Likes Likes:  0
Reply to Thread Bookmark Thread
Posts 1 to 19 of 19
  1. #1

    User Info Menu

    Hey guys, my first post here.

    I am trying to resolve an issue when playing my Peerless Monarch. I don't like the sound I get when releasing pressure from my fret hand (left hand) sometimes to mute the strings. Sort of a ringing/buzzing sound.

    Meanwhile, with the same technique on my other guitars I have played forever, trying to feel the same thing, I don't get that sound.

    One difference is that my other instruments are round wound strings, while the Monarch is the only one I play with flat wounds. But I also hear the effect on the unwound high B and E strings, so I don't think that is it? Not sure?

    It feels like the Peerless sort of amplifies that effect of the ring/buzz when the finger comes off.

    So what I really want is to make an adjustment so that I don't have to have a different technique for playing this guitar if possible. Otherwise, I like its tone. Sort of an L5 guitar. But I really have to concentrate not to get that ring/buzz sound. I don't have to do that on other guitars.

    I would like to post some audio samples. Any help on how to do that would be great.

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

    User Info Menu

    Is it an amplified noise or unplugged? Is this your only archtop...you say it doesn't happen on other guitars w/roundwounds. Archtops are famous for having all sorts of noises from tailpiece, pickguard, pickup mounts, bridge saddles, etc, everything attached to the guitar is a potential noise suspect. Much of that noise doesn't make it to the amp. You have to be a guitar detective.

  4. #3

    User Info Menu

    Is it all over the neck ? on all strings ? or on some places only ?
    Is your neck dead straight or does it have a bit of relief ?

    Thinking of a light fret buzz
    Make a jazz noise here

  5. #4

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by 339 in june View Post
    Is it all over the neck ? on all strings ? or on some places only ?
    Is your neck dead straight or does it have a bit of relief ?

    Thinking of a light fret buzz
    Everywhere and all strings. It is not the fret buzz sound. It seems to be a resonance that comes from within. I raised the action a lot to eliminate that and it still does it with no chance of fret buzzing.

    When releasing the string on other guitars wile holding my ear to the body of the guitar, I can hear a little buzz as the finger comes off, sort of bzzz z z. Very quick, is barely heard if you record the guitar acoustically with a mic.

    Meanwhile on the Peerless, trying to duplicate that feel, it is more like bz z zZZZZZzzzzzzzzz zz zz z.

    The vibration seems to wake up something that vibrates the whole bridge and pickups and resonates a bit. So it is much louder. I find it unpleasant. You would hear it clearly if you mic the guitar acoustically. You can sort of feel it too. Sort of a spring reverb effect.

  6. #5

    User Info Menu

    Is it like a harmonic? I once had a problem with harmonics when I played octaves at several positions, when the muting fingers overlay harmonic positions.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  7. #6

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by cosmic gumbo View Post
    Is it an amplified noise or unplugged?
    Both. Comes through the amp clearly.

    Is this your only archtop...you say it doesn't happen on other guitars w/roundwounds.
    Yes this is my only archtop. I also play a Epiphone Swingster hollow body and don't have this issue.
    I have an American strat, a Washburn 335 style semi hollow, and a few other solid bodies, gypsy jazz acoustic, regular acoustic, and and no problems like this.

    Archtops are famous for having all sorts of noises from tailpiece, pickguard, pickup mounts, bridge saddles, etc, everything attached to the guitar is a potential noise suspect. Much of that noise doesn't make it to the amp. You have to be a guitar detective.
    I think you may be on to something here. Any suggestions on how to locate the buzzing thing?

    The sound definitely comes clearly through the amp.

    One other thing. Certain notes (high G on the B string for example) wake up the resonance/buzz too. I mean just the note itself. The buzz is added to the tone and you can feel it too. But when I release my finger anywhere, that impulse sort of wakes up the resonance too but on any string any fret. Hope that makes sense.

  8. #7

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    Is it like a harmonic? I once had a problem with harmonics when I played octaves at several positions, when the muting fingers overlay harmonic positions.
    No, more like the body resonates briefly, like Zing!

    Sounds like wood buzzing. Comes through the amp too since it is the hollow body tone that is heard even through the amp.

  9. #8

    User Info Menu

    I had a wire slightly touching the inner side of the top on my ES125T some years ago. Took me a while to locate !
    Not sure it can be such a thing for you, but very cheap to check.
    Make a jazz noise here

  10. #9

    User Info Menu

    OK I found two things that seem to be the issue, but are very different.

    - When I grab the pickup and squeeze and strike a note it doesn't vibrate. But when I let go and strike a note, it vibrates and makes a buzz sound. This translates to the amp. I tightened the hardware that I can see, but it sill buzzes, and then stops when I grab it.

    - Second thing is that if I fret a note too far behind the fret the buzz is much worse when lifting a finger and is coming from fret buzz from the next fret. This is a bright ring sound that also activate the pickup vibration. Someone above said to check for fret buzzing and I thought I dismissed that, but that is wrong, it is a fret buzz issue. I raised the action way up but it does not go away. So I need to look into the neck curvature.

  11. #10

    User Info Menu

    Sounds like a grounding issue if what you are describing happens when the guitar is plugged in and playing through your amp. I suspect that the bridge is not grounding the strings properly. Did you look at that?

    I can see now that you say that it happens both acoustically and electrically. I would get out a mirror and look inside the f-holes. You could have a wire that vibrating up against something. I would also check the tailpiece. There is a bar and a wire to ground the strings and that may cause some vibration.

  12. #11

    User Info Menu

    Quote Originally Posted by lammie200 View Post
    I suspect that the bridge is not grounding the strings properly. Did you look at that?
    The saddle is wood and the tail piece is wood. I took it apart, and although parts of it are metal, I see no ground connection.

    image1.jpeg - Google Drive
    image2.jpeg - Google Drive

  13. #12

    User Info Menu

    OK, I fixed one of the two buzzing sounds. I tightened the pickup screws very hard. This has stopped the pickup from vibrating. No more vibration on open note notes. No more buzzing of the pickup itself.


    The second problem is the fret buzz. I looked carefully and the string is NOT contacting the next fret. The buzz is coming from the fret being fingered. As it is released it makes a zing sound. So it is the sound of the fret shape itself that I guess I don't like.

    I compared to my other guitars and I definitely like the sound of my frets on the others. I can release and mute the string and control the tone with no zinging sound. But the Peerless fret itself is giving me a high pitch ringing. It is something about the way the string touches the fret.

  14. #13

    User Info Menu

    The neck may need some relief. When you fret the first and 14th frets simultaneously, you have a straightedge with the string in between. There should be a slight gap between the string and the 7th fret, and actually a little between all the frets. It doesn't need to be much, I prefer just enough to barely tell there is any relief at all, but other people prefer more. But the string should not be touching the middle frets at all. If it is, there is a backbow in the neck, and the truss rod needs to be adjusted by turning the nut counter-clockwise until you do get some relief. With a backbow, the fretted string can be buzzing on the frets behind, even if it's not buzzing on the fret(s) toward the bridge. The problem can also be caused by a nut slot being too deep. Proper nut height and proper relief have to be set before any other adjustments can be effectively made. Every adjustment affects everything else. At least that's my experience.

  15. #14

    User Info Menu

    Here is the sound of the string releasing from the frets now.

    The action is up high and I have fixed the pickup vibration. It used to be that this buzz sound would wake up the pickup vibration since it was so strong too.

    But here I am sort of trying to make it happen so you can hear.

    IMG_2682.MOV - Google Drive


    My sense of this is that there is a flat region of the fret, but the string is not parallel to that so it sort of rests on one edge of the fret flat area.

  16. #15

    User Info Menu

    sounded like fret buzz from the next fret. and diffrent things can cause it. you said it was all over the neck even at 1st,2nd ,3rd fret then you need some relivef. you can also get it if the frets are in need of crowning. Or the frets going up the neck are the same level as the one before it. the 5th fret should be a little higher than the 6th and so on this is done when fret leveling. or when crowning.

  17. #16

    User Info Menu

    Thanks guys.

    I gather from this thread that I need to take it to the Luthier and have him do this. I gather that it might need fret leveling and crowning to feel and play like I want, and first might need a neck adjustment and possibly new nut to get proper height first.

    This is a nice instrument and perhaps the setup that it came with (I got it used) was not right or the previous owner made some wrong adjustments.

    This is more than I can do myself.

    I really would like to to feel and play similar to my other guitars. Having to consciously think about avoiding that fret buzz messes up the play-ability. Every time it makes that buzz sound it just sounds lame to me.

  18. #17

    User Info Menu

    you will have to Determine what you are willing to pay. If it is worth it I would check on what is known as Plek for a Guitar it cost more but done correctly nothing can compare. A very good luthier can achieve the same results. Also if it is a compound radius neck they are harder to work on so the cost might be higher.

  19. #18

    User Info Menu

    From what I can gather, it has a compound radius 12-16 neck.

    I've been able to better define the fret buzz effect so I can explain it. If I place my finger directly behind the fret, the tone is good. If I place my finger in the middle of the space between frets, then when lifting my finger to mute, it buzzes. This is consistent on all strings at all positions on the neck, and still happens with the action raised high using the bridge adjustment. If I place my finger at the back of the space, then the tone is actually buzzy on the note itself, and then very buzzy when releasing my finger.

    This means that when I slide a note up a fret, I cross through that buzzy place and I don't like the tone.

    I guess the adjustment I have been making to my playing is to land my finger forward in the fret, and avoiding slides. This is just not my style, and I need to get this fixed.

  20. #19

    User Info Menu

    looking at the video you posted the frets need crowning they look very flat and they look pretty low close to the finger board so it might need new frets.