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  1. #241
    That Song never sounds really good to me even when Parker plays it..

    "Confirmation" much better Tune.

    Have I actually ' earned' the right to be this critical of
    one of the greatest Musicians of all time ?

    Heck no.
    Last edited by Robertkoa; 02-14-2018 at 06:28 PM.

  2. #242
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robertkoa View Post
    That Song never sounds really good to me even when Parker plays it..

    "Confirmation" much better Tune.
    I agree

  3. #243
    There is no Benson picking technique, according to George Benson. His secrets are in his left hand. Your right hand is sometimes working against you because the left does not follow the same rules.
    I hear a lot of short, interrupted lines. They are pretty good, but not connected. Try to practice longer lines, say, 4 note arpeggio + 4-8 note line or similar. I do this systematically for major, Mel.minor, h.minor and dom.diminished all over the neck. It takes time, but once you start this you can't stop it because benefits are visible very quickly.
    Second thing, your time feel is solid, but you are in only one rhythm trough out your solo. Try to begin with 1&3 feel (not 2&4) and then feel the boogaloo rhythm, or some Latino rhythms that are familiar to you while playing. But, don't make it obvious.
    Also, play your lines before the chord occurs, ahead of changes. It's tough in the beginning but it smoothes out quickly too. Actually, you do this sometimes, but not too often. Try too think about it in the beginning.

    Definitely didn't mean to sound harsh, sorry. I totally understand your position with kids.
    Also, your honesty and will to learn are nice primer and refreshing.

  4. #244
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    Try playing it with the metronome on 2 and 4

  5. #245
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    Haven't heard from Groynaid in a while...

    Actual 2 and 4 metronome thing, yeah, of course.... But one of the best exercises I have done and something that seems to help my students is counting the beat while they play.

    This is pretty tough for Parker heads, at least for me.

  6. #246
    Funny you should mention counting the beat.

    A drummer just gave me an exercise.

    Tap your foot in quarters and tap your hand in a samba or bossa pattern.

    This might be (eighths, I'm in 4/4) x0 x0 xx 0x / 0x 0x 0x x0.

    So your foot taps the first in each pair. x is a hit, 0 is a rest.

    Now, instead of tapping your foot, sing the quarters, but just a grunt, not actually saying the number.

    For some reason, it's much harder (for me and for everyone I've asked so far).

    I have the feeling that it would be good to be able to do this, but I'm not sure.
    Last edited by rpjazzguitar; 02-14-2018 at 08:01 PM.

  7. #247
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    Grunting is probably better than counting...

    Most people find it harder to vocalise the beat. I've taught this to a lot of students, including myself and everyone finds it a roast.

    Apart from this one guy, got it right away. Interestingly I noticed that he had a really good feel before I did the exercise with him. A rhythmic natural?

  8. #248
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar View Post
    This might be (eighths, I'm in 4/4) x0 x0 xx 0x / 0x 0x 0x x0.

    So your foot taps the first in each pair. x is a hit, 0 is a rest.

    Now, instead of tapping your foot, sing the quarters, but just a grunt, not actually saying the number.

    For some reason, it's much harder (for me and for everyone I've asked so far).

    I have the feeling that it would be good to be able to do this, but I'm not sure.
    I don't find this hard at all, at least not for couple of bars, but must say it does not sound like samba, or bossa, at all, the way I do it.
    Saying "boom" on beat, or counting 1 2 3 4, makes no difference, really,
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  9. #249
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    You might have above average rhythmic independence. My experience has been most find this type of exercise challenging.

  10. #250
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar View Post
    Funny you should mention counting the beat.

    A drummer just gave me an exercise.

    Tap your foot in quarters and tap your hand in a samba or bossa pattern.

    This might be (eighths, I'm in 4/4) x0 x0 xx 0x / 0x 0x 0x x0.

    So your foot taps the first in each pair. x is a hit, 0 is a rest.

    Now, instead of tapping your foot, sing the quarters, but just a grunt, not actually saying the number.

    For some reason, it's much harder (for me and for everyone I've asked so far).

    I have the feeling that it would be good to be able to do this, but I'm not sure.
    Reminds me of a similar Jean Michel Pilc exercise, although his has you tapping or clapping a swing ride pattern, ting tingting ting etc while singing the melody!

  11. #251
    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan View Post
    I don't find this hard at all, at least not for couple of bars, but must say it does not sound like samba, or bossa, at all, the way I do it.
    Saying "boom" on beat, or counting 1 2 3 4, makes no difference, really,


    That is a classic "tamborim" pattern for samba. There are a multitude of variations. A good tamborim player doesn't just play the one pattern. Rather they play around it, phrasing with it while doing variations.

    It is analogous to clave in salsa, although the tamborim pattern is more likely to turnaround than a salsa pattern. So, in tamborim, 3-2 may change to 2-3. As I understand salsa music (and I've only studied it a little bit), that's usually avoided.

  12. #252
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzism View Post
    Reminds me of a similar Jean Michel Pilc exercise, although his has you tapping or clapping a swing ride pattern, ting tingting ting etc while singing the melody!
    That sounds cool. Are there any links to this?

  13. #253
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    still sounding bad playing donna lee at tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar View Post
    That is a classic "tamborim" pattern for samba.
    ...
    It is analogous to clave in salsa,
    I have no doubt it is so.

    By that sentence, "... not sounding like ...", I tried to address the difference btw:
    1. play rhythm like this, on 0 say "boom", on x say "boom" and clap, ... or something like that ... (it will sound like clave in context).


    and

    2. Clap bossa clave while saing "boom" on beat.

    Unfortunately, seem to me, 1. Is the way musicians are being taught these days, since late 80s - early 90's, to produce something that unsuspecting audience will mistakenly take for music, for at least some time, however short that period might be, while 2. Is how the music loving audience hears it and would preffer it being played, if only there was anybody to actually play it that way ...

    ... but, I did not want to start that type of discussion .




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  14. #254
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    still sounding bad playing donna lee at tempo

    Quote Originally Posted by Vladan View Post
    I have no doubt it is so.

    By that sentence, "nit sounding like ...", I tried to address the difference btw:
    1. play rhythm like this, on 0 say "boom", on x say "boom" and clap, (it will sound like clave in context)

    and

    2. Clap bossa clave while saing "boom" on beat.

    Unfortunately, seem to me, 1. Is the way musicians are being taught these days, since late 80s - early 90's, to produce something that unsuspecting audience will mistakenly take for music, for at least some time, however short that period might be, while 2. Is how the music loving audience hears it and would preffer it played, if only there was anybody to actually play it that way ...

    ... but, I did not want to start that type of discussion .




    Sent from VladanMovies @ YouTube
    I came to that realisation earlier practicing that pattern. It can be a lot easier and more natural to think of two rhythms independently, the tamborim and the beat rather than how they line up on every beat.

    I think M-base’s teaching is based on this idea. Or so it seems.

  15. #255
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    I also think that realisation is kind of what the exercise is about...

  16. #256
    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77 View Post
    I also think that realisation is kind of what the exercise is about...
    I read somewhere about a UC Berkeley neuroscience class in which students learned to juggle.

    The idea was to demonstrate the brain making new connections.

    At first, juggling seems impossible. Then, fairly predictably, after a few days of practice, people are able to do it.

    I'm guessing that it is something that you don't forget, once learned.

    So, it occurred to me that there's a brain connection to be gained with this exercise. Although I suspect that much is true, I don't know that it will generalize to actually playing.

    The next step was to tap quarters, right foot, left foot, right hand, left hand while singing the tamborim pattern, Probably easier for a drummer, who is accustomed to thinking about such things, than for a non-drummer.

  17. #257
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar View Post
    ... The next step was to tap quarters, right foot, left foot, right hand, left hand while singing the tamborim pattern, Probably easier for a drummer, who is accustomed to thinking about such things, than for a non-drummer.
    The trick is to do it other way around, to vocalize steady pulse while playing rhythmical figures with your limbs.
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