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Hey, do any of you use a thumb pick? Although I don’t use it exclusively, I have been experimenting with it for jazz. Some benefits:
> You can alternate between thumb and index or thumb and middle finger and solve the problem of pick hand string-skipping, playing very fluid lines, and the thumb pick/finger alternations create an interesting rhythmic lilt.
> You can pinch the thumb pick with middle or ring finger and use it as if it was a flat pick. Reverse angling it G. Benson style seems to work best.
> Of course you get all the benefits of finger-style playing with the thumb pick covering the bass strings and your other four fingers freed up.
I recommend trying it out!
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11-21-2024 07:13 PM
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Lenny Breau did.
Lorne Lofsky does.
I do.
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Just curious… how do you play single note lines? thx
Originally Posted by pcjazz
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Brent Mason
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Thumb and fingers. Thumbpick held like a flatpick for the occasional sweep. Originally Posted by RobSilver7
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With most thumb picks you can do alternate picking by grasping the pick with your index finger.
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I tried (exactly because I wanted to have both fingers and a pick), but I find thumb-pick difficult to control proper angle and touch, it is too straightforward tone and attack to me. With a regular pick I normally have very soft grip, the pick is not hardly fixed, always shifts and moves a bit, angle of attack is changed. With a thumb pick it is fixed. Originally Posted by RobSilver7
Maybe it is possible to find a suitable thumb pick, to adjust length and cut the edges the way you need and then develop a technique but I decided not to invest time in it.
I wish I could have just magical John Stowell 'sticky' pick)))
As a result I just put the pick away (hide it in the palm under ring finger and pinky and then play with a thumb and index and middle finger) mostly I do it occasionally and do not even notice it.
I think Sco does something like this.
Being originally a non-pick player I feel more comfortable and direct control with my flesh on strings, but sometimes I like specific phrasing and texture that you can achieve with the pick.
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Check these out. SharkTooth & Kodiak Crossover Pick
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I have converted to using a thumbpick and fingers for playing jazz as well as everything else over the past few months. I use a Fred Kelly Bumblebee pick, the Jazz XH version. I find that my picking feels freer than it ever has in 45 years. I have recurrently tried to convert to using a thumbpick over the decades, possibly originally inspired by Chet Atkins and later by Lenny Breau, Lorne Lofsky, etc. The typical pick is designed to be used with fingerpicks, only doing down strokes with the thumb. That never worked for me. When I discovered the Fred Kelly picks, it became possible. I have also tried Fred's Slick Pick, and Speed Picks without them working quite as well. I've also used the Herco flat thumbpick, which sounds nice but doesn't work quite as well. There is some flexibility in the way the pick blade is attached to the thumb ring with the Fred Kelly Bumblebee pick that works much better for me. I can play polyphonically with pick and fingers and I can play single notes using up- and downstrokes of the pick (which feels very much like using a standard flatpick).
BUMBLEBEE Jazz 3 Pack
BUMBLEBEE Teardrop 3 Pack
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So the Kodiak and Bumblebee picks are both a pick plus pick holder, but the former is a fabric holder while the latter is plastic. I would think the fabric holder would allow more movement of the pick in one's hand? That may address the static pick angle handicap that Jonah mentioned, when he said: "With a regular pick I normally have very soft grip, the pick is not hardly fixed, always shifts and moves a bit, angle of attack is changed. With a thumb pick it is fixed." I had this same issue with regular thumb picks.
Cunamara, is this a problem for you at all with the Bumblebee pick holder?
Lorne Lofsky played with a standard pick before he switched to a thumb pick and fingers, he said a regular pick was holding him back. I wonder what kind of thumbpick he uses?
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+1 Bumble bee
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. Fred Kelly speed pick ( thumb) heavy derlin Originally Posted by Mick-7
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The problem for me with the Kodiak type pick is that I use very little of the point of the pick sticking out from under my thumb, when I'm using a regular plectrum. It is barely visible when looking down at my picking hand. I find that the fabric hits the strings and creates other problems. It's like trying to play with a Band-Aid wrapped around my thumb. if I was someone who played with a lot of the pick sticking out from under my thumb, maybe it wouldn't bother me. I see some folks who seem to have at least half of the pic protruding out from their fingers, which is perhaps more common than my method which has only a couple of millimeters of pick showing. That might be why I like really small picks like the D'Andrea Pro Plec 358. Originally Posted by Mick-7
The Bumblebee isn't a pick holder as such; the pick blade is attached to the thumb ring permanently. It does move (in and out from under your thumb and also rotates). The pick can also rock up and down as one plays alternate strokes, which I like because it makes it feel more like a plectrum that I'm holding between my thumb and forefinger. When I alternate pick with the Bumblebee, I tend to grip the pick as if it were a plectrum.
Edit- The Fred Kelly Slick Pick has a really nice tone. Like most thumpicks, I don't find it works well for alternate picking. The Speed Pick was designed with Doyle Dykes, if I understand correctly. It is more flexible than the Slick Pick and the tone is slightly thinner, but if the guitar is bassy one might like that. Works and sounds great for Doyle!Last edited by Cunamara; 11-23-2024 at 09:44 PM.
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We always should consider a personal background…
Lorne Lofsky in an inreview tells in details how he came to using a thumbpick, and about his technique with it…
For him it was a part of a switch to fingerstyle playing, and as he had no conventional ( quasi classical) technique, obviously he was looking for solutions.
And in his case it seems very logical that he says that the pick holding him back… it is not a switch to a thumbpick but a switch to fingerstyle that
was essential in his case.
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Much the same for me. I prefer playing chordally with thumb and fingers, as this gives much more control over voicing, bass movement, etc. However, unlike Lorne I prefer to play single lines with a pick rather than thumb and finger or alternating fingers.
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I played classical since 10 (though I hated nails always) and much later I began to play lutes, eventually adapted lute right hand technique to guitars. Originally Posted by Cunamara
But the thing is I began to play with a pick (and steel string guitars/ or electric guitars) when I was already adult and though I got confidence with a pick I still feel more comfortable with fingers.
But I like some possibilities that the pick gives: I like rough and gentle chordal swipes, I like also the feeling the your hand becomes a single unit with a pick at the end... I find that it gives a very strong vocal feeling as if you play a cello or a horn... I think it is more about mentality than actual sound.
I also like the variety of attacks with a pick in slow tempo: deep rest strokes, I often play upwards only, different angles
With fingers I immediately think in turmd of harmonic instrument.
more or less I learned to imitate it some of it fingers... like playing with a thumb or with just one finger (or lute p-i)... etc.
But still sometimes I miss the pick.
Also with steel strings playing with fingers flesh is not always the tone and articulation I liked.
So I had an idea about a thumb pick... but it is not a 'game changer' for me of course as in the case of Lorne.
Currently I mostly play with fingers but just keep a pick somewhere around)
Thumb pick is also awkward for me for a thumb playing... I do not use nails and it feels like it is an artificial nail... I have very rough attack, no real contact... so bass lines become really 'formalistic'... no depth, no nuances, no flexibility... maybe I could have practiced to achieve it. maybe i will try one day once again with this Bumblebee pick
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Looks to me like he often plays single lines with the thumb-pick alone (e.g, sweep picking arpeggios) but uses thumb and index finger for lines with larger intervals such as 6ths. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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Me too. Originally Posted by pcjazz
I use a Fred Kelly slick pick, with filed down tips. For single note passages, I sometimes use the pick alone, sometimes alternate pick with index, and sometimes use middle and index fingers. The faster the lines I'm playing, the more likely I am to use the pick alone. I also sometimes play harmonised lines - the right hand fingers used depend on which strings are involved; on adjacent strings for instance, I use index and middle fingers, and use them together for both down and up strokes - this is a variation of a technique I was taught by Scotty Anderson, who has a huge array of right hand techniques to call on.
One technique worth practising is to play scales in triplets using a pattern of thumb, index, middle - start each new string when ascending, with the middle finger.
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Ron Eschete
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This is my first post!!!
Some good insights and nice to hear from others that use a thumbpick.
I use a thumbpick for jazz--for single note lines I alternate between thumb and pointer or alternate between pointer and middle. I also play classical guitar, 5-string banjo, lap steel, dobro, and fingerstyle, so it feels comfortable to use my fingers. I switched from a flat pick because:
- I can still get a slow, expressive sound with my pointer and middle fingers and altering the attack
- Arpeggios are more common in jazz lines, and it's just easier for my hand to play them across the strings at faster speeds rather than manage the up-down of a pick.
- Playing chords feels more controlled, both in dynamics and breaking chords up the way a pianist would
I did lose a little bit of single-note speed with the switch, as alternating between index and thumb has a lower speed threshold than the wrist motion with a flatpick, but what I lost in speed I gained in accuracy.
I use a Kelly Slick Pick, which I alter by cutting a slot in the middle and then making another cut angled across half the pick, so that it bends on the upstroke but not on the down. That makes it feel more flatpick-ish if I want to dig in with standard picking.
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If I play a bit too much jazz guitar my thumb grows a builtin pick, some kind of cor in the form of a ridge that can be just as bothersome (on the higher strings) as an actual thumbpick is for me.
I kind of wonder if this would happen less with a ground- or flat-wound 6th string.
I tried to learn to use a butterfly pick on my thumb to prevent this, but the thing just won't stay in place (sound is perfect though).
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Welcome to the forum! I'd be surprised if someone with the forum name "banjohood" did not use a thumb-pick. Originally Posted by banjohood
Not sure I follow your plectrum surgery lesson, could you a post a photo of it? - that is, if it's not too gory.
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Here, you can see that when I make the cut across, I do it at an upward angle (steep bevel cut) so that the pick feels solid on the downstroke, but flexes on the upstroke. I tried to take a picture leaning the pick on my knee so you can see how it would flex. On the downstroke, it feels nearly as solid as if the pick wasn't cut at all.
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Thank you, I think I'll need to buy one of these picks to really understand what you've done to it. Originally Posted by banjohood
Looks like it bled when you cut it? I sure hope you anaesthetised it before the surgery!
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Looks like you used a Dremel with a mini saw blade?
what I like about the Bumblebee pick is that there is some movement and flexibility with the pick blade at the attachment point to the thumb ring, which helps the pick feel more natural when doing alternate picking. The Slick Pick, in it's natural state, is too stiff for that. I might sacrifice one of my Slick Picks and try this, because the sound of that pick is really nice.
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