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  1. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by kris
    OK...I always suggest playing with a feel of the blues .
    This is blues over In A Mellow Tone:
    Box
    Cool! Bluesy without any cliches.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronstuff
    Threw this together today! Didn't think about it too much, just trying to play the tune and keeping it mellow.

    Nice laid back feeling there!

    Quote Originally Posted by Triple_Jazz
    I think I like this song so much because it eludes me. Here’s a take with Mr. Sunnybass. Look forward to hearing yours!

    Fine - lots of variety. Hope you'll do another one.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Do we use them as crutches?
    One other question (for all of you to answer if you like): when does a "blues phrase" become a "jazz phrase" ?*



    *Disclaimer: not trying to start a heated discussion.
    I think it's kind of a stylistic thing—maybe the same phrases, but played differently. When I play blues, I am bending whole-steps or more, holding notes for durations of a half-note or more, vibrato-ing all over the place, etc. The sustain on archtop is pretty short, so when playing jazz blues, instead of holding a long note, I might busy it up a bit by playing a syncopated rhythmic figure over, say half a measure or more, but never straying from that pitch. I don't even think about it that stuff when playing blues blues because that's what I started out playing. (My other big influence was Jerry Garcia, whose blues playing is not great in my opinion, and to me, he is closer to a jazz player than a blues player.) Guitar players get thumped for playing "guitaristically", which is...kinda dumb? Do sax players ever get dinged for playing their sax like a sax? In less traditional settings than what we are doing here, I do like to bend notes that are coming from scales that aren't typically bent—bending the half-notes when playing a dorian sounding thing, etc.

  4. #28

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    Well, don't laugh, but I can't hear the blues in this. I've tried it several times and it's eluding me. Maybe I'm sickening for something :-)


  5. #29

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    Breaking ground on this tune, just trying to play something that makes the changes while I learn it.

    Observations, advice, feedback, appreciated.


  6. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronstuff
    Threw this together today! Didn't think about it too much, just trying to play the tune and keeping it mellow.

    Something about the time, the pace, and the phrasing here kept me off-balance in a great way, it created a kind of suspense that I enjoyed through the whole thing. I don't know if you were intending that, but your rhythmic phrasing really got me.

  7. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple_Jazz
    I think I like this song so much because it eludes me. Here’s a take with Mr. Sunnybass. Look forward to hearing yours!

    This was loaded with wonderful ideas and phrases. I think the tune eludes you because you are actually catching up to it and you have it worried. Looks like you got a good grasp on it.

  8. #32

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  9. #33

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  10. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Well, don't laugh, but I can't hear the blues in this. I've tried it several times and it's eluding me. Maybe I'm sickening for something :-)

    Sounds very nice and very different (in a good way) from how I would hear it.
    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Breaking ground on this tune, just trying to play something that makes the changes while I learn it.

    Observations, advice, feedback, appreciated.

    That's the type of melodies that seem to come naturally to me as well when I play this or similar progressions - nice!
    Great thumbnail btw!
    Last edited by TOMMO; 08-21-2021 at 02:28 AM.

  11. #35

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    Another nice one - I dig those bends!

  12. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Something about the time, the pace, and the phrasing here kept me off-balance in a great way, it created a kind of suspense that I enjoyed through the whole thing. I don't know if you were intending that, but your rhythmic phrasing really got me.
    Thanks Lawson, I’m not quite sure what I did differently though. Maybe the fact that backing track has no comping creates that effect? For sure there was lots of space with the slower tempo, and I was maybe starting phrases on different beats…

  13. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    This solo really sings. It's melodic flow is so strong, and to be simplistic about it, you hit all the "pretty" notes at all the right places, IMO. The bends and vibrato stike me as perfectly placed-reminders that hey, you're a guitarist and don't care if somebody knows it! You hit the changes but don't sound like you're just "making the changes."

    EDIT: I also enjoyed your free adaptation of the melody. I tried a little of that on "Road Song" but yours feels very solid and natural. You're clearly very comfortable in the changes and the melody.

    A whole other fun topic could be "How do you make a melody your own, freely adapting it, riffing on it, embellishing it, but still clearly keeping the melody's identity?" I think Joe Pass does it on this tune in the link upstream from this.

    And the tone is to die for. This is really a splendid solo. Maybe the best I've heard of yours, and the others were strong too.
    Last edited by lawson-stone; 08-21-2021 at 11:20 AM.

  14. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronstuff
    Thanks Lawson, I’m not quite sure what I did differently though. Maybe the fact that backing track has no comping creates that effect? For sure there was lots of space with the slower tempo, and I was maybe starting phrases on different beats…
    I just listened again. I think it's the slower tempo, and the very strong groove generated by the bass, which gives it such a powerful swing feel, and you really lean into that in the solo. At least that's how it seems. You milk that slower tempo and the space it gives you.

  15. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Sounds very nice and very different (in a good way) from how I would hear it.


    That's the type of melodies that seem to come naturally to me as well when I play this or similar progressions - nice!
    Great thumbnail btw!
    Ha! On archaeological digs, during breaks, we literally RUN for the wheel barrows, which are perfect recliners! I have a stack of pictures of myself and my friends nearly passed out in wheel barrows, which normally we use to move the dirt from the square, to the sifter, then the "empty" dirt goes to a dump.

  16. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Blues sounds in jazz a crutch? What nonsense is that?
    I apologize for perpetrating "nonsense" but maybe you have not heard as many mediocre players as I have. I've heard plenty of falling back on canned blues licks instead of digging into the harmony and melody of a jazz tune to find a fresh idea.

    You are fortunate to have never witnessed this, but I assure you it exists, and anything can become a crutch if we let it stop us from digging deeper into the music.

    Since I appear to be completely alone in this opinion, though, I will refrain from any further "nonsense" and leave musical judgments to the proper authorities.

  17. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    Ha! On archaeological digs, during breaks, we literally RUN for the wheel barrows, which are perfect recliners! I have a stack of pictures of myself and my friends nearly passed out in wheel barrows, which normally we use to move the dirt from the square, to the sifter, then the "empty" dirt goes to a dump.
    Ah - that's what it is!

  18. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by TOMMO
    Ah - that's what it is!
    The dreaded sift. It takes about a year to wash the dirt off from sifting.

    But I digress off topic...

    JGBE Virtual Jam (Round 32) - In a Mellow Tone-sift-1-jpgJGBE Virtual Jam (Round 32) - In a Mellow Tone-sift-2-jpg

  19. #43

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    Oh, let's have some fun, bearing in mind that weird is not necessarily jazz!


  20. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by ragman1
    Oh, let's have some fun, bearing in mind that weird is not necessarily jazz!

    I liked that a lot! You found some nice melodic ideas buried in that song.

  21. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    T

    A whole other fun topic could be "How do you make a melody your own, freely adapting it, riffing on it, embellishing it, but still clearly keeping the melody's identity?" I think Joe Pass does it on this tune in the link upstream from this.

    And the tone is to die for. This is really a splendid solo. Maybe the best I've heard of yours, and the others were strong too.
    Thank you so much for this.

    I tried it just playing the melody, but I thought it got thin or boring. Later, I heard other clips which punctuated the melody with chord stabs and I thought, I should have done that. But, I just started the solo early, without completely ignoring the melody. I don't know how that process works. I've played this tune a fair amount (including an arrangement based on the Ellis/Pass version I linked above), so I don't have to think too much, and I practice 7th arps more than other chord types for no good reason. This music is before my time, really, but I heard a lot of it when I was a kid, so maybe some stuck.

    I'm glad you liked the tone. In "grass is greener" tradition, I've been really admiring the tone that you and others get on archtops and thinking mine kind of sucks. But, I like the sustain of a semi or solid.

  22. #46

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    Ok, ill throw one in. Trying to stay mellow...after all, the tune IS called...

    Now ill take a listen to what you've all been up to


  23. #47

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    Ron. I like the bluesy quality and the chordal work.

    Triple. Really in the pocket. That sounds good as guitar trio because of the way you punctuated with chords. Very nicely done.

    Rag. Usual personal style/mood and intentionality. Every note sounds chosen.

    Lawson. I like the use of legato and the way you outlined the chords. Tone, as always, is a classic jazz guitar sound.

    Kris. I like the pocket and the tempo. The way you use chords (or a couple of lower notes) with variation in volume sounds like two guitars at times. Double time sounds great as do the more outside components. Fresh ideas throughout.

    Jeff. Your sense of melody evokes classic jazz lines in a way I wish I could access. Is that something you consciously worked on? A lot of transcription?
    For me, it seems like I hear what I hear and I can't easily extend my vocabulary. Often, I hear things I like, like your solo on Mellow, but I just can't summon those kinds of melodic statements. Any advice?

  24. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    Thank you so much for this.

    I tried it just playing the melody, but I thought it got thin or boring. Later, I heard other clips which punctuated the melody with chord stabs and I thought, I should have done that. But, I just started the solo early, without completely ignoring the melody. I don't know how that process works. I've played this tune a fair amount (including an arrangement based on the Ellis/Pass version I linked above), so I don't have to think too much, and I practice 7th arps more than other chord types for no good reason. This music is before my time, really, but I heard a lot of it when I was a kid, so maybe some stuck.

    I'm glad you liked the tone. In "grass is greener" tradition, I've been really admiring the tone that you and others get on archtops and thinking mine kind of sucks. But, I like the sustain of a semi or solid.
    I think your recorded tone on that clip is really good. You shouldn't feel like it falls short in any way. None of us are doing commercial CD tracks on these, but it's fun to get the best tone we can. You seem to have a solid recipe for yours.

  25. #49

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    Mello-tonin'!

  26. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
    Every note sounds chosen.
    Others have said that. Only in a sense. They're not literally chosen and deliberate one by one but they're safe within a deliberate format. For example, if I'm going to play Dm over G7 I know where on the neck to find it and out it comes.

    But every note willed and chosen? No. You couldn't play that way, it would be death. There has to be freedom but within logical constraints.