these virtuoso attention seekers!

  5. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by alltunes
    Yes they do....a dime a dozen are these virtuoso attention seekers!
    At least they touch people and have success albeit for a short while ... When is the last time a jazz musician did something like that?

  6. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov
    At least they touch people and have success albeit for a short while ... When is the last time a jazz musician did something like that?
    Umm, today? I've heard jazz on the radio and it was a blessing lol

  7. #106

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    Umm, today? I've heard jazz on the radio and it was a blessing lol
    Jazz radio is great...but young people prefer youtube.I think so.
    I also often watch old concerts on youtube.
    What Marcin is playing is not addressed to me.
    He has his audience and I admire his enthusiasm.

  8. #107

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    Jazz radio is great...but young people prefer youtube.I think so.
    I also often watch old concerts on youtube.
    What Marcin is playing is not addressed to me.
    He has his audience and I admire his enthusiasm.
    i also prefer youtube. But sometimes im lazy and WBGO on internet does the trick.

    ''He has his audience''- exactly! So he dont need to worry about us. And we dont need to worry about him. Win win!

  9. #108

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    We are connected by guitar..and internet.
    We dont need to worry about him.He knows exactly what he is doing.
    I'm worry about the live jazz concerts.

  10. #109

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    again, not jazz but as far as young 'virtuosos' go I get so much more out of listening to this young lady.


  11. #110

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    She is very good and plays classics.

  12. #111

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    its a slippery slope...


  13. #112

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    It makes no sense.Is it faster the better?

  14. #113

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    You don't like it, don't watch. Why these comments ...?
    Because we are in a forum. Commenting is what we do.

  15. #114

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    Because we are in a forum. Commenting is what we do.
    Ok.
    Since we are on the forum, let's comment.
    Comparing the giants of jazz to playing of a young boy who doesn't play jazz ...?
    What is it for?
    Last edited by kris; 04-10-2021 at 05:57 AM.

  16. #115

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    Quote Originally Posted by BWV
    its a slippery slope...

    That pretty fast. I would like to hear a clean version of this.

    Reminds me of people who can do anything with a ball, but don't make it in a soccer-team.
    It's like he can play very well, but can he make music?

  17. #116

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    This is very strange in my opinion.
    Young people, fascinated by Marcin's playing, want to become more like him, but they don't know how difficult it is.
    Or maybe I am too old.
    Actually, that might not be a bad thing... self-imposed obstacles an all...

    Not jazz but, well, frightening:  Marcin Patrzalek-jpg

  18. #117

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    Quote Originally Posted by wintermoon
    again, not jazz but as far as young 'virtuosos' go I get so much more out of listening to this young lady.

    Same. She is very good and she plays music.

  19. #118

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    Quote Originally Posted by hep to the jive
    same. She is very good and she plays music.
    get off my lawn!!

  20. #119

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    Everyone should agree on one thing:
    Marcin's appearance in the media has generated a lot of interest, or more precisely - confusion.
    So what will happen next. Who knows?
    You can complain: it's not music, it doesn't sound, it's too fast, etc...
    ..but Marcin is already functioning in his own way.

    I wish every musician to have as many audiences and fans as possible.
    One question:
    What to do to make it happen ...?
    I note in advance that I am not a supporter of Talent Shows.
    And please don't bring it all down to the circus .

  21. #120

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    Ok.
    Since we are on the forum, let's comment.
    Comparing the giants of jazz to playing of a young boy who doesn't play jazz ...?
    What is it for?
    I was comparing playing together with playing alone.

  22. #121

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    I am not a supporter of Talent Shows.
    This! America's Got Talent is what you think as plastic, manufactured pop culture. Stay away from Talent Shows kids.

    Kris, youtube is full of young talent, some of them have a nice career just like that. Some you like, some not so much, it's not a generational thing, only fools believe that. I heard plenty of young musicians who I think are great and inspiring, not just jazz of course. Lets just hope we can all go back to perform live music soon, and not just be limited to social media 'gigs'.

  23. #122

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    This! America's Got Talent is what you think as plastic, manufactured pop culture. Stay away from Talent Shows kids.

    Kris, youtube is full of young talent, some of them have a nice career just like that. Some you like, some not so much, it's not a generational thing, only fools believe that. I heard plenty of young musicians who I think are great and inspiring, not just jazz of course. Lets just hope we can all go back to perform live music soon, and not just be limited to social media 'gigs'.
    Ok.
    It is also known that social media helps to popularize music and artists.
    Before Covid, it was similar ... unless I'm wrong.
    ok...Maybe there are more so-called home musicians now.

  24. #123

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    I was comparing playing together with playing alone.
    Ok.
    I understood...
    sorry

  25. #124

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    Same. She is very good and she plays music.

    So what she played was music .. but adding a bit of harmony and rhythm to that makes it no longer music (from the OP)



    I see ... That is actually also always been an issue with jazz .. Why add extra chords and rhythmical figures to Broadway tunes that where perfect as first performed. Makes no sense does it?

    I wholeheartedly agree. Exploration and progress should be banned!

  26. #125

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov
    So what she played was music .. but adding a bit of harmony and rhythm to that makes it no longer music (from the OP)



    I see ... That is actually also always been an issue with jazz .. Why add extra chords and rhythmical figures to Broadway tunes that where perfect as first performed. Makes no sense does it?

    I wholeheartedly agree. Exploration and progress should be banned!
    You dont even make sense dude. In jazz we always add extra chords and rhythm to standards, it's kind of... expected?

    Sure, if you like this version of Paganini, great! Who's banning what? Enjoy, explore, copy, you can do many things in that direction. You play guitar, right? So did you start working on this new techniques yet?

    After all said and done, you can really explore the percussive way of playing and adding it to your playing. I do and I think it's really cool if used to taste in any genre. We can learn from anyone, even we dont really dig them.

  27. #126

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    This is very creative playing.
    Marcin is an innovator.
    It is a very musical personality.
    And all those who have a bad attitude towards him lose a lot - he transmits a very positive energy in music.
    Of course it's music.
    Easy test for guitarists: take a guitar and play any tune solo...is it easy?I'm not talking about making a video.

  28. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    You dont even make sense dude. In jazz we always add extra chords and rhythm to standards, it's kind of... expected?

    Sure, if you like this version of Paganini, great! Who's banning what? Enjoy, explore, copy, you can do many things in that direction. You play guitar, right? So did you start working on this new techniques yet?

    After all said and done, you can really explore the percussive way of playing and adding it to your playing. I do and I think it's really cool if used to taste in any genre. We can learn from anyone, even we dont really dig them.
    If you like Jimi Hendrix, for example, do you have to copy him, his technique or whatever?
    I love hearing Jimi play but never copied his playing.It would be bad.

  29. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    If you like Jimi Hendrix, for example, do you have to copy him, his technique or whatever?
    I love hearing Jimi play but never copied his playing.It would be bad.
    You dont have to, but why wouldn't you? I copied Jimi a lot, or tried to anyway, back in the day. I learn from many players of all genres, and definitely copied all rock guitar masters. Nobody told me, I just love it, because I'm an artist.

  30. #129

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    I spent a significant chunk of my teenage years trying to play like Jimi Hendrix. I like to think some of that still influences my jazz playing.

  31. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    It makes no sense.Is it faster the better?
    yes, and at that speed Bumblebee works over any and all changes, so in addition to being the World’s Fastest Guitarist™ , he is also now the World’s Greatest Bebop Guitarist™.

  32. #131

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    Quote Originally Posted by BWV
    yes, and at that speed Bumblebee works over any and all changes, so in addition to being the World’s Fastest Guitarist™ , he is also now the World’s Greatest Bebop Guitarist™.
    Solo guitarist...no band...wow

  33. #132

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    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop
    I spent a significant chunk of my teenage years trying to play like Jimi Hendrix. I like to think some of that still influences my jazz playing.


    I tried to play like Jimi too ... it was at school. A long time ago. I had very bad equipment and a guitar that hurt my fingers.
    This solo was fascinating and it is still today.I don't know what effect this had on my guitar playing.
    I got interested in jazz and stopped playing loud.

  34. #133

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    Circus act:




    Most impressive. Not so much the teeth and neck stuff, but playing the guitar the other way around . . . .

  35. #134

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    You dont have to, but why wouldn't you? I copied Jimi a lot, or tried to anyway, back in the day. I learn from many players of all genres, and definitely copied all rock guitar masters. Nobody told me, I just love it, because I'm an artist.
    You took my comment to yourself too much.
    What I meant was that my copying was poor quality and I wanted to play like Jimi.
    I didn't have a good guitar and a strong amplifier.
    It was at the end of the 60's. But Once upon a time !!!

  36. #135

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel_A
    Circus act:




    Most impressive. Not so much the teeth and neck stuff, but playing the guitar the other way around . . . .
    If you had said Circus act in this time when Jimi was alive, you'd have problems.
    He was the god of the guitar.

  37. #136

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    Don’t worry. I know who Hendrix is.

  38. #137

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    I don’t understand the acrimony and hurt feelings in this thread. Yes, this young man’s finger dexterity and fretboard knowledge is near super human. Also true that I did not enjoy listening to it as music.

    No one knows how he will develop. Some prodigies never translate their technical prowess into music that moves and inspires. Some do. Young Beethoven was thought to be a teenage freak who wowed people with his speed and the difficulty of his playing. He matured. Most do not. Only time will tell.

    Why is that controversial?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  39. #138

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    I don’t understand the acrimony and hurt feelings in this thread. Yes, this young man’s finger dexterity and fretboard knowledge is near super human. Also true that I did not enjoy listening to it as music.

    No one knows how he will develop. Some prodigies never translate their technical prowess into music that moves and inspires. Some do. Young Beethoven was thought to be a teenage freak who wowed people with his speed and the difficulty of his playing. He matured. Most do not. Only time will tell.

    Why is that controversial?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Maybe get people to take this quiz, then get back with the results

    What's Your Emotional Age? | HowStuffWorks

  40. #139

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    I didn’t really copy anyone when I was a teenager. I don’t think it really occurred to me.

  41. #140

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    "Why is that controversial?"
    Good question.
    We live in a different time than Beethoven.
    Anyone can write a comment quickly.
    People are sitting in front of computers more.
    The concerts are online without an audience.
    There are countless videos.Everyone is looking for the best way to get an audience.
    Some people like it, others don't.Some say they develop this way and others say they don't.
    Music is everywhere.
    Music should connect people but in excess it causes controversy...
    The controversy on the forum is nothing unusual.
    The easiest way is to criticize the musician verbally by writing a comment.
    The commented musician is unable to answer ... a wave of comments begins.
    I mean commenting on a recorded video.
    Last edited by kris; 04-11-2021 at 04:04 AM.

  42. #141

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlrhett
    I don’t understand the acrimony and hurt feelings in this thread. Yes, this young man’s finger dexterity and fretboard knowledge is near super human. Also true that I did not enjoy listening to it as music.

    No one knows how he will develop. Some prodigies never translate their technical prowess into music that moves and inspires. Some do. Young Beethoven was thought to be a teenage freak who wowed people with his speed and the difficulty of his playing. He matured. Most do not. Only time will tell.

    Why is that controversial?

    Cause many don't actually say what you did. They say what he is doing isn't music ... or call him a circus act .. or claim that he ain't no Chet Atkins ... or whatever ...

    The statement "Hey, not really my taste, but he's quite talented and might do something great later on" isn't all that common.


    Great young player after great young player is posted here and the forum duly obliges by barfing all over him .. or her. This thread is quite harmless, tho I admire how Kris keeps it alive .. Kris is cool. You want a real train wreck try this one with the cool and fairly young Elenora Strino

    elonora strino

    Gottta love this forum

  43. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I didn’t really copy anyone when I was a teenager. I don’t think it really occurred to me.

    Really? .. That is actually quite unusual .. I spent a lot of time ghosting Mark Knopfler around 15-16 .. Then did that same with Andy Summers a year later

    Sure there where other players ... You know the usual suspects .. but those two just stood out in a massive way.

    Don't most teens have heroes they emulate?

  44. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov
    You want a real train wreck try this one with the cool and fairly young Elenora Strino

    elonora strino

    Gottta love this forum
    Yea, how did this happen... But to be fair, she's got a lot of love on this forum, as she should have. It was just one guy, basically a troll, with his ridiculously patronizing comment, made all the stir. To me you could laugh at it and forget it, but many got seriously offended. But you have to admit, Eleonora Strino is well loved around here, a great new player.

  45. #144

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    Yea, how did this happen... But to be fair, she's got a lot of love on this forum, as she should have. It was just one guy, basically a troll, with his ridiculously patronizing comment, made all the stir. To me you could laugh at it and forget it, but many got seriously offended. But you have to admit, Eleonora Strino is well loved around here, a great new player.

    Yeah ... She is great and sure .. no need to get offended .. but it's the internet and sometimes you just get carried away .. and at pther times just feeling like semi-trolling ... I'm guilty of both of those of these occasionally


    It's the internet as said

  46. #145

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I didn’t really copy anyone when I was a teenager. I don’t think it really occurred to me.
    Really, you never had the urge to get into the head of your fav players and copy their licks, to see how they do it? So how did you learn, just playing whatever your teacher handed you on paper? Hard to believe, but ok

  47. #146

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    Quote Originally Posted by S F
    It sounds like a rhythm piece that happens to have some kind of a melody(sometimes?) rather than a song that happens to have percussion. Some parts were nice like the harmonics towards the end.

    He reminds me of a Candyrat kind of player. I do like some Candyrat Records guys like Antoine Dufour. This kind of approach to acoustic guitar I find more pleasant to listen to.
    Yep, Candyrat is swarming with technically adept guitarists, but Antoine stands with only a few others (IMO of course) in creating interesting compositions in that style. He has also become a go-to recording engineer for acoustic music.

  48. #147

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobomov
    The statement "Hey, not really my taste, but he's quite talented and might do something great later on" isn't all that common.
    Maybe you should think about the qualification 'circus act' a bit more. It has nothing to do with taste.
    It has to do with why people stop and take the time to look at a video of this Marcin guy.
    I guarantee you that nobody thinks Marcin is making great music. Nobody wants to listen to an album of this stuff.
    People like it because because it is very difficult to do. Like a good magic trick or a . . . . good circus act.
    I didn't check the comments, but how many say that this was the best version of Kazmir they ever heard? How many say that this version of Beethovens 9th was very tasteful? I bet they all say how amazing and difficult it was.
    You know, like a circus act.

  49. #148

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marcel_A
    Maybe you should think about the qualification 'circus act' a bit more. It has nothing to do with taste.
    It has to do with why people stop and take the time to look at a video of this Marcin guy.
    I guarantee you that nobody thinks Marcin is making great music. Nobody wants to listen to an album of this stuff.
    People like it because because it is very difficult to do. Like a good magic trick or a . . . . good circus act.
    I didn't check the comments, but how many say that this was the best version of Kazmir they ever heard? How many say that this version of Beethovens 9th was very tasteful? I bet they all say how amazing and difficult it was.
    You know, like a circus act.
    How do you know all this? I'm sure there will be people who have a completely different opinion.Marcin has hit a very large audience, maybe it works in such a way that only Marcin's playing draws them in.
    Don't take away people's right to listen to something that you associate with a circus.
    Marcin's works are his guitar visions.
    For me, the circus at this point is that you compare Beethovens' symphonies to the modest idea of a young guitarist.
    Viewers are not musicians.
    In music school, I had to listen to Beethovens symphonies over and over again to pass the exam.
    Are you sure everyone listens to classical music?
    Instead of worrying about Marcin's playing, I propose to listen to all Beethoven's symphonies. I've already done it.
    This is a great masterpiece of music.

  50. #149

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    I would prefer Jimmy Page, who is btw the "originator" the "feeling", (around 1975) almost half century ago. It would be great to focus nowadays more on the content and the feeling, instead of the "form" and attraction (clicks). Pick your favorite below, hard choice, because all have a common attribute: has content, I mean speaks to us:

    (just for the record, Kashmir not even my favorite Led Zeppelin record, because "I do not agree :-)" this harmonic minorish touch in rock/blues, this is the predecessor of Ritchie Blackmoore's Rainbow (1975) which really abused this tone, and was really disappointing.)

    (wow, Page with single coil?!)






  51. #150

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    Quote Originally Posted by waltf
    I think you'll like this wonder kid
    I really respect hard work, and talent, but I can't help imagining, John Cleese doing this as a Monty Python sketch, in that context this would be really a classic :-)