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A few notes on Exercise 3.1:
1. The fingerings were new to me but I did my best to adhere to GF's format.
2. I struggled mightily getting around the Circle.
3. Lots of thinking required, which usually indicates the need for more practice.
4. As a learning exercise, I stated the chords (Maj7/Min7) after each phrase.
5. Backing Track: Band In A Box. BPM: 104
6. Next Steps: I plan to review starting at Chapter 2 before diving into Exercise 3.2.
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02-07-2020 12:53 AM
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Originally Posted by losaltosjoe
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Lovely job, losaltosjo. Very well played indeed.
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OK, here's my attempt at Ex. 3.1. I'm in two minds about how I'm doing. I think this sounds okay, but it's just a memory thing - a lick in different positions (and as my memory is so bad I still needed a hint sheet). I'm not applying any of the thinking that has been mentioned above in this thread. I'm not thinking major / minor triads, or anything other than this is a nice lick. So far, from this book, I've picked up that if I am faced with a Minor 7 chord I have a whole new way of playing over it that sounds really nice. And, of course, a way to do that playing. But it feels like I'm missing 99% of what I'm meant to be getting.
On the other hand, my new approach to learning jazz is to keep it simple, just to enjoy the sounds, and not to worry about the theory and all the clever stuff (yet). I need to learn melodies and get some jazz articulation in my playing. And from that perspective this is good stuff.
Maybe, in the future, a second go through the text will reveal all the stuff that I'm missing right now, and possibly then I'll be better positioned to understand and benefit from it.
Anyway, here's 3.1:
Cheers
Derek
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Well done, Derek!
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Originally Posted by digger
You certainly did that on that video. Great to hear the lines with the chords in the background, both coming thru really clear and pretty.
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Originally Posted by digger
Originally Posted by digger
Originally Posted by digger
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Originally Posted by Jehu
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Not to beat a dead horse; but this was something I didn’t feel was clear when I worked through this material last time.
In its basic form he suggests the collection of triads built on the vi chord over a tonic major and built on the ii chord over the subdominant/dominant. Right?
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I'm a little confused (as you'll all have seen, this isn't unusual) by that page 28/29 explanation.
If I'm not mistaken, the entire journey so far has been to show, theoretically and practically, how we can take (in this case) a D-7 triad, extend it diatonically upwards and find the D min7, F major, A minor, and then C major triads, and use these in our improvisations.
So where on earth has A minor suddenly appeared from as the basic triad from which we can build some further triads that will also work over Dmin7?
The text answers my question by, (I paraphrase) "Amin is one of the triads derived from the Dmin7, so that means you can use the extensions derived from Amin to play over Dmin7."
Does this mean we can take any of the extensions, e.g. F maj / A min / C maj, derive a new set of triads from them and use those as well?
Also, how does the 6th note fit in here? I understand that the 6th is the characteristic note of the Dorian mode (although what that phrase actually means in practice I have no idea). GF talks about accenting this sound by playing these Amin7 triads instead of the Dmin7th - but it still feels like we've gone off into a virtual book two by way of a minor comment.
Confused of Gloucester!
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Nice playing, digger!
Originally Posted by digger
There will be more of these substitutions as we go through the book, giving us maximize mileage from the same basic material. That's the beauty.
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Going back to the Gmin triad and its extensions it hasn't been specified that Gmin is the IImin of Fmaj but this will become clear when later in the book we will learn the extensions going down from Gmin - C7 and Emin7b5. In that context it makes perfect sense to play an Amin triad over a Dmin chord - same thing, just transposed up a perfect fifth. Hope that helps...
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One of the reasons I wanted to (and did) get a 5 string bass was the lower notes. For example, if the tonic is Eb, or any Eb chord for that matter, on a four string bass the lowest Eb just isn't that low. On a 5 string you've got the Eb an octave lower, same with the D, Db, C, and B an octave lower than on a 4 string bass. Pushed this accompainment all the way down to the lower D and C. Not sure you can hear those notes unless using headphones or better speakers (better than computer or phone speakers for instance).
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Originally Posted by TOMMO
Must confess, I'm struggling. I think the book is ahead of me. I thought it was building up to something, but more and more I'm thinking it is building on something. And the thing that it is building on, I don't yet have. Maybe I should have started my journey with a simpler book.
Not bailing just yet, though:-)
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Originally Posted by digger
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Yep, read through Chapter One. Still not making connections between the lower diatonic extensions of Dmin7 leading me to an Amin triad *. I'm getting Dmin7 then Bm7b5 then G7.
No worries, I'll take it a page at a time and I'm sure it'll all become a little clearer as I progress.
I think, overall, it's all about learning styles. I do prefer to learn from a book, but I'm also very logical and like to go A to B to C to D etc. The book, until page 28, does this really well. GF takes us by the hand and leads us through the theory and practicalities of these upper diatonic extensions. But suddenly, on page 28, he's adding in two extra things - one is the use of the extensions of an extension, and the other is the use of the Dorian mode in our solos. It just feels like we've gone A B C D G H I with an assumption that the student using the book is happy with steps E and F from previous studies.
But this morning I've been soloing over Hot Saw using the Dorian and the pattern we learned earlier in Chapter 3 and it's sounding nice (although a long way from inflicting it upon you good people, yet!), so all is good. :-)
* Edit - to the extensions of the Am triad I should say. I get where the Amin triad itself comes from.
Cheers
DerekLast edited by digger; 02-09-2020 at 11:50 AM.
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Originally Posted by digger
I get a bit confused about this material too. I think this is because I've encountered many approaches to playing jazz and they all use some different terms. My job is to integrate the material into something suitable for me.
The older I get the more I think 'finding one's voice' is a matter of cobbling together the bits and pieces of learning and experimenting and then getting them to (more or less) cohere. I'm not there yet but I'm far enough along to realize I can't start over with every new book: "Take what you need and leave the rest."
What I really like about Fewell's book is that although the fingerings seem awkward at times, I sense that he's making it so one can generate a lot of material from a few basic triads and extensions. In other words, I think what he's teaching will seem a lot simpler on the back end than it does on the front end. My two cents.
Don't bail! We need you.
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
I think the approach in this book gives one choices faciliating keeping it interesting as one takes a longer solo even over long streches of static chords like on So What. I really want to just be able to "go" and keep going, 5 minute solos?
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Originally Posted by MarkRhodes
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Originally Posted by fep
5 minute solos? Right now, getting off a solid chorus or two and ending well are where I've set my sights. ;o)
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Here's my first attempt at something on Hot Saw. I've pretty much stuck to the shapes / triads / licks we learned in Chapter Two and the beginning of Chapter Three. I've dealt with the Amin thing that I don't understand by simply avoiding it (not the Amin triad, that's in there, but the triads built from Amin), and I've not really done anything from the Dorian mode as GF suggests (although as far as I can tell everything we're doing comes from that mode). Anyway, I think this proves that I don't know the four shapes / licks well enough yet, but hopefully it shows promise...
For info, and credit where credit's due, the backing track comes from YouTube (Guitare Improvisation) with a few extra chords added.
Cheers
Derek
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starting late but interested in joining this group - I have the book and have been re-visiting it
the more i read along in this book I feel like I am getting slighly lost but after looking at it again - there really are not many concepts provided in the first 3 chapters, but I am just trying to keep them straight so I can use these in actual playing.
1) over a minor chord play a minor triad from the root and from the seventh play a major triad
example: Gmin can play a Gmin chord and Fmaj chord
2) over a minor chord play a triad from each chord tone
example: Gminor consisting of G, Bb, D, F (Gmin, Bb maj, Dmin, Fmaj)
3) for a major chord you can apply these same concepts from the relative minor
example: Gmin is the relative minor key to Bb maj, so over Bbmaj you can play the same chords from Gmin(Gmin, Bb maj, Dmin, Fmaj)
4) for a dorian minor (ii chord) you can play either the same triads derived in example 2 (over Gmin, Gmin, Bb maj, Dmin, Fmaj) or you can play triads derived from the fifth of the chord. for example for Gmin the fifth would be Dmin (Dmin, Fmaj, Amin, Cmaj)
5) Per page 33, over a dominant chord you can play a triad derived from the fifth of the dominant chord.
example: over C7 play Gmin. C7 = CEGBb. Gmin triad gives G Bb D (C79)
I only write this to see if I am interpreting all this information correctly and so I can keep everything straight. Of course the playing is what's important. Thanks all and I look forward to joining the group
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Originally Posted by wiscart1900
As for the minor chords, I think of it this way. (Not saying this is best or even that it's what GF is suggesting, but this is what seems most useful to me given what I've done before.)
I think of a minor 7 as a ii chord. (That's the default.) So if Gm7 is a ii, the I is F Major. F Major is also D min. D min is the vi of F major. C Major is the IV of F. So the four triads we have are: F, Gm, C and Dm. (The minor triad is a whole step up from a major triad.)
If that seems confusing, that's okay. There are other ways to internalize this and you will find one that suits you.
What I'm getting from Fewell's book is a way to organize the fretboard. (I was used to playing all the triads and 7th arpeggios in one position, not along the fretboard.)
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Originally Posted by digger
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A quick run through Ex 3.1:
Sonny S. -- Les Paul Player
Today, 04:18 AM in The Players