Summer of Rhythm … Changes?

[charlieparker]

Oh no he done a vidoe

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That comping sounds sick!

[Christian Miller]

That comping sounds sick!

Thanks! I spent years playing for dancers, that stuff was my stock in trade.


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[Christian Miller]

There, finished it

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[pamosmusic]

Alright. I have not given this up, and plan to continue. I was out of town, then my wife was out of town, then a busy week, then a (very mild) case of COVID, and here I am.

We will resume.

[Christian Miller]

Alright. I have not given this up, and plan to continue. I was out of town, then my wife was out of town, then a busy week, then a (very mild) case of COVID, and here I am.

We will resume.

Ugh, hope you are feeling better.


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[charlieparker]

In between low back pain, I've been trying out some the changes Christian explicated in his video for Lester Leaps In.

Basically just used the major pentatonic over the A-section. I know it's painfully slow and the comping is shaky but thought I would share anyways.

Soloing over Lester Leaps In 80 bpm

[Christian Miller]

Blinking heck everyone’s in the wars


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[princeplanet]

I am back from a short vacation and will be resuming my rhythm changes journey.

I6 - I6 - I6 - I6
I7 - iv - I6 - V7

I'm all for simplifying, and there are many useful reductions that both yourself and others have suggested, but bar 6 (IV-iv) really needs the G somewhere in the first half of the bar and the Gb somewhere in the second half - or it doesn't make the most out of what makes that bar special.
In fact, it's what makes the whole tune special, so I feel it's worth splitting at least that one bar into IV to iv, some (if not most ) of the time.

[Christian Miller]

I'm all for simplifying, and there are many useful reductions that both yourself and others have suggested, but bar 6 (IV-iv) really needs the G somewhere in the first half of the bar and the Gb somewhere in the second half - or it doesn't make the most out of what makes that bar special.
In fact, it's what makes the whole tune special, so I feel it's worth splitting at least that one bar into IV to iv, some (if not most ) of the time.

Nah

Barry Harris just had IV7 there for a bar.

If you like the Gb there, put it there.

I play it a lot less than I used to.

[princeplanet]

Nah

Barry Harris just had IV7 there for a bar.

If you like the Gb there, put it there.

I play it a lot less than I used to.

Maybe I got used to Eb6 to Ebm6 for that bar (the way I learned it). Me playing all my Eb7 ideas against that sounds like ass...

Same goes if I just keep it to Eb6, or Ebm6 for that bar, misses that special sauce, or something. Screw being "modern" (hehe), I mean, the tune was written 90 years ago FFS!

[Christian Miller]

Maybe I got used to Eb6 to Ebm6 for that bar (the way I learned it). Me playing all my Eb7 ideas against that sounds like ass...

Same goes if I just keep it to Eb6, or Ebm6 for that bar, misses that special sauce, or something. Screw being "modern" (hehe), I mean, the tune was written 90 years ago FFS!

People do both. Sometimes in the same head lol

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[pcjazz]

Nah

Barry Harris just had IV7 there for a bar.

At one of the classes I attended he split that bar IV7/#IVdim. I think it depends on tempo.

[Christian Miller]

At one of the classes I attended he split that bar IV7/#IVdim. I think it depends on tempo.

Sure, yeah it was just IV7 when we discussed it, but you can absolutely just run the scale down to the root of the dim and it's like one note, which is what I tend to do on a blues for example.

Speaking of blues - it's the same thing, you have the IV chord, how you get back to I (or iii) is a free choice.

[princeplanet]

Sure, yeah it was just IV7 when we discussed it, but you can absolutely just run the scale down to the root of the dim and it's like one note, which is what I tend to do on a blues for example.

Speaking of blues - it's the same thing, you have the IV chord, how you get back to I (or iii) is a free choice.

You mean run a dom scale down to the dim root for when the dim chord starts? Then think dim from there, presumably?

Would you say IV7 throughout that bar was a common Bop thing? And at what slower tempo does it not work so well?

[Christian Miller]

You mean run a dom scale down to the dim root for when the dim chord starts? Then think dim from there, presumably?

Would you say IV7 throughout that bar was a common Bop thing? And at what slower tempo does it not work so well?

You go Eb F G Ab Bb C Db C Bb Ab G F E for instance , so up and down the Eb7 scale (to the 7th) and down to E.

For a rhythm changes you only have time to run it one way. So if I was doing Eo7 I’d just run it down from the 7th

Db C Bb Ab G F E

And then go out from there into lines

It’s a bebop thing, you see all three things.


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[CliffR]

You go Eb F G Ab Bb C Db C Bb Ab G F E for instance , so up and down the E7 scale (to the 7th) and down to E

Up and down the Eb7 scale, right?

[Christian Miller]

Up and down the Eb7 scale, right?

Whoops, yes


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[Groyniad]

No Mo mofos.

this is one of my total favourites - both this rhythm head and the whole glorious album

I hope it's not just me.... (it's a recognised classic - yes?) I hope so.

this is years before he made his 'seminal' records - and I almost love this more than those.

and he certainly deals with two chords in a single bar - at any tempo you'd like to pick. he is gone from his starting point almost before he gets to it.

of course you might not play the VI7 at all - or only once. the point is, it's there to be played and it's good that it's there to be played.

old man trouble - I don't mind him

[princeplanet]

this is one of my total favourites - both this rhythm head and the whole glorious album

I hope it's not just me.... (it's a recognised classic - yes?) I hope so.

this is years before he made his 'seminal' records - and I almost love this more than those.

and he certainly deals with two chords in a single bar - at any tempo you'd like to pick. he is gone from his starting point almost before he gets to it.

of course you might not play the VI7 at all - or only once. the point is, it's there to be played and it's good that it's there to be played.

old man trouble - I don't mind him

Yeah, Sonny's the man, although I wouldn't say 1956 is "years" before his seminal work, I mean Saxophone Colossus was released in 1957
It doesn't get any more seminal than that album!

[pamosmusic]

this is one of my total favourites - both this rhythm head and the whole glorious album

I hope it's not just me.... (it's a recognised classic - yes?) I hope so.

this is years before he made his 'seminal' records - and I almost love this more than those.

and he certainly deals with two chords in a single bar - at any tempo you'd like to pick. he is gone from his starting point almost before he gets to it.

of course you might not play the VI7 at all - or only once. the point is, it's there to be played and it's good that it's there to be played.

old man trouble - I don't mind him

man I love that MJQ album. "The Stopper" is my jam.

For what it's worth, I think the album is '53.

[charlieparker]

Can anyone recommend any classic guitar solos over rhythm changes to look at for vocab?

I've only found Wes' Cotton Tail and it's not my favorite work of his.

[pamosmusic]

Can anyone recommend any classic guitar solos over rhythm changes to look at for vocab?

I've only found Wes' Cotton Tail and it's not my favorite work of his.

Grant Green Oleo

[bediles]

Can anyone recommend any classic guitar solos over rhythm changes to look at for vocab?

I've only found Wes' Cotton Tail and it's not my favorite work of his.

I feel you about Cotton Tail.

Joe Pass/Herb Ellis -- Seven Come Eleven off Two For the Road. A sections are an Ab vamp.

Cecil Alexander off Youtube - Rhythm Changes at 20 MPH (life in the slow lane)

Ulf Walkaneous (sp?) Off youtube -Ulf Wakenius plays Rhythm Changes-In the Style of Oscar Peterson-Michael Brecker-George Benson (don't have to play it at tempo to be good for language)

Koichi Hirata - Anthopology harder to search so here's the link: http://https://youtu.be/3Og9kY3Fr88?si=IOI9jbvrQGly9mKk

Honestly, none of my fave Rhythm solos are played by guitarists.

[pamosmusic]

I feel you about Cotton Tail.

Joe Pass/Herb Ellis -- Seven Come Eleven off Two For the Road. A sections are an Ab vamp.

Cecil Alexander off Youtube - Rhythm Changes at 20 MPH (life in the slow lane)

Ulf Walkaneous (sp?) Off youtube -Ulf Wakenius plays Rhythm Changes-In the Style of Oscar Peterson-Michael Brecker-George Benson (don't have to play it at tempo to be good for language)

Koichi Hirata - Anthopology harder to search so here's the link: http://https://youtu.be/3Og9kY3Fr88?si=IOI9jbvrQGly9mKk

Honestly, none of my fave Rhythm solos are played by guitarists.

Oh good point. Jim Hall on Seven Come Eleven too. Same with Stompin At the Savoy from the same record. Very much a Db tonic vamp on the first four of the A, then IV to V on the last four. So a lot of overlap with rhythm changes. Also back cycling dominants on both the bridges, though not starting on the III.

I’ve transcribed both of these and posted them on this thread:

Jim Hall “Jazz Guitar”

[PMB]

Room 608 by Horace Silver is an excellent rhythm changes tune (with an altered bridge that moves through ii-vs in Eb then Gb major). There's lots of vocab in the head alone and Billy Bean's incredible solo from the version on Makin' It Again with John Pisano on 2nd guitar is definitely worth checking out for ideas. Billy takes the first break at 0'33":

There's also Billy's solo over the Walter Norris tune, Scramble: