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  1. #1

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    I've loved this stuff for decades, but never really got around to playing it...though I do have a tenor banjo lying around.

    Anyway, learn your arpeggios, kids, then mess with them in a cool way:


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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    Great video!

    I've had the pleasure of playing string bass in a trad jazz band for the past 12 years. I was lucky to be given a break by some fabulous musicians when I was very green. I made up for my lack of experience by running the website and setting up the PA system as the majority of my bandmates were at a certain age....

    Hopefully we'll be back on the bandstand in the Spring.

  4. #3

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    Brilliant!

    That web-channel is one of my favourites on Youtube and that whole New Orleans style has become my go-to sound at the moment - recently I've bought quite a bit of material by Louis Armstrong and Sidney Bechet and have been watching YT videos of Mollie Reeves, who is such a great rhythm guitarist. This also dove-tails nicely with my on-going passion for Django.

    About six months ago, in the midst of lock-down (and prompted by a thread on here) I got out my 50 year old clarinet and my equally old A Tune A Day book and have been working hard on that. It's going well - although my recent "progression" to a #3 reed has slowed things down. One of the things I did was transcribe all four choruses of Evan Christopher's lesson on Careless Love from the Jazz at Lincoln Centre YT channel and learn to play them on the clarinet, then mix them up, cut a line from one chorus into another and so on. Great fun and it felt like I was actually playing jazz, albeit in a very old style. It's nice to be able to focus on rhythm guitar, too, with something else to play the melody.

    I also saw a post by Evan Christopher about playing in the New Orleans style in which he talks about melodic and rhythmic improvisation (rather than all that clever be-bop stuff) and this has led me to actually being able to improvise for the first time on the guitar, even if it's only on tunes like Careless Love and Battle Hymn of The Republic and The Saints.

    This also a great site for the style with some wonderful free material:

    Freebies

    I use the fakebook a lot and am currently working through the super Practical Guide.

    Derek

  5. #4

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    People talk about the ‘dialogue’ between the trumpet, clarinet and trombone but the truth is that Johnny Dodds just shreds on everything all the time

  6. #5

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    Talking of Johnny Dodds, here he is playing his Clarinet Wobble. What strikes me as funny is how Budd Scot has to play his guitar solo: all triple-forte down strokes, high action, as loud as he can play, and is just about heard. It's a rather odd solo too, but fascinating at the same time. I like these early guitar and banjo-guitar solos (St Cyr, etc) recorded before anyone knew what a ii/V/I lick was. In some ways they were more creative in their restrictions.


  7. #6

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    I'm really enjoying this music again. The last hour has been spent reorganising my library - finally getting it out of boxes after a recent house move - to the background accompaniment of Louis Armstrong's Hot Five. I felt like I was in a Woody Allen film...

    Now, I'll just reach to my right and pick up that tenor banjo...

  8. #7

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    I know this is probably long-known knowledge (and quite elementary) for alot of you here, but for me, a guy who's coming from a blues/rock background, that was eye-opening. I've listened to this music my whole life (my dad was a fan, and I and a HUGE Louis Armstrong fan), so I've HEARD this stuff for literally 51 years... but I've never heard it broken down like that. That was an indispensable education, in 5 minutes, for me.

  9. #8

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    Well, ruger, I'm glad I shared the video. I'd always heard a melody being played, and a bunch of guys (usually guys) playing supportive counterpoint with decoration of arpeggios. But it's more than that. They really are listening to each other intently, to the point that a simple melody and accompaniment doesn't cover it.

    To get a little of feel for it within the world you know well - blues and rock - just try playing chord tones of a 12-bar Blues, approaching some notes from a semitone below, or putting passing notes, occasional blues note or bend, without in any way making it sound like a solo. Take breaths, work on short phrases, etc. It's fun to try.

  10. #9

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    Trombone shred

  11. #10

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    Christian, try to keep the thread focussed on understanding collective improv for this period, not shredders!

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
    Well, ruger, I'm glad I shared the video. I'd always heard a melody being played, and a bunch of guys (usually guys) playing supportive counterpoint with decoration of arpeggios. But it's more than that. They really are listening to each other intently, to the point that a simple melody and accompaniment doesn't cover it.

    To get a little of feel for it within the world you know well - blues and rock - just try playing chord tones of a 12-bar Blues, approaching some notes from a semitone below, or putting passing notes, occasional blues note or bend, without in any way making it sound like a solo. Take breaths, work on short phrases, etc. It's fun to try.
    I was lucky enough to play with some great young players from New Orleans a while back including Aurora Nealand, and when they hit those ensembles it can be really spine tingling. I particularly like the slower minor tunes like St James infirmary and so on. There’s a sort of gothic quality to that music if that you don’t find in later jazz styles.

  13. #12

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    "Gothic quality" - I know exactly what you mean. Good phrase.

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
    Christian, try to keep the thread focussed on understanding collective improv for this period, not shredders!
    Everybody gets to shred at the same time! Saves time. Except the trumpet whose main job is to play the tune very loud because of all that flipping shredding that’s going on.

    there’s some interesting overlap with free jazz. Keith Tippett was a big fan of ensemble blowing.

  15. #14

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    BTW I think it is possible to hear echoes of the trad roles even in much later jazz. Thinking of the Miles quintet.

  16. #15

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    Also Paul Chambers is playing Sousa lines on the two feel tunes. Though that’s a whole other element; the brass bass; whether Sousa or bass saxophone.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
    Well, ruger, I'm glad I shared the video. I'd always heard a melody being played, and a bunch of guys (usually guys) playing supportive counterpoint with decoration of arpeggios. But it's more than that. They really are listening to each other intently, to the point that a simple melody and accompaniment doesn't cover it.

    To get a little of feel for it within the world you know well - blues and rock - just try playing chord tones of a 12-bar Blues, approaching some notes from a semitone below, or putting passing notes, occasional blues note or bend, without in any way making it sound like a solo. Take breaths, work on short phrases, etc. It's fun to try.
    yes, I have a looper pedal for exactly this, but for some reason I haven't used it much. I really need to....

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I was lucky enough to play with some great young players from New Orleans a while back including Aurora Nealand, and when they hit those ensembles it can be really spine tingling. I particularly like the slower minor tunes like St James infirmary and so on. There’s a sort of gothic quality to that music if that you don’t find in later jazz styles.
    I love me some Kenny Burrell and Johnny Smith, but my heart REALLY lies with the big bands and earlier. When I discovered Louis Armstrong in my 20s, it was a revelation. I've read Louis' 1st autobiography, and am currently working on his 2nd. Highly recommended... really illustrates the N.O. jazz world back then...

    Had I grown up a musician back then, I would have played clarinet, I have no doubt.

    Actually, I haven't listened to Louis in quite awhile.... been more focused on guitar players. It's time.

  19. #18

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    Hello central, what's the matter with this line?
    I wanna talk to that high brown of mine
    Tell me how long.... do I have to wait?
    Gimme two-ninety-eight.... why do you hesitate?

  20. #19

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    I love this music. It's still played in New Orleans, of course, and there's a worldwide appreciation of it.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    BTW I think it is possible to hear echoes of the trad roles even in much later jazz. Thinking of the Miles quintet.
    Definitely. How else can you explain Steve Lacy's quick transition from playing with Red Allen to recording with Cecil Taylor?

  22. #21

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    Well the free thing ... I know quite a few players who flip flop between early jazz and free.

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I was lucky enough to play with some great young players from New Orleans a while back including Aurora Nealand.
    name dropping again eh? Actually, I got to play with Aurora two summers ago in Switzerland. It’s interesting to reflect that a lot of the collective improvisation happening in some of the music from New Orleans really lends itself to playing in a more freer context also. Aurora led our group using conducting techniques that she called conduction, based on techniques pioneered by Butch Morris. It was a fascinating experience and a lot more coherent than sometimes is the case with spontaneously created ensemble music, which can sometimes be a bit hit or miss, at least in my limited experiences with it.
    ‘cheers!

  24. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzism
    name dropping again eh? Actually, I got to play with Aurora two summers ago in Switzerland. It’s interesting to reflect that a lot of the collective improvisation happening in some of the music from New Orleans really lends itself to playing in a more freer context also. Aurora led our group using conducting techniques that she called conduction, based on techniques pioneered by Butch Morris. It was a fascinating experience and a lot more coherent than sometimes is the case with spontaneously created ensemble music, which can sometimes be a bit hit or miss, at least in my limited experiences with it.
    ‘cheers!
    I’m not quite clear, was this New Orleans style jazz or non idiomatic improv?

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I’m not quite clear, was this New Orleans style jazz or non idiomatic improv?
    A little of each really. Mostly non idiomatic though, which contributed to my unease LOL.

  26. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzism
    A little of each really. Mostly non idiomatic though, which contributed to my unease LOL.
    That’s cool! I find non idiomatic improv incredibly difficult, but I always get something from the experience.

  27. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    BTW I think it is possible to hear echoes of the trad roles even in much later jazz. Thinking of the Miles quintet.
    And all OVER those great 50's Mingus records.

  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    I was lucky enough to play with some great young players from New Orleans a while back including Aurora Nealand, and when they hit those ensembles it can be really spine tingling. I particularly like the slower minor tunes like St James infirmary and so on. There’s a sort of gothic quality to that music if that you don’t find in later jazz styles.

    I'm with Rob, "Gothic quality" is a good phrase. I know what you mean. Southern literature has often been described as Gothic. (Of course, there's a lot of Gothic lit from distant shores: Rebecca, Dracula, Wuthering Heights, Frankenstein, Jekyll & Hyde...)

    So many of the songs are desperately sad and yet hearing them (played that way) makes them happy. Maybe Neil Diamond was right: "When you take the blues and make a song, you sing 'em out again."

  29. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77
    BTW I think it is possible to hear echoes of the trad roles even in much later jazz. Thinking of the Miles quintet.
    Ah Leu Cha

    John