The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #51

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    Plasticpigeon, I guess you could say I consider the Elitist Epi on par with the Gibson, but the Epi is closer to an L-5 CES than a Wesmo, with less acoustic properties. The Gibsons are hand carved and beautiful, but when it comes down to plugging in and playing a gig, I like the sound of the Epi as well or better and it actually plays better than any Gibson I have had (L-5, L-7, ES-175). Keep in mind I'm talking about the Elitist made in Japan. The standard Korean guitars are a great value, but not as nice.

    I also had a Greg Bennett--one of the floating pickup ones--and it was okay for the money, but I didn't keep it.

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  3. #52

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    Thanks Chazmo, that is interesting. I have an elitist, I put a pic up earlier in this thread, which for me plays better than anything else I have ever owned too, but in my case it is also the most expensive guitar I have ever owned so I have not compared it with any real high end instruments.

  4. #53

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    Epiphone Broadway?-broadway-jpg

    Here is mine, and it is a lovely guitar. Sounds quite different now I've put .12 flatwounds on...
    That tailpiece means finding much longer strings for the D string though!

  5. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by plasticpigeon
    Thanks Chazmo, that is interesting. I have an elitist, I put a pic up earlier in this thread, which for me plays better than anything else I have ever owned too, but in my case it is also the most expensive guitar I have ever owned so I have not compared it with any real high end instruments.
    Well, you may have to make that journey into the high end (read: expensive) guitars just like I did, but don't be surprised if you come back full circle to your Epi!

  6. #55

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    I have an Epiphone Broadway (Peerless) and want to put a new pickup in the neck position. But I really don't want to spend more than $100 on the pickup, which rules out the boutique pickup brands.

    I've been eyeing the Stewart-MacDonald catalogue and their "Golden Age Parson Street" pickup line. For about $60 it sounds like a great pickup, but of course in their catalogue they'll always make it sound like a great pickup!

    Any suggestions for something that would move this Epi Broadway in the direction of a classic Gibson L5CES type of tone?

    Caveat: I know tone is in my hands, I know tone is not in the pickup, etc. etc. But the pickup is a card played on the tone table, and I'd like a pretty good card to play there!

  7. #56

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    I put those in my Sebring L5 and like them.

    Epiphone Broadway?-file-1493-jpg
    Epiphone Broadway?-file-2177-jpg
    Last edited by icr; 01-07-2016 at 05:08 PM.

  8. #57

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    I would go with the stew mac parson street. From what I have heard, it is a really good sounding pickup. And you can choose alnico magnets. Alnico 2 is the classic Gibson paf I believe. But I like the alnico 5 for its tighter bass response. Good luck!

  9. #58

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    Duncan Seth Lover about $105.00 on eBay including shipping. There is no better classic PAF sound than what Seth Lover originally designed.

  10. #59

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    For the money the Seymour Duncan 59 is a good PUP and a few dollars more the Seth Lover.

  11. #60

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    Gibson Classic 57' or 490R. Look around, the last 490R I got was about $70, however that was chrome not gold. R

  12. #61

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    +1 for the Seth Lover.

    Unlike the majority of humbuckers, it is unpotted, so it has this slight honk and sometimes surprising response.
    A lovely pickup indeed, at a very reasonable price.

    Otherwise, i have a SD59 on an SG and it sounds very good too, but i would say that it just does not have the slightly added magic of an unpotted pickup. It's subtle but it's here.

    The Seth Lover is being built on the very same machines as vintage PAFs, as smart Seymour bought them from Gibson (what a bummer !)

    Seymour Duncan is great, no hype and greatly priced.
    Last edited by xuoham; 01-08-2016 at 12:39 AM.

  13. #62

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    Bartolini 5J. Duncan 59, Jazz.

  14. #63

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    Classic 57's can be muddy. I've always been intrigued by the Seth Lover's but never tried one. for neck p/ups, I've been using the DeArmond Gold p/ups that (Fender/Guild) DeArmond guitars had in the late 90's. Alnico V magnets give more clarity in the bass notes.

  15. #64

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    Quote Originally Posted by xuoham
    +1 for the Seth Lover.

    Unlike the majority of humbuckers, it is unpotted, so it has this slight honk and sometimes surprising response.
    a lovely pickup indeed, at a very reasonable price.

    ....
    What's a "slight honk"?

  16. #65

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    Well I agree w/ a lot of the above comments. I have not heard the Stew Mac Golden Age p/ups so no comment on them. Seth Lovers are an excellent choice, aggree Classic 57's can be on the harsh side of PAF's I also agree on Alnico 2 magnets being a bit sweeter in tone. For my $$ I've been most pleased w/ Manilus PAFs in both my Benetto Bambino and a Gibson ES-339.Humbuckers ? Manlius Guitar

  17. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    What's a "slight honk"?
    A slightly nasal quality, or, if you prefer, an accentuation of the area around 800Hz-1kHz, specially with chord blocks on 1,2,3,4 strings up the neck.
    Becaused the pickup is somehow microphonic it sometimes enhances some frequencies in an unexpected way.

    Beautiful, this L5 btw, icr !
    Last edited by xuoham; 01-08-2016 at 12:46 AM.

  18. #67

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    So, inspired by icr, I've decided to replace all the electronics in my Epiphone Broadway except for the bridge pickup, which I never use. I'll go with CTS pots, Switchcraft pickup switch and output jack, and I'm going to try the Stewart-MacDonald Parson Street "Hot" pickup with the Alnico 2 magnet.

    I am still puzzling over Pots and Caps. I see a lot of people using the 250k pot for the tone control, and yet many guitars ship with 500k. I'm also thinking for tone of using a linear rather than audio taper, mainly because I want the more gradual slope.

    Does that make sense or am I way off?

    I'm also puzzling over the cap value. The old .022 vs. .047, or how about a compromise at .033?

    I'm planning to breadboard this all on a piece of plywood that approximates the proportions of the guitar top, and then transfer to the guitar.

    GULP.

  19. #68

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    I used 500K and 0.022. I like Linear pots for clean sounds. If you use audio, going from 10 to 9 is nearly the entire range for clean playing.

    I marked the holes on clear plastic then transferred that to cardboard, on which I mounted the pots. You can solder the whole thing away from the guitar, then feed it through the pickup holes. You have already passed strings through the holes and tied them to the pots, so slowly pull up on the strings to get the pots into place. Tie a washer on a string and pass it through the 1/4" phone jack and pull on that also. I had to enlarge all the holes in the guitar for the USA pots and USA Switchcraft Jack. I'm hard core, so I even installed a Gibson rubber grommet for the switch.
    Epiphone Broadway?-file-904-jpg
    Epiphone Broadway?-file-2430-jpg
    Epiphone Broadway?-file-655-jpg
    Epiphone Broadway?-file-1166-jpg

  20. #69

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    Some like to darken their sound and use 300k pots with their humbuckers. Others (like I) like the open sound of 500k pots. 250k is standard with fender single coils.

    In fact the audio taper as tone pot will give You a gradual shift. Linear works fine for the vol pots.

    Do You use Your tone pot? If it is all the time at 10 the cap won't affect.

    If You want the Gibson sound I would highly recommend the Classic 57's for Your pickup. If You have a budget, change the neck pu first.

    Seths are great too but some hear a upper mid spike with them.

    I have found a great result with a Burstbucker 1 as a neck pu in my ES-175. A bit more open and articulate than Classic 57 and no boominess. But their character vary, next Bb1 (from my LP R8) was only lame in that guitar!

    And for more cheap: diMarzio 36th Paf's are praised for their sound too. I had them once in a Les Paul and I have nothing bad to say about them. Balanced and clear pickups.

    And last thing: there is a vast market for used pickups. You don't have to buy new. Check My Les Paul and The Gear Page classifieds.

    Good luck!

  21. #70

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    Also consider the treble bleed circuit from stewmac. Keeps the tone as if you were on 10 throughout the sweep instead of getting a muddy tone as soon as you turn the volume down.

    Golden Age Treble Bleed Circuit | stewmac.com

  22. #71

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    I have a StewMac Golden Age neck pickup in my early 90ies Sheraton: works great in that guitar. An SD 59 did not work in that guitar for some reason: too scooped and too much highs for an all maple guitar.

    The Golden Age sat first in my Japanese ES-175 copy where it was ok, but a bit too dark and boomy. A gibson Burstbucker #1 performed much better in that guitar - and has been in there ever since.

    My Gibson ES-333 came with a pair of 57 classics and it sounds great with them. I have to check what pots are in that guitar, because the feel and taper of the pots are excellent! I know it has the cheap little orange ceramic caps and they do a good job apparently.

    Two things I have learned from changing pickups and wiring in guitars:

    1) a pickup that sounds great in one guitar could be just average or even lacking in another; unfortunately trial and error is the only way to find out

    2) don't waste money on caps: there's no difference in sound, only the differences in their uF-cap value can be heard.
    Last edited by Little Jay; 01-09-2016 at 05:54 AM.

  23. #72

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    Quote Originally Posted by Little Jay
    An SD 59 did not work in that guitar for some reason: too scooped and too much highs for an all maple guitar.
    You could've just change the magnet.

    An A3 makes an '59n an excellet budget choice, specially in semi- and full- hollows with a low-mid resonance peak. Combining that with an A2 in the '59b, you'll have an excellent-sounding p'up set for the price, specially if you're buying second-hand.

    But, if you're willing to go the "boutique" path, I don't think you can get an arguably "better" tone than the one delivered by the Electric City Pickups' "Skydogs" set, formerly known as the "Fatty 57" set.

    Tone for centuries and then some.

    HTH,

  24. #73

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    In selecting a pickup, I have one choice I've not mentioned. WAAAAY back in the 1990's when I had a Gibson ES175 I changed out the original neck pickup for a Benedetto B6. Now, the B6 in the 1990's was not the Seymour Duncan model sold today, but was made by Kent Armstrong. My recollection was that I really liked the sound, but I knew little else and the stock pickups on my 80's-90's Gibson had not impressed me that much. They were kind of "jangly" if that makes sense.

    SO… I'm thinking I might try this pickup since I already own it.

    As soon as I have all the parts--those linear taper CTS 500k pots are hard to find!-- I plan to start this project.

  25. #74

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    Gibson used 300k pots in their guitars for humbuckers and P90s in the late 50s; that's part of the classic tones of Tal Farlow, Jim Hall, Kenny Burrell, early Pat Metheny, etc. The use of 500k pots came later as distortion became the normal sound for guitar and more highs were necessary. The early PAF pickups were underwound by modern standards and hence often brighter than today's 11k+ monsters. If you are wanting that classic tone with the round, slightly dark top end then consider using the 300k pots. I use a 500k volume and 250k tone on my guitars with humbuckers with .033 or .047 cap. For some people that tone sounds muddy (if you want a Lenny Breau or Grant Green kind of tone, for example) and the 500ks pots will get them closer to that.

    As for tone caps- you literally can't hear them in a guitar circuit. All the signal that goes through them goes to groud and is never heard. What matters is the value of the cap because that determines the frequencies sent to ground. BTW a lot of those high buck repro caps are really just a wrapper over a cheap 1 cent ceramic cap!

    As for treble bleed circuits, if you use one, use the cap-resistor version rather than just the cap version. BTW, this is a cap you can actually hear because the highs are coming back through it to the circuit. It will reduce but not eliminate the change in tone that occurs when you roll down the volume. However, for jazz, that effect can be helpful in getting your tone and you lose it when you add the treble bleed circuit. But for a dark guitar that becomes too muddy too quickly it can be really helpful.

    I usually order from guitarpartsresource.com as their prices are good and they ship quickly. But there is no hand-holding on their website- it's just the parts and no ad content. You need to already know what you want.
    Last edited by Cunamara; 01-09-2016 at 02:31 PM.

  26. #75

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    Capacitors don't have any current going 'through' them. The capacitor modulates an ebb and flow resonance of electrical charge from the pickup's oscillating waveform. This is very audible. Basically, when activated, the capacitor is in direct contact with the signal and if you can't hear its effects, it is probably wired wrong or faulty.