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  1. #1

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    I'm assuming there are tons of Los Angeles, CA based players on this blog.
    Has there been a roll call thread that I'm missing?
    It would be nice to confer and share....

    Thanks!
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

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  3. #2

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    I'm from Orange County...currently hanging out at the Seabird in Long Beach. Guitarist Andy Wadell is playing with
    some vocalists right now. He is a great player!

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by srlank View Post
    I'm from Orange County...currently hanging out at the Seabird in Long Beach. Guitarist Andy Wadell is playing with
    some vocalists right now. He is a great player!
    I'm just up the street (so to speak). The Seabird is on my to do list! Thanks!
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  5. #4

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    I lived in L.A. until a couple years ago, I'm now live in the furthest north city in L.A. County in the desert.
    Last edited by docbop; 11-30-2015 at 01:58 AM.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  6. #5

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    I've lived all over SoCal, from north Orange County, to Hollywood, Claremont, Oxnard, NoHo, Redondo Beach, and these days, Palos Verdes.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I lived in L.A. until a couple years ago, I'm now live in the furthest north city in L.A. County in the desert.
    Aaaah! San Bernadino county is my guess. I just drove through the desert from Nevada this past weekend. Victorville, Barstow, Hysperia...
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by West LA Jazz View Post
    Aaaah! San Bernadino county is my guess. I just drove through the desert from Nevada this past weekend. Victorville, Barstow, Hysperia...
    Lancaster where Frank Zappa and Capt Beefheart came from and where aging rockers from L.A. move. San Bernadino is way South and East. Kern Country just a few miles north that's where Carol Kaye lives.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    Lancaster where Frank Zappa and Capt Beefheart came from and where aging rockers from L.A. move. San Bernadino is way South and East. Kern Country just a few miles north that's where Carol Kaye lives.

    I have my directions wrong! I just heard Frank on Sirius radio tearing it up like I'd never heard before on the Jam On station. I am most definitely familiar with Lancaster. It became the hot place to go and grab a piece of the rock due to LA prices going into the you know what. A few friends of mine bought there. The Kern County and Kern river are both on my bucket list.
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by West LA Jazz View Post
    I have my directions wrong! I just heard Frank on Sirius radio tearing it up like I'd never heard before on the Jam On station. I am most definitely familiar with Lancaster. It became the hot place to go and grab a piece of the rock due to LA prices going into the you know what. A few friends of mine bought there. The Kern County and Kern river are both on my bucket list.

    There was quite a boom out here in the 90's, but it's over and many people and businesses are gone. A lot of empty storefronts. Having NASA to the north and the skunkworks to the south does help keep people here. Weird with skunkworks here to walk about and see the stealth bomber cruising around and some other odd flying things. Skunkworks just got a big contract so that should help bring people with money into the area.

    Quartz Hill the ritzy area here supposedly Skunk Baxter and Simon Phillips live there in gated communities and Carmine Appice did live here but moved. People say Eddie Van Halen getaway house is in the hills just south of here. A lot of musicians here just none of them into Jazz mainly Country and Classic Rock which seems to be anything pre-2000.

    A lot of people here knew Zappa and Beefheart and have cool stories I hear some of Beefhearts old band members live here. Town still loves Frank.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  11. #10

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    "The Kern County and Kern river are both on my bucket list."

    This is one of my fave backyard rides-near Greenhorn pass west of Lake Isabella on the 155. Stellar. When I worked in the Post Production sound biz in the 80's we first lived in WeHo on the corner of Fountain and Flores-a iconic building, then later over to "Little Hancock Park" on Sycamore and First.
    Unfortunately the drought has not been kind to the Kern River. Lots of lost business in that area, it's a prime spot for white water rafting expeditions.
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  12. #11

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    What's a good place to live in or around LA? I was in Diego in the 80's but if I move back to CA I want to be in LA.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    What's a good place to live in or around LA? I was in Diego in the 80's but if I move back to CA I want to be in LA.

    These days there all expensive so it all about your budget. L.A. is being called the new Brooklyn since NYC is getting so expensive many New Yorkers are moving to L.A. L.A. is like any big cities it boils down to the neighborhood some good others lots of gangs and etc. I would say the only area that I'd avoid is downtown there's never been much going on down there.

    About six months ago one of my previous jobs asked if I'd be interested in coming back, didn't take long to realize I couldn't afford it anymore. Rents are high, gas is higher than rest of country, traffic is crazy bad, and everything is getting expensive.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  14. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    What's a good place to live in or around LA? I was in Diego in the 80's but if I move back to CA I want to be in LA.
    It depends what you're looking for. If you want rent in a suburban environment, you can live in Culver City and be close to the beach (downtown culver city is cool enough for a jazz man) and live 30 minutes away from downtown or Hollywood.

    If you want to buy, you can always buy a 2 or 3 unit multi family (400k range at 3% down) and live in one apartment and rent the other(s). Yes. LA rent is approaching Brooklyn rent. However, it's not a bad idea having tenants help you pay off your mortgage = additional forced savings as I like to think of it. I moved from the border of Santa Monica / LA on the westside to 13 minutes south of downtown. I wouldn't have done this 10 years ago.

    Downtown Development: The Latest Updates on 99 Downtown Projects - Los Angeles Downtown News - For Everything Downtown L.A.!: Development

    Today's downtown ain't your Daddy's downtown any more. It's hipster central. For instance, out of curiosity, I went to check out the new Whole Foods on 8th and Grand and I still shake my head at the M A S S I V E change. Whole Foods in downtown LA??? You got to be kidding me!!!! Downtown in the 90s was seedy central....

    Now they have a fabulous bookstore downtown called THE LAST BOOKSTORE. It's a blast. http://lastbookstorela.com

    8th and Grand
    http://www.carmelapartments.com/eigh...los-angeles-ca
    Last edited by West LA Jazz; 12-06-2015 at 03:26 AM.
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  15. #14

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    I've been downtown, but hadn't seen the Whole Foods....reminds me of recent South Park.
    By the way, Long Beach is about 45 minutes south of Downtown LA, and is a very diverse place with a lot going on in terms of art and music.
    Last edited by srlank; 12-06-2015 at 03:32 AM.

  16. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by srlank View Post
    I've been downtown, but hadn't seen the Whole Foods....reminds me of recent South Park.
    You're correct. Whole foods hasn't been open a month I don't think. South Park indeed!!
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    These days there all expensive so it all about your budget. L.A. is being called the new Brooklyn since NYC is getting so expensive many New Yorkers are moving to L.A. L.A. is like any big cities it boils down to the neighborhood some good others lots of gangs and etc. I would say the only area that I'd avoid is downtown there's never been much going on down there.

    About six months ago one of my previous jobs asked if I'd be interested in coming back, didn't take long to realize I couldn't afford it anymore. Rents are high, gas is higher than rest of country, traffic is crazy bad, and everything is getting expensive.
    I was looking at rent out there. I know 1200-$1300 isn't going to get me much. If I could find a part time job that would be a big help.

  18. #17

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    I lived in LA for years off and on during the 70s and 80s. I left in 1990 and have never been back. I would say that I've got a love hate relationship with it. I can remember the days when my rent was $55 per month to live a block and a half from the beach in Ocean Park and I was making $200/wk working in boat yards in Venice. I saved $700 and moved in 1974 to NYC with a subway token and a dollar tucked inside my Tony Lama cowboy boots and rented a 1000 sq. ft. studio south of Houston. I was shittin' in high cotton. And Barney Kessel had a little guitar store on the south side of Hollywood. This was the early 70s and I heard that he was a real curmudgeon who'd chase snot nosed kids out of the store. I guess my nose was clean because he never chased me. Or paid me any other attention for that matter. I was playing in the 80s in LA with a bunch of West Indians who I'd known from the Caribbean a few years previously. They were probably the best musicians I've ever played with. I saw them steadily deteriorate (conceptually) over a 5 year period. I've recently seen some things by some of them on youtube and I just think to myself that I'm glad I got out of that scene. I've driven from Nor Cal to Texas a few times since then but always use Hwy 40 by way of Bakersfield to avoid LA. Ornette Coleman said something like 'Los Angeles is generally a bad place for anyone involved in any form of creative self expression'. LA today seems to me like one big #selfie video. To each their own I suppose but for my money if I was looking for Guitar Town I'd try Nashville.
    Last edited by mrcee; 12-06-2015 at 10:57 AM.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    I was looking at rent out there. I know 1200-$1300 isn't going to get me much. If I could find a part time job that would be a big help.

    I left L.A. two years ago so not that current on prices. I know the Valley has always been a place musicians have lived, but have to be careful about where in the Valley. I know some live out in Pasadena area, but it adds to the commute to come into town. Culver City can is cool, but it's catching on and prices are climbing. A lot of the places people used to live inexpensively gentrification is driving prices up. Like parts of Venice and Santa Monica where I grew up Google and the whole Silicon Beach movement is going on and really drove prices up.

    I would like to go back, but the prices and traffic keep me from doing it. Where I'm at now it's and 90 minute plus drive in and as crazy as that sounds a lot people live here and drive into L.A. everyday. Funny the rush hour out here is like 5am with people going to work in L.A.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  20. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I left L.A. two years ago so not that current on prices. I know the Valley has always been a place musicians have lived, but have to be careful about where in the Valley. I know some live out in Pasadena area, but it adds to the commute to come into town. Culver City can is cool, but it's catching on and prices are climbing. A lot of the places people used to live inexpensively gentrification is driving prices up. Like parts of Venice and Santa Monica where I grew up Google and the whole Silicon Beach movement is going on and really drove prices up.

    I would like to go back, but the prices and traffic keep me from doing it. Where I'm at now it's and 90 minute plus drive in and as crazy as that sounds a lot people live here and drive into L.A. everyday. Funny the rush hour out here is like 5am with people going to work in L.A.

    One major bummer. The Norm's on Lincoln and Colorado in Santa Monica closed. Change continues its onslaught.
    $1200 can get you a decent place in West LA if you look. Specifically the area around Ralphs between Olympic and Santa Monica Blvd and Barrington. Probably all the way up to Wilshire. But you gotta look or drive the area.
    You can't analyze something you can't play! (Robert Conti)

    Technique is the means to play just like your voice is your means to speak. (Robert Conti)

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by West LA Jazz View Post
    One major bummer. The Norm's on Lincoln and Colorado in Santa Monica closed. Change continues its onslaught.
    $1200 can get you a decent place in West LA if you look. Specifically the area around Ralphs between Olympic and Santa Monica Blvd and Barrington. Probably all the way up to Wilshire. But you gotta look or drive the area.
    I go back a couple times a year and on a FB list of people who grew up around there and see all the closings really sad. My last day gig is around the area you're talking about looking. I worked on Santa Monica Blvd a block West of Bundy. I few of the programmers live around there and close to lots of cool places, the bad is traffic especially when politicians are in town they are usually going to events in Brentwood or going to Santa Monica airport to catch a helicopter so a lot of street closures.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  22. #21

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    I've lived in LA since 2001 after I moved from New York. After arriving in LA I joined LA swing band Royal Crown Revue and I've been working in LA ever since. For the last few years I've spent more and more time teaching at MI in Hollywood as well. I couldn't imagine moving back to New York now. I enjoy a house with a yard too much.

  23. #22

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    some nice LA folks and Xers on the board..I go back a bit .. from loft living on 13th & 6th in NY to now--santa monica..been in all parts of LA - major changes in all parts..25+ yrs ago I was lucky enough to inherit a "rent controlled" apt in santa monica..it was in the "poor" section of the city-I knew I "had" to keep the apt even if I moved elsewhere..its a small one-bed rm..that I invested in and remodeled.10 blocks from the beach..the rent is still in the 1980's mode..which gave me time to save and have some nice toys..now the entire area is upscale and climbing-I didn't have to move to a better neighborhood..the neighborhood came to me--I drive around different parts of LA from time to time .. hardly any landmarks I remember still around..used to play at a place in venice called the "comeback inn" a nice fun place..it was a "pass the hat" kind of deal..but some name players would show up from time to time and some great local bands would play some sets..now I hang out at a new "coffee bar" that's what they call 5 dollar a cup places now..its new and the owners may have me play there in the summer..its small and has hard acoustics but it could be fun..alot of nice ladies..and their dogs..seems to be if you live in LA now "they" give you a small dog you can carry everywhere (no one "walks their dog anymore)..supermarkets, even restaurants..I like large dogs..(really wolf..do tell) but don't have the room for one..

    planning on moving here..ok..LA is massive..you can drive for an hour at freeway speed and still "technically"-(this is where they have horse crossings) be in LA City..the conditions of some areas are very nice and very pricy..SmallOneBeds-300 to 500 sq ft/ going for almost 2K..to take your chances areas 11-1500/Month..

    yep traffic is a bitch..but..they have worked on public transit a lot..you can take trains now to almost everywhere and there is a heavy push on bikes..they have them almost everywhere.."bikeshare" they call it..in santa monica during the summer you cant drive to the beach anymore..they have built up downtown so much you cant go there anymore .. its too crowded (thanks yogi..)

    there is a lot to do in the art/music/industry areas..if you have the will and energy you will do nicely..

    just one wolfs opinion of moonlight..
    Last edited by wolflen; 12-08-2015 at 02:14 AM.
    play well ...
    wolf

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen View Post
    hardly any landmarks I remember still around..used to play at a place in venice called the "comeback inn" a nice fun place..it was a "pass the hat" kind of deal..but some name players would show up from time to time and some great local bands would play some sets..

    Oh man I miss the Comeback Inn it was great. Very small, but you could sit outside and still hear the music just as well. I played there some on the early days when it was mainly a Blues joint. Later hung out listening to Wayne Johnson trio, Billy Childs, Sam Moore, and many many more. So sad when they closed they got tired of fighting the the residential neightbors behind the club.

    Do you remember the Free Jazz club that was down the street for awhile it was call Aziz or like that. I couldn't charge but had a suggested donation to go in. A typical night someone would get up to played and over the course of the night other musicians would joint and leave, but the music wouldn't stop.

    There was another club that was on the boardwalk for a couple years, I remember going to see Ted Dunbar at. They had some other good Jazz but boardwalk got to dangerous at night and it closed up.

    There was a lot of music in that area till the Marina started moving north.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    Oh man I miss the Comeback Inn it was great. Very small, but you could sit outside and still hear the music just as well. I played there some on the early days when it was mainly a Blues joint. Later hung out listening to Wayne Johnson trio, Billy Childs, Sam Moore, and many many more. So sad when they closed they got tired of fighting the the residential neightbors behind the club.

    Do you remember the Free Jazz club that was down the street for awhile it was call Aziz or like that. I couldn't charge but had a suggested donation to go in. A typical night someone would get up to played and over the course of the night other musicians would joint and leave, but the music wouldn't stop.

    .
    yes the AZZ IZZ saw a woman playing the flute with a guy on a stand up bass..blew my mind..it impressed me to this day..and down the street was a guy named john who opened his house to musicians and I would play there .. there was a coffee house/restaurant..the brandywine café on Lincoln near venice where I worked..met a lot of musicians and show people - some now famous..had a harp player on sundays..I played with a sax player who was a cook there..what a time that was..

    doc..perhaps we met in passing .. wish there were places like that today..easy access to play..a club like the ones above..could not survive in this economic climate with out a heavy cover and drink mins..ahh success..you took all the fun away
    play well ...
    wolf

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by wolflen View Post
    yes the AZZ IZZ saw a woman playing the flute with a guy on a stand up bass..blew my mind..it impressed me to this day..and down the street was a guy named john who opened his house to musicians and I would play there .. there was a coffee house/restaurant..the brandywine café on Lincoln near venice where I worked..met a lot of musicians and show people - some now famous..had a harp player on sundays..I played with a sax player who was a cook there..what a time that was..

    doc..perhaps we met in passing .. wish there were places like that today..easy access to play..a club like the ones above..could not survive in this economic climate with out a heavy cover and drink mins..ahh success..you took all the fun away

    I loved the food at Brandywine didn't know they had music. We probably did meet at some point. Thanks for the memories.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  27. #26

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    I grew up in the L.A. area, in La Canada which is just north of Pasadena's Rose Bowl. The $80,000 home I grew up in the 1970s (that was a lot of money back then), is now valued at $2.85 million. Yikes!! Needless to say, my dad was financially more successful than I am.

    I live in San Diego, a couple miles from the coast near UCSD in a community called University City. Bought my 1,450 square foot house in 1991 for $200,000. It's valued at $700,000 now. Also yikes! I'm doing pretty good financially, even still I'm glad I'm not buying a house nowadays.

    I really like San Diego. L.A. not so much.
    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  28. #27

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    I was in Seal Beach, but moved a few years back. Still have family there, so I'm in town a few times a year.

  29. #28

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    I've lived in the westside since 1979 and I agree with all the posts. All I can say is that if you want to live somewhere decent AND be adjacent or central to lots of what LA has to offer, be prepared to spend more than anywhere in the state, except maybe San Francisco (now that will be an agonizing topic). One unmentioned yet affordable area to explore is Highland Park, where there local hipsters have claimed as their own.

    Public transportation is still "evolving" so you gotta have a car. However Uber is ubiquitous in LA.

  30. #29

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    I was in Long Beach for a year and National City for 6 years. I want to go back to Cali but not sure where yet.

  31. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    I was in Long Beach for a year and National City for 6 years. I want to go back to Cali but not sure where yet.

    Two places I lived and enjoyed was Santa Cruz my favorite Jazz club is there Kuumbwa Jazz Center and a lot of music in general there. Then I lived n Oakland for awhile and dug it, lots Jazz, arts and etc.
    Last edited by docbop; 12-15-2015 at 10:04 PM.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  32. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    I was in Long Beach for a year and National City for 6 years. I want to go back to Cali but not sure where yet.

    I lived in Cali north south east and west
    for most of the last 50 years.

    Haven't really lived there for almost 10.
    and don't know where a good place would be

    I go back every few years

    but I just ain't feelin' it.





    *Some cat on another thread was complaining about somebody using the above margin format so I thought I'd try it out just to be mischievous.

  33. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee View Post
    I lived in Cali north south east and west
    for most of the last 50 years.

    Haven't really lived there for almost 10.
    and don't know where a good place would be

    I go back every few years

    but I just ain't feelin' it.





    *Some cat on another thread was complaining about somebody using the above margin format so I thought I'd try it out just to be mischievous.


    I hear ya I grew up there and want out, but need to find an affordable place that has some Jazz going on.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  34. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I hear ya I grew up there and want out, but need to find an affordable place that has some Jazz going on.
    PM me when you find it. I'm waiting on tenterhooks.

  35. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee View Post
    I lived in Cali north south east and west
    for most of the last 50 years.

    Haven't really lived there for almost 10.
    and don't know where a good place would be

    I go back every few years

    but I just ain't feelin' it.





    *Some cat on another thread was complaining about somebody using the above margin format so I thought I'd try it out just to be mischievous.
    The music I used to play is popular in LA. Every place has good points and bad points. Milwaukee is all rap but besides that I like it. I just went on GigMasters and listened to a ton of bands from all over the country. LA is by far the best for R&B.
    I know what you mean. The driving sucks for one thing.
    I went to the Caribbean for the first time this year. I love it there. I don't know if there would be any use for me musically. I can fall into just about anything except for classical or jazz.
    I would definitely be looking to start a band in LA, not join one. I'm going to sell my house and move cross town where I am now. Go from there. It's a big leap going from a house to an apartment.
    These winters are getting to me.

  36. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    The music I used to play is popular in LA. Every place has good points and bad points. Milwaukee is all rap but besides that I like it. I just went on GigMasters and listened to a ton of bands from all over the country. LA is by far the best for R&B.
    I know what you mean. The driving sucks for one thing.
    I went to the Caribbean for the first time this year. I love it there. I don't know if there would be any use for me musically. I can fall into just about anything except for classical or jazz.
    I would definitely be looking to start a band in LA, not join one. I'm going to sell my house and move cross town where I am now. Go from there. It's a big leap going from a house to an apartment.
    These winters are getting to me.
    I do have a love hate relationship with LA. In plenty of ways it's great and one of my favorite places in the world it's just that the logistics and traffic etc are a stone hassle. Definitely having a few bucks and being financially secure would make it more do-able. LA being the best for R&B doesn't really surprise me. There's a big history of R&B there. Jazz to but that's really been arguably dead since the fifties. There used to be a big jazz scene on Central Ave in So. Central but the city fathers weren't down with the program at all and basically shut it down. They didn't dig the music that's for sure and stuff like inter racial fraternization wasn't in their comfort zone. Judging from what I read here jazz is back to some degree. I moved away in 1990 so I'm out of the loop big time. I gigged quite a bit for a while in the 80s playing Caribbean and Soul, mostly in So. Central West Indian clubs, but it looked like most of the action at that time was Hollywood Hair Boy Spandex stuff. I wasn't aware of much jazz being on the surface in the 80s. Lots of good players and all of the educational opportunities like GIT and Ted Greene but not much club action from what I noticed. Sure there was the usual restaurant background stuff. It didn't seem like big name acts really even played there much and that if they were on the West Coast they wouldn't play LA. I may have just not have noticed but I'd never hear of people like Joe Henderson or Bobby Hutcherson playing there. Not obviously any way. And they would regularly play SF. Hutcherson was from LA but lived in the SF area. Henderson was living there to teaching at some college. There of course were a few places like the Baked Potato but they featured mostly fusion I believe. I can't remember when the Lighthouse closed down. I lived in Hermosa for a second in the early seventies and used to walk by it all the time but it didn't look too inviting and appeared to be winding down. I was living in So. Central, in the eighties, and was the only white guy for miles around. I was playing in bands where I was the only white guy. Not that it really matters it's just that I was in the mix but was unaware of any kind of R&B club scene at that time. It was from my perspective primarily a Rock town. But now it's 2015 a Space Odyssey so things have surely changed.

    I've been based in Houston, Texas for the past few years (San Antonio before that) and spending most of my time in Mexico, coming back to the States a couple of times a year. I get to Cali now and then and was just out for a month in Sept. Houston used to have a big R&B scene but now maybe just a few Dirty South rappers. It used to have a considerable amount of jazz and blues as well and some big names came out of there but now there appears to nothing to speak of except ZZ Top. Not even as much Country as you'd think. It seems to be mostly a Metal town. I am a little disappointed in Mexico from a musical standpoint. I'm in a town noted for rich party hungry international types but the music I've heard ain't happnin' Captain. Rich international types hanging out listening to the Three Dog Night.
    I did do a couple of sets with a good singer and keyboard who were passing through town. Mostly jazz standards but some pop as well. I got 'em funky the best I could and everyone dug it. I'd like to put something together here, progressive straight ahead R&B with some improv (I like that Barry White Louie Louie number) (get ants in the people's pants so they want to dance. As far as I'm concerned if you don't pack the floor it's not for me) but I'm not too optimistic. Maybe a loose funky free lounge thing but I don't know if the crowd could stomach it. I'm deep in the woodshed though and that's good. I'm making a lot of headway.

    I lived in Belize off and on for about three years and played a bit. It's totally a Caribbean scene. Excellent but most of the best musicians have moved to LA over the last thirty years. I wouldn't go back there now though. It's become a violent crack saturated cesspool and I'd more than likely be dead within two weeks. As a outspoken non tourist white boy musician who speaks the dialect and knows too many people I'd be bound to piss somebody off.

    I think your plan to start a band as opposed to joining one is good. I don't care for joining bands that much myself. It's sort of like going on a blind date. I assume you're thinking of RnB. Old School Retro or something new and fresh? This post is kinda long and maybe would have been better as a PM but what the heck it may be of interest to someone other than yourself. And at least it's not a wacked out political diatribe. PM me if you like. I'd been interested in what you come up with musically as well as any current insights on LA if you wind up there.
    Last edited by mrcee; 12-15-2015 at 09:54 AM.

  37. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrcee View Post
    I do have a love hate relationship with LA. In plenty of ways it's great and one of my favorite places in the world it's just that the logistics and traffic etc are a stone hassle. Definitely having a few bucks and being financially secure would make it more do-able. LA being the best for R&B doesn't really surprise me. There's a big history of R&B there. Jazz to but that's really been arguably dead since the fifties. There used to be a big jazz scene on Central Ave in So. Central but the city fathers weren't down with the program at all and basically shut it down. They didn't dig the music that's for sure and stuff like inter racial fraternization wasn't in their comfort zone. Judging from what I read here jazz is back to some degree. I moved away in 1990 so I'm out of the loop big time. I gigged quite a bit for a while in the 80s playing Caribbean and Soul, mostly in So. Central West Indian clubs, but it looked like most of the action at that time was Hollywood Hair Boy Spandex stuff. I wasn't aware of much jazz being on the surface in the 80s. Lots of good players and all of the educational opportunities like GIT and Ted Greene but not much club action from what I noticed. Sure there was the usual restaurant background stuff. It didn't seem like big name acts really even played there much and that if they were on the West Coast they wouldn't play LA. I may have just not have noticed but I'd never hear of people like Joe Henderson or Bobby Hutcherson playing there. Not obviously any way. And they would regularly play SF. Hutcherson was from LA but lived in the SF area. Henderson was living there to teaching at some college. There of course were a few places like the Baked Potato but they featured mostly fusion I believe. I can't remember when the Lighthouse closed down. I lived in Hermosa for a second in the early seventies and used to walk by it all the time but it didn't look too inviting and appeared to be winding down. I was living in So. Central, in the eighties, and was the only white guy for miles around. I was playing in bands where I was the only white guy. Not that it really matters it's just that I was in the mix but was unaware of any kind of R&B club scene at that time. It was from my perspective primarily a Rock town. But now it's 2015 a Space Odyssey so things have surely changed.

    I've been based in Houston, Texas for the past few years (San Antonio before that) and spending most of my time in Mexico, coming back to the States a couple of times a year. I get to Cali now and then and was just out for a month in Sept. Houston used to have a big R&B scene but now maybe just a few Dirty South rappers. It used to have a considerable amount of jazz and blues as well and some big names came out of there but now there appears to nothing to speak of except ZZ Top. Not even as much Country as you'd think. It seems to be mostly a Metal town. I am a little disappointed in Mexico from a musical standpoint. I'm in a town noted for rich party hungry international types but the music I've heard ain't happnin' Captain. Rich international types hanging out listening to the Three Dog Night.
    I did do a couple of sets with a good singer and keyboard who were passing through town. Mostly jazz standards but some pop as well. I got 'em funky the best I could and everyone dug it. I'd like to put something together here, progressive straight ahead R&B with some improv (I like that Barry White Louie Louie number) (get ants in the people's pants so they want to dance. As far as I'm concerned if you don't pack the floor it's not for me) but I'm not too optimistic. Maybe a loose funky free lounge thing but I don't know if the crowd could stomach it. I'm deep in the woodshed though and that's good. I'm making a lot of headway.

    I lived in Belize off and on for about three years and played a bit. It's totally a Caribbean scene. Excellent but most of the best musicians have moved to LA over the last thirty years. I wouldn't go back there now though. It's become a violent crack saturated cesspool and I'd more than likely be dead within two weeks. As a outspoken non tourist white boy musician who speaks the dialect and knows too many people I'd be bound to piss somebody off.

    I think your plan to start a band as opposed to joining one is good. I don't care for joining bands that much myself. It's sort of like going on a blind date. I assume you're thinking of RnB. Old School Retro or something new and fresh? This post is kinda long and maybe would have been better as a PM but what the heck it may be of interest to someone other than yourself. And at least it's not a wacked out political diatribe. PM me if you like. I'd been interested in what you come up with musically as well as any current insights on LA if you wind up there.

    I think this is very much on topic. It's about music in LA. It's probably hard to get situated there but it might be right for some people. I've only worked with jazz musicians one time. It was a girl vocal group and they used jazz sidemen. Best band I was ever in actually. After that it was a steps dance band. It was a mistake for me to play in a mixed band in Japan. I don't know why the bandleader asked me to go. I found out not long ago he passed away in 08'. He was only 48.
    I'll never know now. He never went back there. I won't either.
    Anyway I don't want to dwell on that anymore. Some musicians create a scene and some have to find it.
    I'm a product of what Cameo fans call the 'Black new wave' I'd say. I didn't hear that till a couple years ago. A while back I was thinking, what did we call the music? We didn't actually call it anything. Now I just say R&B or funk as a loose description. pre-DJ.
    It's old enough to be retro now.
    'Funk' as a word has become a no-no for some people. I'm OK with that. People call it old school now.
    Well thanks for the reminder I'm old! It's kind of stupid. People are all over Youtube saying....OLD school!! yeah it's old and you can't play it so what are you kids babbling about?
    I think LA is probably good for jazz. Major cities that will be. NYC of course. I listened to some R&B bands in NY on Gigmasters.
    ....I don't think so.
    The reason R&B is so popular in LA is because they destroyed it to being with.
    That's just like..my opinion as they say in LA.

  38. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    I think this is very much on topic. It's about music in LA. It's probably hard to get situated there but it might be right for some people. I've only worked with jazz musicians one time. It was a girl vocal group and they used jazz sidemen. Best band I was ever in actually. After that it was a steps dance band. It was a mistake for me to play in a mixed band in Japan. I don't know why the bandleader asked me to go. I found out not long ago he passed away in 08'. He was only 48.
    I'll never know now. He never went back there. I won't either.
    Anyway I don't want to dwell on that anymore. Some musicians create a scene and some have to find it.
    I'm a product of what Cameo fans call the 'Black new wave' I'd say. I didn't hear that till a couple years ago. A while back I was thinking, what did we call the music? We didn't actually call it anything. Now I just say R&B or funk as a loose description. pre-DJ.
    It's old enough to be retro now.
    'Funk' as a word has become a no-no for some people. I'm OK with that. People call it old school now.
    Well thanks for the reminder I'm old! It's kind of stupid. People are all over Youtube saying....OLD school!! yeah it's old and you can't play it so what are you kids babbling about?
    I think LA is probably good for jazz. Major cities that will be. NYC of course. I listened to some R&B bands in NY on Gigmasters.
    ....I don't think so.
    The reason R&B is so popular in LA is because they destroyed it to being with.
    That's just like..my opinion as they say in LA.
    So Funk's a no-no word, huh? I didn't know that. I actually graduated from High School in Japan in 65. They had, and may still have them, coffee shops that catered to specific jazz tastes. Cool places with great record collections. This was in Kobe. Some would specialize in Bop. Others might specify in Miles Davis from the 50s on Columbia. And on and on.
    Little or no interesting live music to speak of. This was in Kobe/Osaka. Osaka had some big weird places with corny stage shows.

    Interesting about LA destroying R&B. When I was last there in the 80s there didn't seem to be no kind of nothin' going on, as far a clubs went, except spandex stuff in Hollywood. I spent a bunch of time in the hood and never saw any R&B evidence. Some store front Rap venues. And two or three West Indian clubs that were sporadic. There was a place on the Strip called the Club Lingere. I saw Blood Ulmer there. It was great. Similar to The Stone in SF. Basically a bar with a big empty room like a dance hall. They both tended to have acts that were either on the way up or the way down or stuck in a holding pattern. Santa Monica and the west side had a similar room or two. And a few sort of groovy bigger restaurants in more out lying areas that had a music policy on the weekends but that was sporadic as well. And of course The Roxy. The Troubador may have still been open. And McCabe's in Santa Monica for acoustic music. I saw Bola Sete there. And whatever hole in the walls in beach areas. And a few odds and ends. So LA had less club action than you might think for a major city with a big music industry. No Village Vanguards. Although I may be well missing a lot of things. I'd be curious if there's now any legit Jazz clubs like Yoshi's in SF or the NYC joints. I can't see Pat Martino recording live at an LA club but hopefully I'm wrong.
    Last edited by mrcee; 12-15-2015 at 05:56 PM.

  39. #38

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    I'd love to get a janitor job out there somewhere. LA, Ventura, Oxnard or something.

  40. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I hear ya I grew up there and want out, but need to find an affordable place that has some Jazz going on.
    'Affordable' and 'jazz' might not go together.

    I want to go to Barbados for some reason. It's the same size as Milwaukee but it's not Milwaukee. I liked St. Martin. The music was nice. They just get the drum machine going and go for it.
    Americans need to get hip. They make everything so complicated.
    This singer on the street was funny. He had a big crowd, performing in front of a restaurant. He'd point at people and say where they're from. He pointed right at me and said- Wisconsin!! I looked behind me I'm thinking huh? Is it that obvious?

  41. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    'Affordable' and 'jazz' might not go together.

    I want to go to Barbados for some reason. It's the same size as Milwaukee but it's not Milwaukee. I liked St. Martin. The music was nice. They just get the drum machine going and go for it.
    Americans need to get hip. They make everything so complicated.
    This singer on the street was funny. He had a big crowd, performing in front of a restaurant. He'd point at people and say where they're from. He pointed right at me and said- Wisconsin!! I looked behind me I'm thinking huh? Is it that obvious?
    I won't imagine Barbados being inexpensive unless a local. You want to close to the city not in to to save money. In L.A. that traditionally has been the SF Valley. I've been looking at places like Eugene OR, Buffalo NY, cities around Portland OR, Providence RI, Kansas City MO its a balancing act trying to find affordable and some Jazz even if just locals, but be nice if name artists came thru now and then.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  42. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I won't imagine Barbados being inexpensive unless a local. You want to close to the city not in to to save money. In L.A. that traditionally has been the SF Valley. I've been looking at places like Eugene OR, Buffalo NY, cities around Portland OR, Providence RI, Kansas City MO its a balancing act trying to find affordable and some Jazz even if just locals, but be nice if name artists came thru now and then.
    Buffalo has some good points. For me it's not good. It's a family thing.
    I'd say it's a fusion town musically. There have always been good players there with solid fans. This is a band named Gamelon. Excellent guitar player named George Puelo. he's on the black strat. Go to about 4 minutes in and they start tearing it up;


    Last edited by Stevebol; 12-16-2015 at 01:07 AM.

  43. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by docbop View Post
    I won't imagine Barbados being inexpensive unless a local. You want to close to the city not in to to save money. In L.A. that traditionally has been the SF Valley. I've been looking at places like Eugene OR, Buffalo NY, cities around Portland OR, Providence RI, Kansas City MO its a balancing act trying to find affordable and some Jazz even if just locals, but be nice if name artists came thru now and then.
    If you believe in drugs Buffalo might be the place for you.
    I got to know my long lost relatives last spring when we went on a cruise. My sister-in-law said to me- we believe in drugs. I thought yeah I knew that.
    I don't know if you remember Rick James out there in LA. Rick was Buffalo.

  44. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stevebol View Post
    If you believe in drugs Buffalo might be the place for you.
    I got to know my long lost relatives last spring when we went on a cruise. My sister-in-law said to me- we believe in drugs. I thought yeah I knew that.
    I don't know if you remember Rick James out there in LA. Rick was Buffalo.

    Buffalo used to be called the little Chicago and a lot of musicians there. Talking to people there still is a lot of music there, but winter is tough so that's has to factor in at my age. I know a lot of musicians like Eugene OR, but most are rock/blues players, but appears there's some Jazz too. I used to live in Boston and liked it there, but it now one of the most expensive cities rent wise, but that's why Providence RI is interesting it only an hour drive to Boston and a train ride to NYC. Portland has lots of music, but some say the city is changing a lot, but they have good transit system so living outside the city is possible. Then Vancouver WA is across the bridge from Portland, but traffic can be bad and many say Vancouver is a stepford wives like place. Kansas City has lots of music and looking cost of living isn't bad, but your right in the middle of tornado alley. Santa Cruz was real nice place to live, but rents are high and affordable places are in not so nice part of town. Oakland is similar story as Santa Cruz. I'd really like to get out of California the whole state is expensive in general.

    So the search goes on and knowing me one day I will just say screw it pick up and go it won't be the first time.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  45. #44

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    It's can be tough... I blew out of Cali almost 10 years ago. I got some peeps in Oregon and spent a bit over a year there. Got good friends, one an excellent bass player with a botique bass company, in Portland. Vancouver, WA as well.
    I can't really say much about the area one way or the other. It seems kinda like Cali North to me. And the rain?
    fuggedaf**kinboutit.

    I've been in Texas since 2007. San Antonio and Houston. Affordable and jobs with plenty of elbow room but not everyone's cup of tea. Works for me though. No music that I'm into to speak of. The much touted Austin (stupid traffic and getting expensive) scene has been described as "all the music from A to C". This is coming from a misanthropic geriatric jazz fan (seen Coltrane and Monk etc) friend of mine so should be taken with some grains of salt. I could be wrong but I don't think Pat Martino plays there. My sense of it is that it's not much of a jazz town. They say San Antonio is more so but I didn't see it. Just one big C&W place the size of a Walmart with New Country. It looked like a
    Cracker Barrel restaurant on major steroids. I'm not counting the few odds and ends. Very little Mom and Pop retail action of any type in Texas cities except a bit in Austin. A couple of small independent music stores here and there. But mostly all big corporate Toys R Us type action. Jewelry stores the size of a Toys R Us with 10 ft. Rolex signs. You get out of town into the country though and it's sweet and goes on for ever. Maybe it's time for everyone to chip in and set up a Jazzville on the outskirts of town. A kinder and friendlier Jonestown where disenfranchised jazz people can jam and sip the jazz Kool Aid. The house band could be called The Zombie Apocalypse Band. Kind of like one of the Fun Camps they're supposedly planning. Maybe there's some federal grant money available.

    So I've got my woodshed in San Miguel de Allende, Mexico a 12 hr drive south of the border and I can practice 12 hrs/day if my fretting hand would tolerate it. Living on 500/m. Probably could do it on 400 if I really went monastic. . Hopefully I'll get some chances to sit in a bit here and there. The danger element in Mexico is over stated (very safe where I'm at) although some parts of the country are a little iffy but there's places in the States that you don't want to be in after 4 in the afternoon. And imo Mexico has never been a particularly safe country even back when they were slaughtering virgins on top of the pyramids.

    I'm kinda over Cali. I can remember the good old days too clearly. I don't know much about Oxnard and Ventura these days but it could maybe work. There's always Bakersfield but even that's changing. Mays well be in Texas except that Texas is better. Sure, if I had my druthers and some heavy jingle in my jeans I'd live in LA by the beach, but welcome to the real world.//////
    Last edited by mrcee; 12-16-2015 at 10:14 AM.

  46. #45

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    After living in the desert no Texas or south for me in general, I want green. I heard there is a nano sized Jazz scene in Boise Idaho. I think any college town should have some music scene going on and some culture.

    I've had friends that lived in Mexico a long time and loved it. There's a Jazz piano player over at freejazzinstitute.com he retired and moved to Mexico awhile back and appears to love it.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  47. #46

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    There's actually maybe a nano sized jazz scene almost everywhere these days which is a good thing for what it's worth. There could be a country band or 2 on Cape Cod. And a southern gospel band in Aleppo. *wwelll.....probably not* It's a new world (dis)order. anyway. Boise could well have on a per capita basis as much of a jazz "scene" as what I saw in LA in the 70s and 80s.

    btw is there a or any first rate jazz club in LA today that features/specializes in internationally known big name straight ahead non fusion headliner jazz artists as their policy on a weekly basis? Players like McCoy Tyner. World renowned players that have little or no pop or fusion angles. A club like Yoshi's or the Iridium. You know. A real Jazz Club like the Vanguard. (Maybe The Lighthouse was the last one, huh?) Not someplace that presents a mixed bag of acts with the occasional Scofield or Mike Stern thrown in. Or a smaller local venue that may have the occasional second tier artist who just happens to be in town and is looking for something to do and pick up a couple of 100 extra bucks. What about Portland? Houston sure doesn't.

    Mexico is ok, Not Paris in the 50s. But for me it's a workable woodshed. At this point in my life I could be anywhere if I was comfortable and spoke the language. There's a yearly jazz festival in my town which I haven't gone to yet. The past couple of years have had Paul McCandless and Tuck and Patti as headliners. I think Mike Stern as well one year. Pat Martino was here not too long ago doing some teaching in MX City at a place called Fermata. I know someone who saw him play in Cancun of all places. He made a big impression.
    Last edited by mrcee; 12-16-2015 at 09:46 AM.

  48. #47

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    I wouldn't recommend Milwaukee for jazz. If you like to hear jazz way too loud, no dynamics and all Bird phrases then Milwaukee might be for you. Otherwise skip it.
    I think it's odd that old R&B is very popular in LA but not NYC. Those are two jazz hot-spots though.
    Here's my prediction for what it's worth- the popularity of old rock and old R&B is going to spread. The reason is that the big 3- rap, country and edm are getting weak. Rap beats especially aren't good these days. The only reason the big 3 are popular is because they're easy to dance to.
    It's about jobs. Old school music can create them. Here's my thing- use a drum machine or drum tracks for old school R&B. You'll never get tight with a real drummer. It takes too long.
    Jazz musicians tend to have a good ear for vocals and that's what it comes down to.
    Start creating some jobs. People might be getting sick of canned music.
    Too bad old-timers into jazz don't have some hot spots. Mid-sized cities where we can congregate. We could start a rumor about some place.
    It has to be warm for me.
    We need our AARP music!

  49. #48

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    I'm with you on the drum machine. Back in the late 80s in Berkeley, CA. I saw a first rate Caribbean show at a good theater. They had a great West Indian band from NYC backing up several top Southern Caribbean singers. (There were theater seats but everyone was standing doing their thing). Each doing a short set. Singers like Crazy and The Mighty Sparrow. Plenty of pieces. At least one keyboard, a horn or 2, percussion maybe plus the usual stuff BUT they had no traps drummer just programmed tracks. I'm observant and I didn't even realize it until half way through the second number. It was a big theater and the stage was fairly crowded so it wasn't visually that clear as well. The whole show was great. This was Soca (short for Soul Calypso) music. I'll bet everyone on this forum is familiar with it. Hot Hot Hot by Arrow crossed over back in the day. This type of music is really just modern Calypso and relates to it the way Funk and Disco relate to classic R&B. imo..It's fundamentally similar, and often played by the same musicians for the same audience. Soca doesn't use steel drums if rarely and is synth, DX7, heavy. With the sitar patch. The guitar rhythm is very difficult for non Caribbean players and is almost never gotten right. Physically demanding as well because the left hand is constantly engaged playing full major triads, not a lot of 7ths, up the neck and has no time to rest. Not much muting and nano rests between beats. Lots of 4 fret C maj position inside chords. What the Country guys call a chicken claw fingering. And the right hand strum is super fast and loose. A lot of the Jimmy Nolen type guys can't even get it. Reggae is child's play, comparatively. A lot of the reggae guys don't like it and disparage it as Jump Up music.

    Any way long story short imo modern funky dance music doesn't really need a traps. A good one's always a plus though. Even just a kick, snare and hi-hat to give it some human input.

    Here's a tune from a few years back. about 25 to be exact. A slightly different style from straight soca.


  50. #49

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    For me L.A. isn't a real Jazz hotsptot (oh I can feel the villagers lighting there torches) the Jazz that's here is so laid back and perfect chops the real Jazz attitude isn't there. L.A. musically was always the technically great town compared to NYC the place with the attitude and soulful players. I still remember the first time I heard NYC jazz in L.A. it was Woody Shaw and it was like fire was blowing out of there instruments, veins popping out, and when not soloing they were watching to focusing on whoever was. I'd watched in L.A. clubs Jazz players leave the stage when not soloing, talk to audience members by the stage, trying to get waitress to order more drinks. The treat gigs more like day job than playing art of Jazz.


    This is one of those threads I've written four replies and deleted them, I don't want to want walk out of my apartment and hear a sniper rack his rifle. This is how I feel and I know others will disagree and express should yourself. I did write about it and delete, but I did recently go to concert here with a burning NYC sax player, I was totally depress when he played a laidback L.A. style show, so it still goes on.
    No, I'm not going to give you the answer to your question. I don't want to deny you the pleasure you'll receive when you figure it out yourself. -- Bill Evans talking to his brother.

  51. #50

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    That sounds like very unprofessional behavior.
    Is it just NYC and NOLA now for jazz?

    I can understand if you're a native Californian why you might want to bail but it's a wasteland in most other places. We can't all live in NYC.