The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    I have noticed that even while consciously trying to keep a relaxed technique in my right hand, that there is a stiffness in my technique when trying to increase speed. So even though I feel like my wrist and forearm are not playing with tension, there is a block at a certain tempo that I am never able to break. This has nothing to do with the left hand. It is a phenomena solely associated with the right. Anyone ever overcome this???

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  3. #2

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    You should post a short clip and demonstrate your problem since its very hard to talk about it without seeing you play.
    A lots of things might influence the stiffness like type of the guitar, your left/right hand coordination, picking technique, pick, strings, position etc.


    Sent from my SM-C7000 using Tapatalk

  4. #3
    I'm interested in this as well. As a used-to-be primarily fingerstyle guy, I've been addressing much of the same. My instinct, in working on this, has been to practice playing with a floating right hand more on everything for extended periods.

    For whatever reason, this seems to help me with right hand "freedom", even when I go back to placing a pinky on the pick guard.
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 12-16-2018 at 11:33 AM.

  5. #4

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    My suggestion would be to focus your attention on how tight you are holding the pick, and work on maintaining an even pressure. I'm not much of a gambler but I'd wager a fair sum of money that you are simply squeezing the pick harder that you need to when you try to play faster.

  6. #5

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    Loose and relaxed is good advice for a fast yet controlled right hand. But after a few years I decided I didn't like the sound it produces, even though it's a very common sound with Jazz guitarists. I found what I call the "plinkety plink" sound of weak attack to be unsatisfying to listen to, particularly after listening to say, a blistering horn solo, or crisp piano solo.

    So I went for a stubby type pick which I grasp quite firmly. Further, I developed some intentional stiffness from fingers, through to the wrist, to elbow and even shoulder. The hand still pivots from the wrist, but like a taut spring instead of a loose one. I find this creates maximum control for how I like to play, and creates far more dynamics where I can project unplugged. Django is a great example of someone who played with great force from both hands to create the most exciting "sound" in all Jazz guitar. Even CC had a more exciting tone than many players that followed. But I see no reason why exciting attack should be restricted to just Gypsy Jazz or Swing guitar ...

    Of course, playing hard also has it's downside - R.S.I. - So not recommending it! Just saying that there's no one way...

  7. #6

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    Perhaps 'consciously trying to keep a relaxed technique' is the problem. Trying to relax is counter-productive. You could leave your right hand to do its own thing, and see what happens. Somebody on another thread reported Bill Frisell saying he had forgotten about his right hand, which does not seem to have done him any harm.

  8. #7
    Hey all, Thx for taking the time to reply. It’s much appreciated.

    Robertkoa, I’m going to have to take some time to read over what you are saying. I got you I think on the first part on a leagato-like stroke and picking real shallow.

    I also followed what you said about finding a position where the up and down strokes are both articulated. All some great advice.

    As far as pick stroke, I’ve started to use a Kenny Burrell style oscillating move from the thumb, as I seem to be having less problems with tension and going too deep in the string. I think the main obstacle with it so far is getting a good upstroke. When I try and just do upstrokes to get better at them, I seem to lose control. Likely this part will get better with more practice.

    Another thing that have started is to to do speed bursts. It seems that I can play at a quicker tempo for a few notes before it falls apart. In the past I would try to work for a tremolo over a longer period of time, never gaining any speed at all in the right hand.

  9. #8
    Okay. I think I understand a little better. Regarding the stiffness...It always came unwanted. As I tried to speed up, it would come, and as a result slow me down and additionally cause bad tone.

  10. #9
    So yeah.....this is what I am trying to address in the OP.....ridding unwanted tension as an increase in speed is attempted.

  11. #10
    Haha....

    Alright, so got the part now to increase tension, so I know what to turn off in the first place.

    i find communicating via print over the net very tricky btw!

    Thx again for taking the time to try and help.

  12. #11
    This link here really resonates with me.


  13. #12
    No. I can’t play at all what the student is doing. I just like some of the general principals being taught for building speed.

    As far closing the eyes though, I still have uncontrolled tension in the body ...,meaning I don’t seem to be able to get rid of it.

    i start with slow strokes, and they seem even and relaxed enough. And I think it is shallow enough so the pick doesn’t get caught in the strings. But as I try to build speed, I feel tension and lack of control. I don’t seem to be able to rid this tension, and I’m not sure which comes first, the tension or lack of control. Sometimes I think the tension is being caused by lack of control instead of the other way around.

    So one of the things I’ve been trying to do is do smaller bursts, because it seems that I can get some increase in speed by just doing bursts. I also go back to slow strokes to get the best technique that I can.

  14. #13
    Yes. The index is curved underneath. These “push-up strokes” with the pick make sense. I assume this helps build up the strength and control of the fine muscles. Likely I I have trying to be too careful in order to get rid of tension. Why only every other day?

  15. #14
    I have some support on the guitar to get the best angle for the pick, but the palm is not anchored.

  16. #15
    Actually, it’s not always on the guitar. I often free float if I I recall correctly

  17. #16
    Ah....literal push-ups. Usually a pretty good ideas or a nice stretch too.

    ive taken some lessons here and there, but no one wants to talk about tremolo. Most seem to think it’s a bit Neanderthal or they don’t know how to explain it. It almost seems like most folks wake up being able to do it. Even all of the Troy Grady video seem to assume this is already in place and move into intricate moves. I don’t have a particularly difficult hard time playing bebop heads and such. But I don’t have the basic up down stroke , so I’m basically screwed if I want to play up tempo. I worked on tremolo many years ago, but completely didn’t get anywhere except some damage. I’m trying it again , but with a little more information.

  18. #17
    Speeding up a tremolo tends to increase tension. I notice in the Martin video he advices the student to speed up beyond his comfort zone. For me, I can only speed up with short bursts of notes. So that’s what I’ve been trying to do. I’ve yet to see if this is going to help increase overall speed for a tremolo.

    i notice that I start tilting my wrist back onto the body of the guitar when I can’t go any faster. I think it does help take the angle of the pick so that a little more speed can sometimes be attained.

  19. #18
    I’ll check out the index finger as you suggest. I notice the tone of the upstroke is not near as good as the downstroke.

  20. #19
    By the way, just as a reminder. I’m moving from the thumb a lot with some wrist.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by srlank
    i notice that I start tilting my wrist back onto the body of the guitar when I can’t go any faster. I think it does help take the angle of the pick so that a little more speed can sometimes be attained.
    Why don't you play/practice that way, then? My right hand has changed positioning and movement along the way. Some times I've noticed that I, almost unconsciously, fight that change. Bad idea. Do not decide what's right or wrong for that hand when you practice. Your body knows way more about it than your intellect. Focus on making it sound good, without tension. Without thinking about it, really.

    I agree on what's been said about going past your limit. One needs to do that. But only for short periods, just to prepare the hand...to let the hand search for a path into faster movement. Then back down and practice cleanly just below the limit. Rinse, repeat. Take lots of small breaks, longer breaks. Many shorter sessions as opposed to few long ones. Don't focus too much on one thing only. That'll easily tense things.

    Actually, the single most damaging thing along the way to a good right hand technique for me, has been myself deciding upon what my right hand should do. Myself applying too much intellect to the process, overriding where my body naturally needed to go. I'm sure it cost me years

  22. #21

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    OP- I think you should do what Runeprune above says ...

    Remember that suggestions I made especially some eyes closed ( but still spatially aware ) practice -
    None were quick fixes - it's weeks and months of gradual stuff.

    [Speeding up a tremolo is one of the most basic ways to do what Miller said in the Video ] - but just practicing 'that way' -per Runeprune -
    Probably even better.


    A little support >always< at wrist or slightly above may give you a much more stable base to work from.












    And you have nothing to lose - you are sort of doing it anyway.

    Your hand can still float slightly (lower closer to strings )- but not from the elbow ...there's some wrist or forearm support..etc.

    Good luck .
    Last edited by Robertkoa; 01-02-2019 at 12:52 PM.

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robertkoa

    If you are actually Al DiMeola- you can pure float - otherwise I don't recommend it.
    You are having some issues so ...if you Float and have no problems - that would be different.
    DiMeola doesn't float. Never has.

  24. #23
    I think there’s been some really good thoughts on this thread, and on a topic that few wish to discuss.....mostly chalking it up to either you got it or you don’t. Thx for taking the time on the topic. And though it’s good to experiment, it’s good to know that the general consensus is to utilize what works best for you.

    Mr. Miller is booked until God knows when, buuuuut he had an opening in mid January (this year) at 4 in the morning.

  25. #24

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    Curious .How much does he charge ?
    Last edited by Robertkoa; 01-03-2019 at 11:05 PM.

  26. #25
    It’s around $80 for a 45 minute slot.