The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #126

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    TBH for awhile there in the 70's I literally thought Captain Beefheart WAS Frank Zappa recording under a different name. (This is before the internet.) I still think they are twin sons from different mothers.
    Frank Zappa and Leon Redbone are the same guy.

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  3. #127

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cunamara
    Frank Zappa and Leon Redbone are the same guy.
    Funny I never associated FZ with Vaudeville and Tin Pan Alley lol.

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  4. #128

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    Quote Originally Posted by neatomic
    agree..tho there were wildcards like jeff beck and peter green in the mix...they each had their own variations of style that made them killer
    And Jimmy Page and Richard Thompson and (a little later) Robert Fripp...

    There must've been something in the water in England in the mid-to-late 60's. Everybody wanted to pick up an electric guitar and wail away--mainly imitating American blues but some English folk thrown into the mix as well.

    As far as the Americans, you had Jimi, Mike Bloomfield, Terry Kath...

    I don't know where Zappa's guitar comes from. His playing is clearly blues-based but so outside the mainstream. I think that's why I have always dug it so much.

  5. #129

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    And Jimmy Page and Richard Thompson and (a little later) Robert Fripp...

    There must've been something in the water in England in the mid-to-late 60's. Everybody wanted to pick up an electric guitar and wail away--mainly imitating American blues but some English folk thrown into the mix as well.

    As far as the Americans, you had Jimi, Mike Bloomfield, Terry Kath...

    I don't know where Zappa's guitar comes from. His playing is clearly blues-based but so outside the mainstream. I think that's why I have always dug it so much.
    Yeah but Fripp's playing seems to be more eclectic than just blues based. I did get to see Richard Thompson in Atlanta a couple years back.

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  6. #130

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    Quote Originally Posted by neatomic
    agree..tho there were wildcards like jeff beck and peter green in the mix...they each had their own variations of style that made them killer

    but for flat out full throttle electric blues improv & beyond it'd be hard to beat clapton in cream..he influenced everybody..they called him god!!

    mclaughlin was still playin flatops during cream era..he was not blazing yet...his first electric blazer was devotion..in 1970!...which he cut in jimi's old studio-electric ladyland on 8th st nyc

    cheers
    Yeah I don't think McLaughlin has his alt picking together yet. But he was highly rated in London as an excellent and versatile musician with great feel and had played with Ginger and Jack Bruce in GBO, which is why I mentioned him. But, of course, they didn't want a jazz guy....

    BTW I was under the impression McLaughlin was well known at that point as an R&B player as well as a jazzer? Maybe my info is bad.

    Anyway, I always preferred Peter Green to Clapton, but my appreciation of Eric has grown as I've learned more about music. Green is still the absolute pinnacle of the Brit Blues players, to me.

  7. #131

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    And Jimmy Page and Richard Thompson and (a little later) Robert Fripp...

    There must've been something in the water in England in the mid-to-late 60's. Everybody wanted to pick up an electric guitar and wail away--mainly imitating American blues but some English folk thrown into the mix as well.

    As far as the Americans, you had Jimi, Mike Bloomfield, Terry Kath...

    I don't know where Zappa's guitar comes from. His playing is clearly blues-based but so outside the mainstream. I think that's why I have always dug it so much.
    Rory ****ing Gallagher
    Not just England

    A large proportion of the great blues and rock guitarists in London came from or spent time in West London, as well. Hounslow, Ealing, Twickenham places like that. Look it up, it's hilarious.

    The environment produces the musician.

  8. #132

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    Plus one on Green and Gallagher. It wasn't just the notes - although the notes were there, it was the feel, the throbbing soul. Which is not to diminish EC's work, which had both a-plenty, but Peter and Rory's tone, touch, and taste just spoke to me.

  9. #133

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    big peter green fan...as killer a blues player as he was, he also had eclectic nuance...you can hear some hank marvin shadows in there...brilliant player

    but his rhythm section mcvie/fleetwood were not of the same improvisatory/jazz level as bruce and baker..in cream all three players were edging each other on....so much propulsion!!!...thats how their infamous 17 minute live spoonful sounds so..dangerous!!


    big fan of rory as well..but his early band -taste- was definitely cream inspired

    funny just watched a recent interview with van halen..and he mentions that clapton was the only guitar player he ever really listened to early on...and mentioned (as i wrote ^) that they called him -god!! haha

    cheers

    ps -other great player i'd mention is gary moore...a tad bit later, but influenced by all the best...owned peter greens guitar...stunning blues player but also dabbled in fusiony stuff...and was good!

  10. #134

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    Quote Originally Posted by neatomic
    funny just watched a recent interview with van halen..and he mentions that clapton was the only guitar player he ever really listened to early on...and mentioned (as i wrote ^) that they called him -god!!

  11. #135

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    Quote Originally Posted by neatomic
    big peter green fan...as killer a blues player as he was, he also had eclectic nuance...you can hear some hank marvin shadows in there...brilliant player

    but his rhythm section mcvie/fleetwood were not of the same improvisatory/jazz level as bruce and baker..in cream all three players were edging each other on....so much propulsion!!!...thats how their infamous 17 minute live spoonful sounds so..dangerous!!


    big fan of rory as well..but his early band -taste- was definitely cream inspired

    funny just watched a recent interview with van halen..and he mentions that clapton was the only guitar player he ever really listened to early on...and mentioned (as i wrote ^) that they called him -god!! haha

    cheers

    ps -other great player i'd mention is gary moore...a tad bit later, but influenced by all the best...owned peter greens guitar...stunning blues player but also dabbled in fusiony stuff...and was good!
    Yea Eddie always said he copied Clapton the most, his main hero.

    It's been said before, but I agree, Clapton the guitar God was his Gibson years. Once he switched to strat, that sound was gone, he's got mellow. More mature maybe, but less rocking and edgy.

    Gary Moore was another monster who could sure play with the best of them, but I feel he was more popular in Europe. He sure was everyone's guitar hero in Russia. Anybody who wanted to play blues based solos looked up to him first.

  12. #136

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    ps- in case anyone cares...its a great interview with eddie van halen...it's a very proper (smithsonian) interview...i was never a huge fan, (had already heard holdsworth & halsall) but props



    cheers

  13. #137

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    Well no offense to anyone, they're great guitarists--me and my mates were pretty eclectic back in the day but we had never heard of Rory or Peter Green or Gary Moore. Some guys just didn't make it across the Atlantic.

    Or maybe EC had better management...

  14. #138

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    Peter Green is a great musician but I never got into Fleetwood Mac.

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  15. #139

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    Well no offense to anyone, they're great guitarists--me and my mates were pretty eclectic back in the day but we had never heard of Rory or Peter Green or Gary Moore. Some guys just didn't make it across the Atlantic.

    Or maybe EC had better management...
    I think Cream toured the US pretty heavily didn’t they?

  16. #140

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I think Cream toured the US pretty heavily didn’t they?
    Definitely, they were one of the biggest bands in the world in 67/68.

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  17. #141

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    I have to say I find the Clapton influence very hard to hear. You would say Jimi!

    And yet, I don’t doubt him. Influence works in mysterious ways.

    Allan Holdsworth loved Django, Charlie Christian and Jimmy Raney on guitar.

    But both players looked beyond the guitar for inspiration....

  18. #142

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    That's a great job, bravo Eddie! I only got to the first solo, never attempted the 2nd. I did copy Tony Iommy pretty thoroughly though. But this Clapton solo is pure genius, and Eddie got every lick right with perfect timing!

    Man, I'm just so inspired by those cats, more than I ever been by jazz guitarists... what am I doing here? lol

  19. #143

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hep To The Jive
    That's a great job, bravo Eddie! I only got to the first solo, never attempted the 2nd. I did copy Tony Iommy pretty thoroughly though. But this Clapton solo is pure genius, and Eddie got every lick right with perfect timing!

    Man, I'm just so inspired by those cats, more than I ever been by jazz guitarists... what am I doing here? lol
    There all musicians and it's all music my friend.

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  20. #144

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    Not sure if this settles the issue of Frank being a "jazz guitarist", but it's the only Zappa story I have....

    A few years ago I'm playing a duo gig at a wedding in a fancy mansion in Connecticut. A drunken guest wanders over to us on break, and loudly proclaims how much he loves all kinds of music, going on and on about all the stuff he listens to, not really talking to us but at us. At one point, he mentions that he just got the new Zappa box set and was listening to the albums on the drive here. The bassist, Jay Anderson, asks, "Which albums? Because I'm on a few of them...."



    PK

  21. #145

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulkogut
    Not sure if this settles the issue of Frank being a "jazz guitarist", but it's the only Zappa story I have....

    A few years ago I'm playing a duo gig at a wedding in a fancy mansion in Connecticut. A drunken guest wanders over to us on break, and loudly proclaims how much he loves all kinds of music, going on and on about all the stuff he listens to, not really talking to us but at us. At one point, he mentions that he just got the new Zappa box set and was listening to the albums on the drive here. The bassist, Jay Anderson, asks, "Which albums? Because I'm on a few of them...."



    PK
    We already knew that Frank would employ jazz musicians because he always looked for the best players. But that's still a bitchin story! May I ask which albums he played bass on?

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  22. #146

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulkogut
    Not sure if this settles the issue of Frank being a "jazz guitarist", but it's the only Zappa story I have....

    A few years ago I'm playing a duo gig at a wedding in a fancy mansion in Connecticut. A drunken guest wanders over to us on break, and loudly proclaims how much he loves all kinds of music, going on and on about all the stuff he listens to, not really talking to us but at us. At one point, he mentions that he just got the new Zappa box set and was listening to the albums on the drive here. The bassist, Jay Anderson, asks, "Which albums? Because I'm on a few of them...."



    PK
    Did he play electric bass on that gig or does he just play double?

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  23. #147

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    It was upright bass on our gig. Not sure about the Zappa sides. As one might guess, the drunk guy just kept talking about himself, so we never got to find out what Jay's experience of recording with FZ was like....

    PK

  24. #148

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulkogut
    It was upright bass on our gig. Not sure about the Zappa sides. As one might guess, the drunk guy just kept talking about himself, so we never got to find out what Jay's experience of recording with FZ was like....

    PK
    Lol figures damn winos. I'm a wino man!

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  25. #149

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
    Only just listened to this. Heh, EVH learned those solos! Nice.

  26. #150

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    Getting back to Zappa, Arthur Barrow's Autobiography is a good read.