The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #26

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    Hey Heavyblues,

    The 6 on a major chord can be substituted for the 7 in any comping situation as long as it doesn't interfere with the melody line.

    The 6 has a more "mellow" sound than the 7th which can be used effectively in certain situations.

    MW

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

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    And sometimes it's even needed, if the melody is the root, you shouldn't comp with a maj7

  4. #28

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    ahh, thanks a lot guys. So If the melody has a lot of the root note in it, the 7th would clash with the root as it is a half step away, so 1-3-5-6 would be a better choice then?

    I can dig that

  5. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by heavyblues
    ahh, thanks a lot guys. So If the melody has a lot of the root note in it, the 7th would clash with the root as it is a half step away, so 1-3-5-6 would be a better choice then?

    I can dig that
    or even a b9 in some cases, and that gets worse.

  6. #30
    iwas here .Theory is so easy to the actual music,this is what I love.

  7. #31
    Stringbean Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by m78w
    There is a second part dealing with chords but it hasn't been put up on the site yet, I'm sure it'll be up shortly.

    Also yep it's in B.

    MW
    Thanks for the lesson. One question about this part:
    "Even though we do not have a root in our voicings, these two note chords outline the harmonic function of each chord.
    • The 3rd will tell us whether the chord is major or minor
    • The 7th will tell us whether the chord is major, dominant or minor seventh"
    Does this work because, we know the tune and our brains are sort of silently playing the roots?

  8. #32

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    It can work on this tune, or any other tune, because the root is "implied" like you said. Try it out with just a 2-5-1, or over a blues, it's surprising how well you can hear the chords move without using the roots, just the 3rds and 7ths.

    MW

  9. #33
    Stringbean Guest
    I see... when you say "hear the chords move" I get a better picture of what's going on. What comes before and after helps to establish those 3rds and 7ths. I tend to get a bit static when studying harmony.
    Last edited by Stringbean; 04-23-2009 at 02:32 PM.

  10. #34

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    These are great insights into playing over "Steps", MW. I find that I really need to keep working on my arpeggios and vertical cross-string playing as opposed to more horizontal approaches when I run across tunes like Giant Steps and these lessons lay it out well.

    It's a great deal of work, which is good. But I think I will set aside a few months to mastering just this material at some point. There are so many damned tunes to learn (or re-learn) for one thing.

  11. #35
    giant steps is easy to read but to memorize the ascending descending arps is really head banging then to recall the patterns as the music flows takes practice then the alt scale is starting to take effect but all and all push forward till it becomes second nature.thanks so much M.W./Dirk/franco/blackbirds/new strings.Richard

  12. #36

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    The only othet thing I could recommend on Giant Steps is to listen to the tune, espcially the original version, as much as you can. Eventually the sound of the changes (difficult as they are) gets embedded in your brain, just like a II-V-I pattern or any tune. This way, if you get lost or play something that just sounds wrong, you can always find you way back by ear.

  13. #37
    hi franco:got a book from a friend of mine who is also a musician by abersold/deals with coltrane changes going around the circle keeping melodic patterns within the changes chromatically.

  14. #38

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    Yeah, the Aebersold stuff is very good. There are usually backing tracks that go along with each "idea" or player, etc.. so you can also hear and play along. I know he has one on Giant Steps at different tempos, one on Two-Five-Ones In Giant Steps. I think he has another one (disk) on Coltrane Changes in different keys.

  15. #39
    Now that,s nowhere near a saxophone I can hear the guitar weaving through the pattern that sounds okay lots of tension The horns are hard to imitate with a guitar the musician playing a sax using his windpipe and pressure to blow notes is something hard to define as to the the guitar doing the same thing. rick

  16. #40

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    Just posted one harmonization of Giant Steps here...

    Pro Guitar Secrets: Giant Steps Harmonized for Solo Guitar

  17. #41
    Trying to get the drop2 and drop 3 chords into my bag then will attempt.The Coltrane classic. Thanks for the clear ideas.

  18. #42

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  19. #43

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    Yeah, but I don't like Giant Steps, nor the sound of Cotrane changes! It's just an exercise for chrissakes! Anyone would think you have to learn to slay over these changes in order to be considered a Jazz player. But I think you can give the whole Coltrane changes thing a miss and still play Jazz, even modern Jazz!

    You think I'm gonna spend 2 years learning how to go 1235 over Giant Steps, just so I can sound like every other schmuck doing the same thing, over a tune that no-one really likes?

  20. #44

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    I didn't like "Steps" either...

    Until I learned it. Then I realized its got a cool melody, its a hell of a lot of fun to play, and it responds really well to treatments other than an uptempo swinger.

  21. #45

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    Maybe, but Coltrane himself never played the tune live.... Anyway, there's a lot of music I "learned" to appreciate, even like, after much study. But these days I've decided life is too short to keep doing that! Now I've decided to just study what I like, not learn to like what I study - just because everybody else says you should.

    Hey, each to their own, but I bet you there's some novices interested in this thread that are starting to feel that Steps is essential learning. It is if you really like the sound of Coltrane changes, otherwise it may be enough to simply be aware of it and it's "questionable" significance. Maybe a good question to ask ourselves is "do my favourite improvisers or composers use these changes?" If the answer is no, then I'd suggest to move on, there's little to see here.... ?

  22. #46

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    When you've mastered playing over Coltrane changes, playing over normal changes becomes much easier, since it's much more melodically than intellecually based changes in more normal tunes. Playing Coltrane changes teaches one a bunch about triads, sequences and voice leading. And has anyone heard Rosenwinkel playing "26-2", Metheny's bossa "Giant Steps", Kreisbergs slow "Countdown" and Mehldau's over-the-top "Countdown"? This is beautiful music. Coltranes rendition of "Body and Soul" is amazing to me.

    Kreisberg often inserts Coltrane changes to standards - I'll be seeing you and All or nothing at all. A bit intellectual to my mind, but also creative.

    The original giant steps is very formulaic and not a personal favorite although impressive musicianship. Maybe not essential learning, but close to it in my book
    Last edited by yaclaus; 09-07-2014 at 11:40 AM.