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I really think Gibson humbuckers have the best sound for that warm jazz tone. They seem to have an emphasis right in the right place to get that mid range emphasis. I’d like one for my seven string but didn’t think they make them, as I’ve never seen one and I’ve never seen a seven string Gibson, until I recently saw a seven string Les Paul on reverb. Does anybody know where I can find a seven string Gibson pick up? I know Seymour Duncan and DiMarzio make them but it would just be a shot in the dark since I don’t know how they sound.
Thank you for any help.
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04-15-2023 03:26 PM
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I have plain old Duncan humbuckers in my ESP 7 and they sound great - warm, full, and balanced. And I have an Epiphone LP7 from the ‘90s that came with whatever humbuckers Gibson put in them at the time. They were also decent but not quite as warm and mellow as the Duncans in my ESP (also from the ‘90s).
Originally Posted by voyage
I have a pair of Lace Alumitone humbuckers in a 7 string Tele that are great for jazz. They’re very responsive to both guitar and amp EQ controls and do warm jazz, cool funk, and anything in between. But the best jazz tone I get from my 7s (regardless of body style) comes from the Benedetto B7 in my Ibanez archtop and the Kent Armstrong hand wound 14 pole HB in a carved solid Eastman archtop.
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Peter Biltoft Vintage Vibe Pickups can wind you just about anything you want. And at a very fair price! Highly Recommend!
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Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
Hey, thanks for the reply. I also have an Armstrong in a solid carved Eastman. It is the best sounding guitar I have. I don’t think I’d ever part with it. If you listen to Dave Stryker, for example on The Chaser, I really love his warm guitar tone and it’s a very different thing than the Eastman gets. Not the beautiful wooden acoustic sound of the Eastman. I’d like to have that tone on tap too and he’s using a 345 with Gibson pick ups.
currently Seymour sells two PAF pick ups, one that is a low output ceramic, and the other one is a six string only. Do you know what the particular model number of your Seymour PAF is? Or the exact name? Thanks a lot.
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I would have no idea how to tell him to wind it to produce the sound in my head. It’s impossible to convey the idea of a sound unless we can both be talking about the same pick up. I guess I could send my guitar to them but it’s impractical and they’re not willing to do that anyway. I’ve talked with Seymour Duncan two or three times about this, and they just really don’t have anything to say. The guy who talks to people about this stuff said they just have no idea with jazz guitars or jazz tones. That’s why I’m asking about the Gibsons, because at least I know how they sound; in my 10 year old Epi 335 has that sound, but I need it for seven string.
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My ESP is almost 30 years old, so I have no idea what the pickups are. The ‘95 catalog (which was the year I got it, as I recall) just lists them as “Seymour Duncan humbucking pickups” on the options page, for an additional $125. Originally Posted by voyage
As it’s a hardtail arched top solid body with a simple 4-3 headstock and no points, it’s not a metal head’s guitar. They’re not high output and they’re warmer and smoother than the DiMarzio Blaze that came in one of my Ibanez 7s. So I suspect they’re Alnico rather than ceramic. I haven’t measured their impedance or output voltage.
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I love the Gibson sound. Gibson unfortunately does not make 7 string pickups. Duncan fortunately has been making a huge lineup of pickups lots of which are for 7, and of that, there are two alnico pickups that fall into the range of sound of a Gibson (PAF) sound: The upper frequency 'sharper' sounding Jazz and the rounder warmer sounding 59 model. I have installed both of these in many guitars and a lot depends on the instrument they're in and what is wanted. I've installed Jazz pickups for owners who had guitars that could use an articulate higher end if they seemed inherently warm but missing attack. Because the 59 is so much like a PAF, any time someone says 'warm and mellow, I'll install a 59, especially if the guitar is already solid on the attack and not as heavy on overtones in the envelope; I most often put a 59 on a laminated hollow body.
There are 7 string distortion PU's and high output and even active pickups Duncan offers but I can't say I've had personal experience with them.
Good luck.
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Thanks, that's really helpful. Your description of the jazz fits what I have been told by Seymour Duncan, and they also suggested that 59. Originally Posted by Jimmy blue note
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Jimmy, what have you most often Installed in a solid carved top archtop?Thanks so much.
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In guitars where players were trying to achieve a (more acoustic?) clear high end, and for me personally because I play fingerstyle and like the combination that might lean more towards the classical guitar attack I crave, I use the jazz. But I'm in the minority. Originally Posted by voyage
The majority of those after a more "jazzy" or hornlike warmth are really happy with the 59. Especially if it's replacing most stock pickups, the Duncans have a clarity that just feels good to play. But yeah, the 59 is what most players like in their L-5 type guitars. It brings out the warmth.
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Thank you Jimmy. Your extensive experience really gives you a knowledge of this that you don't really find in most players, who haven't enough experience to be sure about these things. Given that, one more data point from your opinion would be very helpful. I have a solid archtop with a Kent Armstrong, and it seems on the other end of the spectrum from warmth towards having a crispness and more analytical accuracy that really lets the wooden tone shine. I like that for a beautiful sounding wooden tone. But I really seek that more warm sound so a 59 might be worth trying for me. How would you describe the Kent Armstrong in comparison to the jazz and 59? Assuming you've had a chance to hear the Kent Armstrongs. Clearly you're a tech or a luthier, and I appreciate hearing from your experience, thanks. If you were in New Mexico I'd let you work on my guitars. Eager to hear your opinions.
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I'm just one person with an opinion, just fortunate enough to have the luxury of getting paid to tinker, ha ha, but still one man's opinion. Hey try this: get a screw driver and lower your Armstrong a little in the pickup surround, in other words screw the entire pickup away from the strings a little bit at a time. See how that changes (and how it retains) certain qualities. Every pickup has a tonal range inherent to it but also a surprising amount of variation that can be adjusted through things like pickup height, string gauge, picking technique, pick material and thickness, (amps, guitar cords...even one's age as a player's hearing changes), and even of course, the guitar design and material, so I am reluctant to make all out comparisons or even suggestions. One thing that Duncan used to do, I don't know if they still do, is allow you to send a pickup back if it's not what you hoped for. Another thing they do is they have a custom shop run by Seymour and MJ and they can make you something custom. Originally Posted by voyage
I have worked with Armstrongs, both domestic and Asian variations and I (in my own prejudiced ear) don't like Asian contracted ones and have found the American ones to be quite different, articulate and quite evenly warm but again, I have an ear match with the Duncans and they're my personal go-to.
Many times if someone wants to switch out an Asian pickup, I'll make recommendations and then we'll try a swap. On high end or post market pickups, I'll strongly recommend you find out all the facets of your pickup, lower it, raise it, balance it with your string set, etc.
Honestly, pickups are such a rabbit hole. Once you get pulled into the obsessive zone, you wind up with a drawer full of pickups like the box beside me now. That's cool but don't let too much soldering time take away from your practice time!!
Have fun, good luck.
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Jimmy, thanks a lot. Knowledge like that is hard to get, so it’s much appreciated.
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For a modern alternative...........
I've used Bare Knuckle Warpig with Alnico5 in two seven string semis I've owned.
I've just ordered another for my latest solid body guitar build.
The Warpig | Bare Knuckle Pickups
The bass is very tight, more defined, obviously louder compared to a low output PAF type pickup, also it has more middle, but less treble.
Personally, I think that the higher output modern humbuckers have a better bass sound. But, every person has different hearing taste.
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GuyBoden, thank you for the tip. Would you mind telling what 7-string semis you have or have seen? I can only think of three. The Edwards e-tc-7st, a 7-string 335, which I really tried to buy before they were discontinued a few months ago; a Schecter Jazz-7, which I fortunately bought one of a few months ago; and a Raines ES-7, which I hopefully will be buying soon when Matt gets his batch in this year. I sure wanted an Edwards but I think I probably will never see one again. I'm dying to know which ones you are referring to. Thanks a bunch.
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I've gotten one of these and of course I do my own work on them, but I took this guitar, leveled the frets and put Duncans in it and I just wanted a workhorse guitar but it's become my favourite semi 7. No kidding. I love it. And about $500 with Duncan pickups. You can even have them put your name on it. Comes in blonde too.
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Jimmy, wow, that looks interesting. I hopped on Ebay and it looks like quite a few of those are for sale. I'm going to get one. I saw the cherry sunburst like yours, a traditional sunburst, and blonde. For that price it doesn't seem like you can go wrong. Thanks a lot.
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I’ve been thinking about that Grote ever since I first saw them on eBay. Reviews of their products have been strong, and Jimmy’s endorsement really seals it. My only remaining concerns are the risk (financial & personal info security) and physical uncertainty (safe, predictable delivery) of buying direct from a vendor in China who’s totally unknown to me.
JBN, from whom did you buy yours?
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Jimmy that looks like it has minii tuners like a strat. Is there room to put full sized Grovers or Gotohs on it? Originally Posted by Jimmy blue note
I've gotten one of these and of course I do my own work on them, but I took this guitar, leveled the frets and put Duncans in it and I just wanted a workhorse guitar but it's become my favourite semi 7. No kidding. I love it. And about $500 with Duncan pickups. You can even have them put your name on it. Comes in blonde too.
Thanks.
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The best tuners I’ve found for tight 7 string heads are Grover minis. I found a 12 string set on sale years ago and put 7 on my Epi LP7. The posts are big and strong enough to drill out safely for a big 7th - I use a 72 on the LP. They’re still good as new after 20 years of heavy use on blues gigs. Originally Posted by voyage
My Raines Tele7 has a tight 7 in line head. Sperzels with their pin mount (no screw tab) are just about touching on it - I don’t think there’d be room for any tuners with a traditional external screw tab. And Sperzel will sell a single matching one with an oversized post & hole to go with a set of 6. Grover was willing to sell me a set of 7 standard tuners - but when I measured, they wouldn’t fit.
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I have a Schecter Omen 7. It has pretty high output I think and they sound pretty good with flat wound strings. That would certainly be an interesting one to try, thanks for the link. They even do eight strings. I almost went that direction but I feel I’d have to totally switch to eight string guitars. I have to stick with one kind or I get lost when I switch. The scale length on the one I looked at was too long anyway so I didn’t buy it. The only eight string archtop I’ve seen is the one Robert Conti plays and sells. Originally Posted by GuyBoden
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So you don’t think you could put full-size tuners on the Grote? I really like to be able to grab a full-size tuner so it needs space in between them, and it doesn’t look like that could happen on your Grote. Maybe those Grover minis would be good for it. I’m going to get one.I’ve never minded the minis on my Strats so I guess it will be OK.
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I've had a few semi guitars custom built in the Uk, but I had a good made in China semi too. Originally Posted by voyage
Jimmybluenote's made in china link looks good, but you will need to setup/fret level a made in china guitar.
Bare Knuckle Warpig in my semi I sold a few years ago.
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I prototyped one directly from the Ebay seller. Their service correspondance was excellent and the guitar was delivered as soon as it was built and packed well in a form fitting foam shipping box (no case). Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
They put my shop's logo on it and I set to customizing it right out of the box.
I leveled the frets so I could get the action down to a professional road worthy tolerance, I replaced the pickups with Duncan Jazz and Custom (my own personal choice, I would have been equally happy with a '59 in the neck).
Because it's 4 conductor wiring, I put a series/parallel switch in a mini toggle.
I like a custom asymmetrical neck contour (thumb on back player) so I re-contoured the neck (why not? I do it for a living) and yes I put sperzels on it although the mini's that came on were quite good.
I play sitting down so I put a Performaxe leg lift on it. Now it balances like a Klein, 45 degree angle, perfect.
When I got done, the other parts cost me maybe $300 more, and the guitar was so perfect that I'm having them build me a regular bunch for the shop to sell. Yeah I play this a LOT now, it's a total delight.
I did a lot to mine but honestly with a simple pickup swap and a good setup, (go for the fret level), this is my million dollar go-to now.
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I suspect they're not going to go that route for a one-off, so I need to find a reliable vendor. Grote has a website, but they show no 7s on it. They also sell through Amazon, but they don't list any 7s there either. I'll do the frets and set it up myself. I have a pair of HB-sized Lace Alumitones in the Raines Tele7 right now that I'll put into the Grote. If I like the Grote as much as you do, I'll put the generic humbuckers back in the Raines that came in it. Originally Posted by Jimmy blue note
I certainly don't need 3 solid body 7s plus the Grote any more, so I'll sell the Raines if the Grote is good - it's only about 3 years old, and it's worth considerably more than either of the other solids. They have little resale value, but I'm sentimental about my hardtail ESP 7 (my first 7 string guitar, bought new 30 years ago) and my heavily modified '90s Epi LP7 with a single EMG (neck) and a Roland GK pickup. And I recently redid the frets and setups on both, so they play and sound great. A good small semi would fill out the pack very well without the Raines.
Inerestingly enough, my wife also thinks this is a good idea
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anyone selling an ibanez pm120?
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