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  1. #101
    I'm all for it, of course.

    I'm not shooting for the max tempo on any of this stuff, just a tempo somewhere in the middle of the recommended range. For me the mental gymnastics and visualization are where I really need the work. It's coming along slower than I expected, so a more relaxed pace is good. The drills are making me face how deficient I am at seeing notes on the D and G strings - something I thought I had down decades ago. Of course coming from a rock background thinking in flats is killing me... C#... wait... no... Db... great, I just lost my place again


    I was hoping to post something on patterns 5 and 6 tomorrow, but I've got to tear my one working guitar apart, adjust the neck, replace the pots and rewire everything tonight. Hopefully it all goes smooth.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  2. #102
    Patterns 5-6:


    I'd like to tighten up the time on these, but this may be all I can manage to post this week. Comments appreciated.

  3. #103
    Quiet here. How are we on 5-6?

    5-6 present new issues depending on approach. I'm alternate picking everything, so there's less change for descending.... How do the descending patterns affect your right hand?

    Do we want to share fingerings etc? Here are mine for 7th/6th position on these triads in the "7th position2" pdf. I put them in cycle-of-4ths order. So, they're basically CAGED through the first 4. 5 is one note different (finger 1 instead of 4). Then, 2 extra which don't fall under caged organization.

    I also attached a possible CAGED-type fingering approach for the same 12 arps ...."7th position CAGED 2". I know the 2-3-4 fingering on the E-form is different from most maybe. Also, the 4-4 fingering on the last 2 notes of the D-form arp...
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 03-16-2019 at 07:37 PM.

  4. #104
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    I'm working on 5-6 and taking them back to the approaches on the earlier patterns, trying to stay in one region of the neck, etc. Not using a drum track yet though. I am seeing why I need to be doing this kind of thing. I don't switch octaves and jump up a 4th very quickly and smoothly!
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  5. #105
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    The best laid plans....

    I had an unscheduled day and planned to record videos today. But my mom fell during the night and fractured her shoulder. (Humerus, the long bone.) She's in the hospital awaiting a surgeon's visit. I came home to sleep a bit. (She was given morphine and was sleeping too.)

    I thought I'd do a quick take of 5 and 6 but my phone says I have low storage on Impact (the software that runs my iTrack Pocket.) So now I have to offload things to free up space to record new stuff. Not a big deal really, but as Charles Bukowski put it, "a shoelace that snaps with no time left."

    Perhaps "when the evening sun goes down, you'll find me hangin' around."
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Quiet here. How are we on 5-6?

    5-6 present new issues depending on approach. I'm alternate picking everything, so there's less change for descending.... How do the descending patterns affect your right hand?

    Do we want to share fingerings etc? Here are mine for 7th/6th position on these triads. I put them in cycle-of-4ths order. So, they're basically CAGED through the first 4. 5 is one note different (finger 1 instead of 4). Then, 2 extra which don't fall under caged organization.7th position2.pdf

    Nice job, Matt. I like your fingering approaches and I'll probably use those to start. You are much further along than I am as I am basically starting 5 & 6 today.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by MarkRhodes View Post
    The best laid plans....

    I had an unscheduled day and planned to record videos today. But my mom fell during the night and fractured her shoulder. (Humerus, the long bone.) She's in the hospital awaiting a surgeon's visit. I came home to sleep a bit. (She was given morphine and was sleeping too.)

    I thought I'd do a quick take of 5 and 6 but my phone says I have low storage on Impact (the software that runs my iTrack Pocket.) So now I have to offload things to free up space to record new stuff. Not a big deal really, but as Charles Bukowski put it, "a shoelace that snaps with no time left."

    Perhaps "when the evening sun goes down, you'll find me hangin' around."
    I'm sorry to hear of your mom's injury. I hope she can soon be comfortable and recover soon.

    I delete my videos from my phone after I post to youtube. I figure I don't need them anymore. The video files can be huge, deleting them is the easiest way to free up space on your phone.
    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post
    I'm sorry to hear of your mom's injury. I hope she can soon be comfortable and recover soon.

    I delete my videos from my phone after I post to youtube. I figure I don't need them anymore. The video files can be huge, deleting them is the easiest way to free up space on your phone.
    Same here. I do a clip of something every day, listen to it as couple times, and delete. No need to keep them on the phone.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  9. #109
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    Patterns 5 & 6

    At 160 bpm, staying in one position which is 5 frets. I went one fret out of position a couple of times.

    If anyone wants... I'll tab out the shapes I'm using if you can't figure it out from the video.

    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post
    I'm sorry to hear of your mom's injury. I hope she can soon be comfortable and recover soon.

    I delete my videos from my phone after I post to youtube. I figure I don't need them anymore. The video files can be huge, deleting them is the easiest way to free up space on your phone.

    Thanks, fep. For now, they're putting off surgery. They want to work with the shoulder for three days and then see where things stand. (That's my understanding via mom; I haven't spoken with the surgeon yet. He's supposed to call me tomorrow.)

    As for deleting videos from my phone, that's just what I did. Had 28 on there. God knows why I didn't delete them before. Just hadn't thought about it. Though they're short, video files eat up a lot of storage space.
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post
    At 160 bpm, staying in one position which is 5 frets. I went one fret out of position a couple of times.

    If anyone wants... I'll tab out the shapes I'm using if you can't figure it out from the video.

    Nice, relaxed left hand. You make it look easy.

  12. #112
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    So here's my first shot on Patterns 5-6, done achingly slow (sorry about that). I do each one per the book, then do each one per pattern 2, the rising by 4ths. I hope this week to pick up the pace and adapt these to 3-4 as well.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone View Post
    So here's my first shot on Patterns 5-6, done achingly slow (sorry about that).
    No apology needed. Good job. Great tone as always, and you pulled off the exercises well. I think it's definitely cool to post what you can cleanly. That's what I'm aiming for as much as possible too.

    In the intro, it's stated that the upper tempo number is mainly there to keep you from practicing things needlessly after you know them. It's the "Move on, and stop practicing things you already know" tempo.

    IMO, 5 and 6 are particularly harder than they would be technically on some other instruments. They have many more notes with string crossings which utilize the same left hand finger as the previous note. I think this one technical aspect is very difficult until it is learned pretty well. They can be played as rolls in some situations, but there are many where it's same-finger-different-fret/string here as well. It's really good technical work, but I don't find them easy at all.

    Frank's sounded pretty clean, but mine definitely had a few "issues" at the tempo I was playing.

    There are some of these triad fingerings which are technically harder to play than their 4-note arp counterparts IMO.

  14. #114

    3/17 deadline - patterns 5-6 135 bpm

    Here are patterns 5 and 6 utilizing the B (4ths) and C (whole steps) variations. I combined both 5 and 6 into one exercise, so for each variation I do up - down then turn it around and do down - up.

    There are a few flubs. For some reason I was really self-conscious recording this week and had a hard time getting a decent take for either of these. I gave up trying to get a good take for the D variation (minor 3rds). I'll try it again tomorrow and see how it goes.

    For these exercises I focused on three positions - 3rd position with lower roots on the A D and G strings, 8th position with lower roots on the E A and D strings and 10th position with lower roots on the D G and B strings. For demonstration, I chose to do one variation in each position. I made charts of the fingerings I'm using just to try out the new version of Neck Diagrams. The export to pdf feature is very nice.

    The first vid is 4ths in 8th position: Major Arpeggios 8th Position.pdf





    The second vid is whole steps in 3rd position. For the high C and Db arpeggios I moved out of position to grab the octave on the high E string: Major Arpeggios 3rd Position.pdf





    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  15. #115
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    PFJ 5, 6, and 7





    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by FwLineberry View Post
    Here are patterns 5 and 6 utilizing the B (4ths) and C (whole steps) variations. I combined both 5 and 6 into one exercise, so for each variation I do up - down then turn it around and do down - up.

    There are a few flubs. For some reason I was really self-conscious recording this week and had a hard time getting a decent take for either of these. I gave up trying to get a good take for the D variation (minor 3rds). I'll try it again tomorrow and see how it goes.

    For these exercises I focused on three positions - 3rd position with lower roots on the A D and G strings, 8th position with lower roots on the E A and D strings and 10th position with lower roots on the D G and B strings. For demonstration, I chose to do one variation in each position. I made charts of the fingerings I'm using just to try out the new version of Neck Diagrams. The export to pdf feature is very nice.

    The first vid is 4ths in 8th position: Major Arpeggios 8th Position.pdf





    The second vid is whole steps in 3rd position. For the high C and Db arpeggios I moved out of position to grab the octave on the high E string: Major Arpeggios 3rd Position.pdf





    .
    Good job, and thanks for posting. I had a couple of questions about this actually that were answered in the other thread . So, thanks for that as well. Thanks for posting the fingerings as well.

    Did you post your PDFs Via Tapatalk? I originally posted mine that way and then couldn't open them without going to web view. Irritating. Anyway, I was wondering if yours did something similar.

    Good job on labeling everything by the way. That was my first thought upon seeing your post: that I didn't do mine right at all. :-)

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Good job, and thanks for posting. I had a couple of questions about this actually that were answered in the other thread . So, thanks for that as well. Thanks for posting the fingerings as well.

    Did you post your PDFs Via Tapatalk? I originally posted mine that way and then couldn't open them without going to web view. Irritating. Anyway, I was wondering if yours did something similar.

    Good job on labeling everything by the way. That was my first thought upon seeing your post: that I didn't do mine right at all. :-)

    I posted from my laptop and only at the last minute figured out how to drag the attachments into the post. Normally I would just load stuff like that up to my website and drop a link, but I saw that you had attached your file and decided to try it that way.

    I haven't used tapatalk for a very long time. I seem to remember that sort of thing being one of the reasons I dumped it, eventually.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  18. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkRhodes View Post




    Good job, Mark. You seem particularly comfortable with the first two. That's some aggressive foot tapping BTW. :-) Thanks for posting.

  19. #119
    I edited the title post's dates:

    Mar 10: patterns 1-4
    Mar 17: patterns 5-6
    Mar 24: patterns 7-10
    Mar 31: patterns 11-12

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    I edited the title post's dates:

    Mar 10: patterns 1-4
    Mar 17: patterns 5-6
    Mar 24: patterns 7-10
    Mar 31: patterns 11-12


    Looks good to me. I'm going to work pattern 7 in open position, pattern 8 in 5th position, pattern 9 in 7th position and pattern 10 in 12th position. I'm also thinking about concentrating on one position at a time, getting that worked up and posting the vid as I go through the week. I'll see how it goes this week.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Good job, Mark. You seem particularly comfortable with the first two. That's some aggressive foot tapping BTW. :-) Thanks for posting.
    I'll say! I didn't notice myself doing that when it happened. I noticed it when I uploaded the video. Nerves.

    Just got off the phone w/ my mom, who is still in the hospital after a fall Saturday morning which resulted in a shoulder fracture. She wants to come home NOW. Ain't gonna happen. She's a sweet person in most ways, but when it comes to doctors, her nickname is "the non-compliant patient."
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  22. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkRhodes View Post
    I'll say! I didn't notice myself doing that when it happened. I noticed it when I uploaded the video. Nerves.

    Just got off the phone w/ my mom, who is still in the hospital after a fall Saturday morning which resulted in a shoulder fracture. She wants to come home NOW. Ain't gonna happen. She's a sweet person in most ways, but when it comes to doctors, her nickname is "the non-compliant patient."
    All the best to your mom, Mark.

  23. #123
    I think it would be cool if we posted early versions of some of this stuff, a couple of weeks out or so. It could be questions, thoughts etc. Or just brief playing examples. It would give us more of a reference point for commenting on each other's playing.. something from which to measure progress etc.

    So here are some of mine...

    Patterns 7-10, one week out:

    Patterns 11-12, two weeks out:

    Thoughts on the Randy Vincent phrasing thing on some of these:

    At some point I refer to the "Randy Vincent stuff we did with Lawson". Meant to say "Jimmy Rainey stuff we did with Lawson"....

    You definitely don't have to post anything as long-winded as some of my comments...
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 03-19-2019 at 10:49 AM.

  24. #124

    Patterns for Jazz study group - March 2019

    Hi everyone, I’ve just been “lurking” around here reading your posts and watching the videos. I think it’s a great idea. I’d like to join in at some point but should probably disclose that I’m a little over two years into the book and am currently re-examining pattern 85 in the Dorian. My process so far has been to move on as soon as I can play to the lower guide tempo, and find that often I use two or three fingerings moving up or down the neck to get me there. I have found that this pays off in unexpected ways and that I am now more likely to be able to “complete a level” in position although might choose playing along the neck in some situations.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    I think it would be cool if we posted early versions of some of this stuff, a couple of weeks out or so. It could be questions, thoughts etc. Or just brief playing examples. It would give us more of a reference point for commenting on each other's playing.. something from which to measure progress etc.

    [snip]


    You definitely don't have to post anything as long-winded as some of my comments...

    Right now, I'm lucky to get something posted by deadline. I'm hoping to get my video procedure streamlined, but atm my recording environment is so noisy that I have to record audio separately direct into a DAW and spend time syncing everything up in a video editing program. I also have pet issues, so I can't just leave everything set up to do what I need to do and have to start from scratch every time. My wife and I are hoping to convert a downstairs room into a dedicated music room, but that is a major project for some time in the future.


    You seem to have this first material under your hands pretty well even in your rough takes. Is that from having gone through this book already or just from general familiarity?

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  26. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by FwLineberry View Post
    Right now, I'm lucky to get something posted by deadline. I'm hoping to get my video procedure streamlined, but atm my recording environment is so noisy that I have to record audio separately direct into a DAW and spend time syncing everything up in a video editing program. I also have pet issues, so I can't just leave everything set up to do what I need to do and have to start from scratch every time. My wife and I are hoping to convert a downstairs room into a dedicated music room, but that is a major project for some time in the future.
    Yeah. The ones I recorded this morning were on my phone and pretty rough audio I guess. I haven't recorded anything direct in forever. I do have a zoom Q2n which works pretty well and is better quality. For that for quick and easy, it's hard to beat these phones nowadays. I think Jeff uses a phone almost exclusively, and he always sounds great.

    Quote Originally Posted by FwLineberry View Post
    You seem to have this first material under your hands pretty well even in your rough takes. Is that from having gone through this book already or just from general familiarity?
    I looked at it for a few days a couple of years ago. I quit in frustration. Basically, it's one of the things that led me to really tighten up on basic technical aspects of my playing and fretboard knowledge. I was so irritated that it seemed to take so much effort and thought to just cover basic on this instrument. Very different from my experience with sax and piano. I did a lot of work with scales and especially arpeggios.

    Anyway, I started back looking at it a couple of days before my first post in original thread proposal. It made a lot more sense too me this time. That said, I play through this material a lot of different ways at home. I play through the cycles using single patterns some to work on technical issues, and I really try to be aware of actual position and not let my fingers just go on auto pilot. I've always cycled things in fourths, but the whole-step and minor 3rd patterns are new for me. So, that's been a good thing for me to work on.

    If you pick a single pattern to work through, you can read through a lot of material more quickly. I'm doing some more grunt work on later stuff and using this earlier material to work on the position thing and for adding new patterns and positions etc. I was pretty familiar with types 1, 2, 3 and 4. I also recently did a lot of work on type 1C fingerings on all scale degree chords etc. So 1, 2 and 1C are very familiar, in terms of fretboard knowledge of where those pitches are. 3 and 4 aren't quite as solid in that regard, but my fingers know them really well. The other 2 fingerings need a good bit more work on the fretboard/pitch awareness relative to those shapes. So, yeah, I'm not as much having to learn 7 fingerings/pitch associations/position associations for any given position. It's mostly the last category and just filling in gaps, if that makes sense.
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 03-19-2019 at 10:59 AM.

  27. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Yeah. The ones I recorded this morning were on my phone and pretty rough audio I guess. I haven't recorded anything direct in forever. I do have a zoom Q2n which works pretty well and is better quality. For that for quick and easy, it's hard to beat these phones nowadays. I think Jeff uses a phone almost exclusively, and he always sounds great.


    I looked at it for a few days a couple of years ago. I quit in frustration. Basically, it's one of the things that led me to really tighten up on basic technical aspects of my playing and fretboard knowledge. I was so irritated that it seemed to take so much effort and thought to just cover basic on this instrument. Very different from my experience with sax and piano. I did a lot of work with scales and especially arpeggios.

    Anyway, I started back looking at it a couple of days before my first post in original thread proposal. It made a lot more sense too me this time. That said, I play through this material a lot of different ways at home. I play through the cycles using single patterns some to work on technical issues, and I really try to be aware of actual position and not let my fingers just go on auto pilot. I've always cycled things in fourths, but he whole-step and minor 3rd patterns are new for me.

    If you pick a single pattern to work through, you can read through a lot of material more quickly.


    You mention sax. I originally got this book to work through on clarinet but I haven't gotten to the point on that instrument for any of this to do much good. I put the book away and forgot about it. It never even occurred to me to go through the stuff on guitar until you posted the proposal thread. It's perfectly in line with what I laid out for myself to be working on for the next period of time - scales and arpeggios in positions going through cycles and common chord progressions. Now that I'm going through it on guitar, I have a better idea of how to approach it on clarinet as well.

    Back to practicing.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  28. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Iain Carleton View Post
    Hi everyone, I’ve just been “lurking” around here reading your posts and watching the videos. I think it’s a great idea. I’d like to join in at some point but should probably disclose that I’m a little over two years into the book and am currently re-examining pattern 85 in the Dorian. My process so far has been to move on as soon as I can play to the lower guide tempo, and find that often I use two or three fingerings moving up or down the neck to get me there. I have found that this pays off in unexpected ways and that I am now more likely to be able to “complete a level” in position although might choose playing along the neck in some situations.
    Hey, Iain. We'd love for you to post your versions of the examples we're currently working on.

    I agree with your philosophy of limiting things to accelerate progress and to focus more on specific technical aspects or specific areas of fretboard knowledge. It's something that got me inspired to work through this in a simpler way this time actually. My default process, when I run into technical hurdles is to basically go back to one form and work it through the cycles etc.

  29. #129
    Here's updated fingering for what I'm practicing this week. I'm not really making these for personal use but more for communication purposes here. So, if there's a format that makes more sense, I'd be happy to tweak this in Neck Diagrams. Let me know. One click gives note names or intervals etc. Anyway, let me know if this makes sense, and I appreciate that others have posted some as well. It's definitely not required, but it's a nice add-on.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  30. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Here's updated fingering for what I'm practicing this week. I'm not really making these for personal use but more for communication purposes here. So, if there's a format that makes more sense, I'd be happy to tweak this in Neck Diagrams. Let me know. One click gives note names or intervals etc. Anyway, let me know if this makes sense, and I appreciate that others have posted some as well. It's definitely not required, but it's a nice add-on.


    The diagrams make perfect sense to me. You and I are using the same basic approach with a little variation in fingerings. I'm curious how much you're able to stick to those exact fingerings on this current crop of patterns.

    I'm finding that I have to alter the fingers I use and occasionally shift out of position to make smooth transitions. This may be an area where a CAGED type approach starts to outshine a strict position approach.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  31. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by FwLineberry View Post
    The diagrams make perfect sense to me. You and I are using the same basic approach with a little variation in fingerings. I'm curious how much you're able to stick to those exact fingerings on this current crop of patterns.

    I'm finding that I have to alter the fingers I use and occasionally shift out of position to make smooth transitions. This may be an area where a CAGED type approach starts to outshine a strict position approach.

    .
    Well, honestly, that's the primary idea behind reg's use of this particular fingering. If you default II first finger stretches, you can use the second finger as your starting reference for fingerings , and they all stay pretty much the same.

    I would assume tha twith the fourth finger stretch fingerings, you're mostly using a first finger reference? Anyway, the first finger is in a different position relative to the second finger in different fingerings, depending on scale degree and half steps etc, whereas with a second finger reference, since the second finger is the reference point, it doesn't change, since you don't stretch second finger.

  32. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher View Post
    Well, honestly, that's the primary idea behind reg's use of this particular fingering. If you default II first finger stretches, you can use the second finger as your starting reference for fingerings , and they all stay pretty much the same.

    I would assume tha twith the fourth finger stretch fingerings, you're mostly using a first finger reference? Anyway, the first finger is in a different position relative to the second finger in different fingerings, depending on scale degree and half steps etc, whereas with a second finger reference, since the second finger is the reference point, it doesn't change, since you don't stretch second finger.

    The way I'm doing it is strictly by position. The position dictates the reference. For example 3rd position for me means fingers 1 1 2 3 4 4 with 2 at the 4th fret. Any notes that fall on those frets are covered by the designated finger as much as is practical.

    I may be giving the impression that I'm married to these fingerings, but I'm not. Under normal playing situations I use any fingering or position that facilitates what I want to play. For this material, however, I decided to try it in strict positions as a limitation exercise in order to try and force myself away from pattern recognition. As soon as I take the same shape and move it up two frets, my brain switches to pattern recognition and no longer registers what I'm actually playing. It's impossible for me not to pick up on patterns. Even with these drills the way I'm trying to approach it my brain immediately picks up on 4ths are just over a string or down a string and down two frets. When you have to switch octaves, it always moves from shape x to shape y.

    The problem with patterns for me is that if I find myself in a situation where I want to play a certain idea I either try to move to the location where I know the idea best or I experience hesitation because I'm in an unfamiliar location for playing that idea.

    Another example of how this bites me is I'm working through Martino's line studies from Linear Expressions. Memorizing and playing the exercises required very little effort. It's just a sequence of notes with a lot of repeated "licks" and variations. The problem comes when I want to apply his ideas. I'm not recognizing things as "that's a G lick" That's a Bb lick". That's mainly due to how he works off the D G and B strings for reference. That's always been a week spot of mine. I see references off the E A and E strings mostly.


    Anyway, here are the fingerings I'm using for this batch of drills. Each week I've picked a different criteria for the positions. Week one was starting from middle finger on the C note from the E A and D strings. That dictated 2nd, 7th and 9th positions. Last week I started with the index finger on the C. That dictated 3rd, 8th and 10th positions. This week I'm starting with the pinky on the C. That dictates 5th, 7th and 12th or open positions.


    Chromatic in open position

    Major Arpeggios - Chromatic- Open Position.pdf


    4ths in 5th position - this require a couple of altered fingerings and using the A shape off the E string instead of the D string where I would have preferred. I couldn't come up with any way to get from a D string fingering of A to an A string fingering of D.

    Major Arpeggios - 4ths -5th Position.pdf


    2nds in 7th position - For my D string based position, I'm playing roots off the D G and B strings. This requires me to displace the octave on the higher arpeggios in order to stay in position. The F requires moving up to 8th position. The final Db requires either an awkward shift down a string and down a fret with the index finger or moving up to the 8th position again.

    Major Arpeggios - 2nds - 7th Position.pdf


    Minor 3rds in 12th position - This is the most awkward to finger so far. The opening C requires fingering the octave with the 3rd finger in order to get the middle finger over to the D string for the Eb.

    Major Arpeggios - Minor 3rds - 12th Position.pdf

    .
    Last edited by FwLineberry; 03-19-2019 at 07:10 PM. Reason: fixing links
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  33. #133
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    374
    This is great discussion guys.

    I'm a little behind. patterns 5 and 6 giving me fits still at raised tempos especially major 2nds and min 3rds but I'll get there. probably wont be able to post anything until Friday. have a busy week. but I'm hanging in there.

  34. #134
    I'm a big advocate of practicing material inside 5 frets.This is all that is needed to cover 2 1/3
    octaves of the chromatic scale and therefore addresses all keys within the limits of this range.
    While doing so yields some less than favorite fingerings, it provides the clearest vantage point
    of relevant notes in close proximity.

    Any awkward fingering that occurs within the chosen 5 frets, has an improved option in the
    5 fret position either one below or one above, also known as a 6 fret position.
    Hence, the beauty of a 6 fret position (or two adjacent 5 fret positions from my vantage point)
    is that it allows avoidance of these awkward fingerings.

    Another unasked for suggestion for those practicing within a position concept is to start on the lowest available
    occurence of the chord type and inversion rather than on C.
    So pattern 1 in 1st position looks like this starting on F and continuing to the top of the position:


    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------2----------3-
    -------------------------------------------1----------2----------3---------4--------5--------1----------2----
    -----------3----------4--------5-------1----------2----------3-------1-4------2-5-------3----------4-------
    -------3---------1-4------1-5------3----------4--------1-5-------2---------3---------4----------5----------
    -1--5---------2---------3--------4----------5------------------------------------------------------------------



    ---------------------------------------1----------2-------------3-----------4----------5--------------------
    ----------4---------5--------------1----------2-------------3--------1-4--------2-5-----------------------
    -------3------1-4---------------2-----------3-----------4--------1-----------2----------------------------
    -1-5-------2-----------------3-----------4-----------5-----------------------------------------------------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I'm not doing the study group but I was encouraged to break out the book for the first time in decades.
    My favorite parts of the book is it's application of different interval cycles to the patterns.
    In silent solidarity, I spent a few days playing self generated patterns in a way that suits my skills and interests.
    Carry on, nice work.
    Last edited by bako; 03-19-2019 at 11:17 PM. Reason: tab reformatting

  35. #135
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    5,274

    Pattern 7 138 bpm

    Tried it over a drum improvisation making it much easier to lose the "1" downbeat.
    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  36. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post
    Tried it over a drum improvisation making it much easier to lose the "1" downbeat.
    Nice. Love the drum loop and the playing, especially the improv after. Your fingerings looks mostly the same as mine. You're using six patterns?

  37. #137
    Deadline version of Patterns 7-10 at 139 bpm. 3rd and 7th positions.

    Drum genius pattern: Swing Med 04

    Comments/critiques please.

  38. #138
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    374
    I have a question.....

    I haven't been paying attention - when you guys are cycling back with patterns 5 and 6 but doing the interval cycles of patterns 1 - 4, are you targeting the tempos of 1 - 4 or the tempos of 5 and 6?

  39. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Kaye View Post
    I have a question.....

    I haven't been paying attention - when you guys are cycling back with patterns 5 and 6 but doing the interval cycles of patterns 1 - 4, are you targeting the tempos of 1 - 4 or the tempos of 5 and 6?


    Tempos of 5 and 6.

    You're not really going back you're just using the same set of four chord cycles on the new material.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  40. #140
    Did a little of these at 160 when I forgot to factor this in, and it slightly hurt my feelings. 160 is faster than 138. Just saying. :-)

  41. #141

    3/24 deadline - Patterns 7-10 120 bpm

    Here is exercises 7 through 10. I combined them into one drill in four postions:

    1. 7 - open position - roots on A D G strings
    2. 8 - 5th position - roots on E A D strings
    3. 9 - 7th position - roots on D G B strings
    4. 10 - 12th position - roots on A D G strings


    The last pattern is a little sloppy, but I didn't think I'd get a better take without spending all afternoon. What you see is what you get. Most of the fingerings in that position are not very practical that high on the neck. I'd change things around under actual playing conditions.


    Tempo is 120 with a cha-cha-cha beat.






    For this next week, I'm planning on working up exercises 11 and 12 in three of the variations (4ths, 2nds, min 3rds) starting off my middle finger. So 2nd, 7th and 9th positions. I'll probably post some fingerings tomorrow once I figure out how it's going to go.

    .
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  42. #142
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Greenacres, FL
    Posts
    12,555

    Pfj #7-10

    Been a crazy week for me, with mom going from the ER to a hospital bed and then to a skilled nursing facility. (Broken shoulder. )
    Very little time to practice.

    But I want to stay on this bus, so I did what I could.







    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  43. #143
    After working with 4ths in the second position, I decided the stretches were not very practical, too much jumping from the index on the 1st fret to the pinky on the 6th fret. So I figured I'd see how it goes with moving my hand out of strict position and avoiding any stretches.

    Here's the fingerings I've decided on


    Major Arpeggios - 4ths -2nd-3rd Position.pdf



    For the C and B chords I play the ascending version with my 3rd finger in order to descend the following chord starting on the 4th finger. The 4th finger is used for descending on both.

    For the final C chord, I'm moving up to 5th position and playing the same fingering as A. I didn't feel like making a second page for one diagram, though.
    The disgusting stink of a too-loud electric guitar; now that's my idea of a good time - Frank Zappa

  44. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by FwLineberry View Post
    Here is exercises 7 through 10. I combined them into one drill in four postions:

    1. 7 - open position - roots on A D G strings
    2. 8 - 5th position - roots on E A D strings
    3. 9 - 7th position - roots on D G B strings
    4. 10 - 12th position - roots on A D G strings


    The last pattern is a little sloppy, but I didn't think I'd get a better take without spending all afternoon. What you see is what you get. Most of the fingerings in that position are not very practical that high on the neck. I'd change things around under actual playing conditions.


    Tempo is 120 with a cha-cha-cha beat.






    For this next week, I'm planning on working up exercises 11 and 12 in three of the variations (4ths, 2nds, min 3rds) starting off my middle finger. So 2nd, 7th and 9th positions. I'll probably post some fingerings tomorrow once I figure out how it's going to go.

    .
    Good job. I like how you got all of these into a single take. Mine definitely has a ransom note quality to the competitively. (I'm looking forward to having a little more time this week. We are out of town for much of this week.) Thanks for posting.

  45. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by MarkRhodes View Post
    Been a crazy week for me, with mom going from the ER to a hospital bed and then to a skilled nursing facility. (Broken shoulder. )
    Very little time to practice.

    But I want to stay on this bus, so I did what I could.







    Hey Mark, good job getting these up during your crazy week. Hope this week is downright boring. :-) thanks for posting.
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 03-24-2019 at 10:57 PM. Reason: :

  46. #146

    new guy

    Hi Everyone

    Sorry for the dumb question, but I have noticed this interesting thread for a new guy to Jazz guitar and wondered if it's too late to join??
    what book are you studying?-

    Many Thanks
    Andy

  47. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by android View Post
    Hi Everyone

    Sorry for the dumb question, but I have noticed this interesting thread for a new guy to Jazz guitar and wondered if it's too late to join??
    what book are you studying?-

    Many Thanks
    Andy
    Feel free to join in. You can jump in where we are currently or post older patterns etc... Whatever you like.

  48. #148
    Based on the book Patterns for Jazz by Jerry Coker, Jimmy Casale, Gary Campbell and Jerry Greene.

  49. #149
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Greenacres, FL
    Posts
    12,555

    Thoughts

    I've been doing a lot of work on Pat Martino lines and a "perpetual motion" exercise by David Baker. I really appreciate this group because it gives me the nudge to keep at this and try to post in a timely fashion.

    Haven't experimented much with fingerings. That may change...

    The minor third progressions are the most challenging for me because I'm not used to them but I think they will do me a lot of good, especially when we get to diminished patterns.
    "Learn the repertoire. It’s all in the songs. If you learn 200 songs, you will have no problem improvising."
    Frank Vignola

  50. #150
    Ah yes i have a PDF of the book....shame its not in tab form im terrible reading music

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