View Poll Results: Thumb over neck?
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Originally Posted by Alter
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02-11-2020 11:47 AM
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Good enough for Barney Kessel, good enough for me.
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why do we never talk about using the thumb on the high strings? My teacher Pierre Cullaz did. See Advices for guitarists, p.70
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Originally Posted by Drumbler
guitar not so much .....
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Carpe diem
(Catch the carp)
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Originally Posted by JCat
Seize the fish !
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There are players, like Guinga, who use thumb all the way in front of the neck -- any string. You see it, but you can't hear anything unusual. Perfectly executed.
He plays chords that can't be played another way in standard tuning.
He does it on nylon. I can't recall seeing anybody do it on steel strings.
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Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
The classicists may use the thumb brought under around and above onto the fingerboard like a capo, beyond which to figure lines (including "open strings" with respect to the thumb acting as "nut") when playing way up above where the neck joins the body...
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Originally Posted by pauln
Here's a video of Sr. Tardelli. Check out :10 to :25 (meaning skip the first 10 seconds). If you check out the rest of it, you'll find an astonishing combination of musicality and technique.
Rhythms from Brazil: Guinga. Marcus Tardelli - Canal March
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Amazing and beautiful... curious, classical guitar and form but on the right leg rather than the left... you think maybe because it facilitates the special thumb technique?
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Originally Posted by pauln
One of the principles I've heard is that they say that "no chord is too hard, remember how hard it was to play a barre F major at first?" And, they just find a way.
I once called Here's that Rainy Day in a workshop with Guinga. He said he loved the tune and played an incredible chord melody version of it. Using his wild open string voicings and sounding like he wrote the tune. Then, a singer said she wanted to sing the tune and began in a different key. Whereupon Guinga played it immediately, with just as rich a harmony, including a different set of wild open string chords, and sounded, again, like he wrote the tune. Guinga doesn't read music and isn't a jazz player. His conception is, arguably, more classically influenced, but some of his tunes work well for jazz.
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Some chords I wouldn't know how to play sans thumb
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Originally Posted by strumcat
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To echo Christian in post #57 above; "Technique" is not a board approved numbered set of rules that defines correct from incorrect. Technique is what you need to do in order to express your interpretation of a piece of notated music or your own musical idea. No person who's opinion is of any significance cares one bit about HOW you played something well. If it sounds good that is evidence that you employed "correct" technique. Using standard Classical guitar technique and applying it while trying to emulate SRV, Pat Martino or Ritchie Havens is not something I'd want to listen to.
I don't thumb notes with my thumb because I never developed it. When I watch Metheny play acoustic I wish I had.
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I was self taught up until I went to study at the Conservatorium so I developed lots of bad technique/habits. Benefits were that I had a great ear from years and years of ear training (basically learned to play from listening to recordings of the greats), but my reading was very much sub-par. I use my thumb a lot. I also don't use my 4th finger nearly as much as I should.
I'm trying to improve my technique as there are times where I think it limits my options as to what I play. This applies predominately to the 4th finger not being used enough. The thumb however I find really useful. For many years I played in guitar duo, it was really useful for walking bass while comping chords.
I'm also interested to make my technique more efficient and hopefully ensure I can keep playing with minimal issues when as I get older. I'm only 27 now, but I know many players are struggling with age related issues (some are only in the 50s) that have affected their guitar playing. I hope to be out there gigging still when I'm in my 90s if all goes to plan!
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Originally Posted by joe2758
It's not an ideal technique, but in some cases necesarry to play 5 notes. if i can avoid the thumb, i do.
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For me it is an absolutely integral "technique" when comping - I quickly adapted this when I realized that it's a very good method to save sheer muscle strength on a long night.
No hand-position, left or right etc. is less acceptable, not "less ideal" or whatever if it makes one play better, saves energy and brings the music forward. Dogmas of any kind are always questionable. What would Hendrix say to this ? .....
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People often learn their technique as beginners without understanding the why and the trade offs. This leads to people being dogmatic about technique because they don’t actually understand it.
classical guitar technique has trade offs appropriate to the music classical guitarists are expected to play. It is by no means the ideal technique for all music although it can be surprisingly versatile.
Furthermore the exact design and dimensions of the classical instrument are designed in sympathy with that technique.
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I'm not much of a player but if there's a moment when thumb over the neck makes sense (and that includes not hindering what comes immediately before or after) then I'll employ it. But I don't generally court that as an approach and if in the future I learn why and how to avoid it then I'm cool with that too.
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The thumb is huge for me, I use it all the time.
The pinky...I was lazy coming up...I don't use it much in single note lines.
But oddly enough, a lot of my favorite players don't either.
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I voted for thumb over neck. But I have problems doing it. For instance, this A7 chord.
I can play the 6th string with my thumb, but depending on the guitar, the 5th string will ring out. It's easier for me to rearrange, and play the 6th string with my first finger. Even easier is to mute the 1st and 2nd strings, and play the C# on the 4th fret, 5th string. Same shape as a 5th string based 7#9 chord, just on the 6th string.
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Heindrix is alive
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I used to, but after years of serious classical study it just doesn't feel right. I see the use for it (Metheny comes to mind) and have no problem with it. Just uncomfortable for me.
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There is no "wrong" way when it comes to finger technique. Anything that gets the job done is fair game.
Chief Xian aTunde Adjuah (Christian Scott)
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