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  1. #1

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    We previously tackled You Go to My Head (in Jun 2011), There Will Never Be Another You (in Feb 2016), and Georgia on My Mind (in both Jul 2014 and Aug 2016), so ...

    Our standard for Apr 2019 will be Satin Doll (music attributed to Duke Ellington & Billy Strayhorn, lyrics to Johnny Mercer - 1953).

    I found this bizarre: Ted Gioia notes in his book The Jazz Standards that the week Ellington recorded Satin Doll "the number one song in America was 'The Doggie in the Window,' sung by Patti Page." There's no accounting for taste, folks.

    Background:
    Jazz Standards Songs and Instrumentals (Satin Doll)

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    Hello there.

    I'll kick-off this time with a recording from a while ago.
    Maybe until the end of the month I'll record a new take to see how much I improved in 6 months.


  4. #3

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    oh wow, interesting - i have been looking at the Jens Larsen webpage- he did a recent video on Barney Kessel and satin doll. just printed off the solo

  5. #4

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    We did YGTMH in 2011? So we're doing Satin Doll? Again?

    This is an April Fool's joke. Got to be!

  6. #5

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  7. #6

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    Sounds great Kris! The tele?

    Rag, see, you made the best of it

    It's not a terrible song...I guess...

    I'll do one, what the hell.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  8. #7

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    Ok, had 2 beers on an empty stomach and away we go...I think this is called "dicking around."

    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  9. #8

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    Kris,

    Really nice version. Thanks for posting.

  10. #9

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    Jeff -

    Heh heh :-) I like the way it went fuzzy in the middle... smiled all the way through

  11. #10

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    I just banged this out today as I was playing with a 1960's vintage Silvertone 1484 Twin-Twelve head, played through the 2 10" speakers in the cab of my Yamaha G100-210. This is a solo by Robert Conti followed by the head pounded out in a pretty ordinary chord-melody fashion.

    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    I just banged this out today as I was playing with a 1960's vintage Silvertone 1484 Twin-Twelve head, played through the 2 10" speakers in the cab of my Yamaha G100-210. This is a solo by Robert Conti followed by the head pounded out in a pretty ordinary chord-melody fashion.

    that amp sounds great.

    as usual, the part that's you is fun and swinging and totally in pocket, and the Conti bit is stiff and lame.

    lets hear more YOU.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    ... This is a solo by Robert Conti followed by the head pounded out in a pretty ordinary chord-melody fashion. ...
    From couple of your recent postings, seems you are developing some serious chops. I think above take would benefit from slower tempo.
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  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    Thanks Jeff,
    I did this recording with my Hamadyk hollow guitar.
    Actually I use tune-o matic bridge with ebony base and trapeze metal tailpiece on it.
    These things make more sustain...I think.
    Best
    Kris
    Yeah, it has great sustain. I think it helps that you seem to have a nice light touch as well. Great playing.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by clebergf View Post
    Hello there.

    I'll kick-off this time with a recording from a while ago.
    Maybe until the end of the month I'll record a new take to see how much I improved in 6 months.

    Sounding pretty good already, I'd say! I agree with Kris, do another take and compare...video is a great way to gauge progress.

    By the way, is that your Kingpin's unplugged sound? I thought mine was loud and good sounding, but yours is even better...what strings/gauge?
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  16. #15

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    I've been working on this tune lately and discovered a few good resources in my library that be in yours too? I forget all the stuff I have on my book shelf sometimes.

    Greg Fishman's Jazz Guitar Etudes has one based on Satin Doll changes which has some nice lines...off the the top of my head...Rush Street may be the etude's title.

    Wolf Marshall has a book called "Best of Jazz Guitar" that has among other things Satin Doll transcriptions by Howard Roberts and Joe Pass.

    Wolf is apparently an interesting fellow...google search reveals he was a big hair metal ooking dude back then yet it is he actually playing the solos on the accompanying CD to the above mentioned book and he sounds great.....really good...nails Hall's St. Thomas among other things.

  17. #16

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    Great versions there kris, ragman, mr. beaumont and lawson-stone.

    Yes kris, I'll record another take amplified and with a rhythm guitar backing tracking.

    Hey mr. beaumont, thank you.
    Yeah, it's the acoustic sound. I don't remember if I was using Martin monel or D'addario pure nickel when I recorded this video, because I changed from Martin to D'addario a few months ago, but I'm sure that is 0.12. This is an incredible guitar.

  18. #17

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    It’s a catchy tune, but I’ve never found it too inspiring for melodic improvising. I feel like the melody and changes are dragging me around too much. I’ve been trying though.
    Here’s a medium swing take, a bit sloppy.

    And a slow one that I actually recorded just before the previous one.

    When I feel trapped by a swing tune it sometimes helps to switch to a latin feel. If I come up with anything interesting I’ll record that too.
    Last edited by KirkP; 04-10-2019 at 05:04 PM.

  19. #18

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    Thanks, Kirk, great fun :-)

    beep!

  20. #19

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    Satin Doll, HM rhythm guitar/ chord melody on unplugged Telecaster Squier MIJ E6

    If you say you like it, I can record it with backing track?
    AI think I deserve some credit for not naming it Satan Droll, or something similarly obvious ...

    Turn the volume down, it is unplugged, but still too loud!!!

    Click on photo will redirect you to blog post:

    ^ ^ ^
    <<< My BlogSpot Page >>>
    v v v

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan View Post
    Satin Doll, HM rhythm guitar/ chord melody on unplugged Telecaster Squier MIJ E6

    If you say you like it, I can record it with backing track?
    AI think I deserve some credit for not naming it Satan Droll, or something similarly obvious ...

    Turn the volume down, it is unplugged, but still too loud!!!

    Click on photo will redirect you to blog post:

    I liked it, it's something like Satin on the water.

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    more Satin under water...
    Why you have to post rude comments all the time? Keep it to yourself.
    White belt
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  23. #22

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    Ah, Kris and Vladan have been going at it forever...I think they both kinda enjoy the back and forth...
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  24. #23

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    oh okay, i just noticed unkind comments to rags as well...though I don't think he's sensitive. I'd take it to heart probably.
    White belt
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  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    all the time?
    It was a joke man!!!!!
    not every post but often enough that i noticed. if it's just banter between friends, i was wrong sorry man. I'm not here often enough to know whos friends with who, i tend to but in when it comes to bullying. my bad
    White belt
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  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    I do not coment rags...sorry.
    All coments here are positive.
    Best
    Kris
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  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    not every post but often enough that i noticed. if it's just banter between friends, i was wrong sorry man. I'm not here often enough to know whos friends with who, i tend to but in when it comes to bullying. my bad
    Taking a quick scan through the last few weeks of Kris’s replies, nothing jumps out as inappropriate. Some people do have a bit more edgy humor than others.

  28. #27

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    that's cool, i mean i apologized. i'll just go fuck myself now haha
    White belt
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  29. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by kris View Post
    more Satin under water...
    Why you have to post rude comments all the time? Keep it to yourself. .
    Joe, thank you for it seems that comment was removed n the meantime, so I would not see it without your quote.
    Have to admit, rally funny one, LOL, and still laughing. Sincerely.

    And do not let Kris worry you, he is good guy. Kind of.
    ^ ^ ^
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  30. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by clebergf View Post
    I liked it, it's something like Satin on the water.
    Are you sure?
    I am not (sure) I'd really to record it with backing track (which is more of Enter Sandman).
    ^ ^ ^
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  31. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan View Post
    Are you sure?
    I am not (sure) I'd really to record it with backing track (which is more of Enter Sandman).
    Yeah, mean. It's a different version in a way that I enjoyed. I think that with the guitar plugged and a "band" it would be sound very nice.
    Last edited by clebergf; 04-16-2019 at 08:13 PM.

  32. #31

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    I think kris was just referring to the recording sound, it does have artefacts which sound a bit ‘underwater’. My son’s laptop sounded just like this when he recorded something with it, eventually we found that turning off the default ‘noise reduction’ in the laptop’s sound properties got rid of the weird artefacts, then he was able to get a much better recording.

  33. #32

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    This is one of my favorite versions for this song.
    Soon I'll post another take.



  34. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop View Post
    I think kris was just referring to the recording sound, it does have artefacts which sound a bit ‘underwater’.
    Basically, that is how I understood it. It does not matter any more, since Kris have left the forum. I really do not think anything that was said in this topic provoked his reaction. Probably someone said something else, elsewhere.
    We can only respect his decision and hope for comeback.

    Quote Originally Posted by grahambop View Post
    My son’s laptop sounded just like this when he recorded something with it, eventually we found that turning off the default ‘noise reduction’ in the laptop’s sound properties got rid of the weird artefacts, then he was able to get a much better recording.
    I have heard such recordings.

    However, my laptop does not sound like that on it's own and there is no default noise reduction. There is load of hiss, though.
    Good part of underwater artefacts are due noise reduction, which I applied purposely and intentionally. They are even more exaggerated due compression and limiting. And there is more.
    In fact this recording was much more elaborate and complicated than you might assume.

    Whatever they are, I decided they are what I want in my recording. Ie. I think it is better with them, than without. I do not find them weird.

    No hard feelings. This was just to clarify that we do not agree on standards of what is better recording.
    ^ ^ ^
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  35. #34

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    I keep checking out the Practical Standard thread hoping it comes back to life but I guess that's not going to happen. Another good player gone. A year ago this thread and the Chord Melody thread were the hot thing. Lots of good players sharing. Now.......well, you can see for yourselves.

    Sigh.

  36. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramps View Post
    I keep checking out the Practical Standard thread hoping it comes back to life but I guess that's not going to happen.
    post a take grandpa
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  37. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    post a take grandpa
    I quit posting when I realised that I wasn't getting any feedback that would help my path of learning more about jazz.

    I don't post for vanity. When I posted I hoped to get some pointers from better players about what I could work on to improve. People were polite and complimented me but that doesn't help my musical journey.

    This thread is pretty much dead in comparison to what is was. It's, at best, on life support and having me post won't help it.

    OTOH, I guess you guys are getting something out of it so carry on and good luck on your musical journey's.

  38. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramps View Post
    I quit posting when I realised that I wasn't getting any feedback that would help my path of learning more about jazz.

    I don't post for vanity. When I posted I hoped to get some pointers from better players about what I could work on to improve. People were polite and complimented me but that doesn't help my musical journey.
    That probably sums up why it's on life support. I got good positive feedback, and a couple pointers and that was nice in the solo guitar thread. However I posted a single note take and got completely pimped, it wasn't useful at all. I decided not to post either.
    White belt
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  39. #38

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    A thread like this isn't the best environment for real criticism or advice, there's just too much going on.

    I post here because I think it's fun to listen to multiple players take on the same tune (it's why I like jam of the week on Facebook too)

    I think if you really want constructive criticism, start your own thread and be specific in the OP that you're looking for that...

    I'll always offer unsolicited compliments, but not unsolicited criticism...
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  40. #39

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    I do not mind if someone tells me how much he did not like my playing, or my musical idea. No need for explanation. Not liking something is perfectly OK, as well as letting other people know about it.

    Only if you qualify something as bad, or good, you should provide an explanation. When you do it, you should stay open for an answer.

    It is not really possible to give bad critique on someones musical ideas. It is down to taste and intention.
    It's somewhat easier to point onto technicalities.

    You can always say ... if you want to sound that chord cleaner, you should press strings harder ... tilt your wrist, so not to hit unwanted strings ...

    You can not say ... what you played was wrong, play this correct thing instead ... your sound is bad, do it like this and it will be better ... that fingering is not Jazz ... and alike ...

    The way out could be to ask a question.

    For example:
    ... at that moment, minute:second, what was the idea for playing what you played? To me, it sounded odd. I would do it differently did you try playing this and that ... I find leaving ringing notes of previous chord, over the next, sound tensed, was it intentional ...

    Then you can expect an answer like: ... I did it because I think it sounds OK, as well as the theory says ... something ...

    However, it would require to pay attention and listen carefully.
    ^ ^ ^
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  41. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan View Post
    I do not mind if someone tells me how much he did not like my playing, or my musical idea. No need for explanation. Not liking something is perfectly OK, as well as letting other people know about it.

    Only if you qualify something as bad, or good, you should provide an explanation. When you do it, you should stay open for an answer.

    It is not really possible to give bad critique on someones musical ideas. It is down to taste and intention.
    It's somewhat easier to point onto technicalities.

    You can always say ... if you want to sound that chord cleaner, you should press strings harder ... tilt your wrist, so not to hit unwanted strings ...

    You can not say ... what you played was wrong, play this correct thing instead ... your sound is bad, do it like this and it will be better ... that fingering is not Jazz ... and alike ...

    The way out could be to ask a question.

    For example:
    ... at that moment, minute:second, what what was the idea for playing what you played? To me, it sounded odd. I would do it differently. I would play this and that ... leaving ringing notes of previous chord, over the next sound tensed, was it intentional ...

    Then you can expect an answer like: ... I did it because I think it sounds OK, as well as the theory says ... something ...

    However, it would require to pay attention and listen carefully.
    There's a graceful and non-graceful way to offer criticism. What I got was pretty mean (you never should have posted this for example). Your examples are fine. But I agree with Beaumaster in that I only critique those who ask for it
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  42. #41

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    Here's what I got flamed for. Sure, tell me it need more interest, tell me it's too slow, even tell me it's boring; but don't tell me I should never have posted it and it's awful. awful is a strong word for someone trying something new to hear (I'm a solo guitarist mostly)
    White belt
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  43. #42

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    People have various reasons for posting their playing, some looking for tips & criticism, others looking for encouragement & motivation. It’s also interesting to compare various approaches to a tune. In general, if someone doesn’t ask for criticism I try to resist offering it. But if something particularly interests me in someone else’s recording I try to comment on it. If others do ask for criticism I try to offer something helpful. It helps if they are specific about what aspect of their playing they are seeking comments on.

    I post recordings mostly as a motivator. If the tune of the month interests me I’ll work on it a bit to see if I can come up with something a little interesting. Usually I know the faults, so I don’t ask for criticism.
    Last edited by KirkP; 04-17-2019 at 10:40 AM.

  44. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramps View Post
    I quit posting when I realised that I wasn't getting any feedback that would help my path of learning more about jazz.

    I don't post for vanity. When I posted I hoped to get some pointers from better players about what I could work on to improve. People were polite and complimented me but that doesn't help my musical journey.

    This thread is pretty much dead in comparison to what is was. It's, at best, on life support and having me post won't help it.

    OTOH, I guess you guys are getting something out of it so carry on and good luck on your musical journey's.
    Actually no feedback is a kind of feedback itself in some ways. But also, the idea that posting "for vanity" is a bad thing is questionable. I rarely get to play for anyone other than my wife at home, who suffers through it all. Periodically maintenance staff in my building here me hacking through stuff in my office after hours when I'm working late.

    So posting here is, for me, not vanity, but simply taking a moment to play something for my friends. I don't expect them to oooh and aaah over it. I just hope they'll be glad I'm hanging in there, making progress, and having fun playing for them. Yes, I do love it when I get substantive feedback, which did happen here with me SD take on page 1. But even with no replies, I enjoy playing for my friends, and I hope I have a few friends, of a sort, on here.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  45. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    Actually no feedback is a kind of feedback itself in some ways. But also, the idea that posting "for vanity" is a bad thing is questionable. I rarely get to play for anyone other than my wife at home, who suffers through it all. Periodically maintenance staff in my building here me hacking through stuff in my office after hours when I'm working late.

    So posting here is, for me, not vanity, but simply taking a moment to play something for my friends. I don't expect them to oooh and aaah over it. I just hope they'll be glad I'm hanging in there, making progress, and having fun playing for them. Yes, I do love it when I get substantive feedback, which did happen here with me SD take on page 1. But even with no replies, I enjoy playing for my friends, and I hope I have a few friends, of a sort, on here.
    Great post, Lawson. I don't have any musical friends irl (thus I play mostly solo), and think of people here the same way (the nice ones). I consider you a musical friend most certainly
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  46. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Here's what I got flamed for. Sure, tell me it need more interest, tell me it's too slow, even tell me it's boring; but don't tell me I should never have posted it and it's awful. awful is a strong word for someone trying something new to hear (I'm a solo guitarist mostly)
    Who flamed you for that?

    I'm guessing someone who has never posted a single example of their playing. Cat types a good solo, though.
    Jeff Matz, Jazz Guitar:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/jeffreymatz

    "Jazz is like life...it goes on longer than you think, and as soon as you're like 'oh, I get it,' it ends."

    --The Ghost of Duke Ellington

  47. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr. beaumont View Post
    Who flamed you for that?

    I'm guessing someone who has never posted a single example of their playing. Cat types a good solo, though.
    good guess, but actually not in this case.
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  48. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Here's what I got flamed for. Sure, tell me it need more interest, tell me it's too slow, even tell me it's boring; but don't tell me I should never have posted it and it's awful. awful is a strong word for someone trying something new to hear (I'm a solo guitarist mostly)
    Joe, I can hear what you're working on in this clip and there is nothing in it that deserved flames.

    For me I've just about had it with jerk-offs on the web. All they need is an account and they're all of a sudden a pro.

    Lawson, I'm glad you post and enjoy posting. I've always liked your playing and can hear what you're working on when you play. Keep it up.

    Anyway, I'll be retiring next year and may feel different about posting but as of now I'm not getting anything from it and will wait in hopes that things change.

  49. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramps View Post
    \

    Anyway, I'll be retiring next year and may feel different about posting but as of now I'm not getting anything from it and will wait in hopes that things change.
    thanks gramps and I hope it does change because I liked your playing on the solo guitar thread.
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  50. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Here's what I got flamed for. Sure, tell me it need more interest, tell me it's too slow, even tell me it's boring; but don't tell me I should never have posted it and it's awful. awful is a strong word for someone trying something new to hear (I'm a solo guitarist mostly)
    Clearly you had not posted that clip as a bid to usurp Tal Farlow or Joe Pass, but as a serious stab at improvising over a ballad. I like to say that I don't make history, I just make music. Anybody who would tear you up over an effort like that is just full of themselves, or projecting some attitude onto you that was never there. It's also true some of the most gifted players are really horrible human beings with no idea how to relate to people!

    I'm brewing an effort on "There Will Never Be Another You" that will likely set a newly lowered bar on "entry level solo" efforts!
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  51. #50

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    It was me because I felt he could have done a thousand times better, and I still think that.

    I like Joe, it wasn't a put-down, it was a friendly comment made in a positively intentioned way. It also came at the start of a lengthy private video made especially for him about how to tackle the tune in a way he could do it. If you want, but only with his permission, I'll post it here and you may judge.

    As for multiple efforts, don't forget it was me, and pretty well only me at the time, who reinvented every tune we did, multiple times. It wasn't just one post after the other by me either. Practically nothing else was happening and there were respectable gaps between the postings. You know what happened and I withdrew. But we won't go over that again.

    One person, who left a long time ago, said he thought I was crowding other players out. I pointed out to him that there were no other players! That person was himself a very good player and, had he posted, would have got all the plaudits he deserved regardless of anybody else, especially me.

    So there it is... we are where we are now.