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[must ... resist ... saying ... "'uninterested", not 'disinterested' ... must resist ... CAN'T RESIST!]. Sounds like we're in agreement that Deviser is not good at communicating.
Originally Posted by jzucker
What I was trying to say is that Ibanez emphasizes "made in Japan" on their MIJ models, and downplays country of origin for the others. For instance, the website has a "Made in Japan" banner for the GB10, but doesn't show CoO at all for the SE or the EM. If you know the model designation, you can tell whether or not it's from Japan via the website, but if it's not from Japan you can't tell where it's made. There are some obvious differences between an EM and the other two, and I can tell that the guitar you're picturing is not an EM. But without seeing the headstock I can't tell the difference 10 and an SE. So the best I can do is "not Indonesia". Originally Posted by jzucker
Please tell me where this instrument was made.
And please tell me how someone who isn't an ibanez expert can tell where this was made?
Attachment 97385
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12-14-2022 06:52 PM
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dis·in·ter·est·ed Originally Posted by John A.
/dis?int(?)r?st?d/
Learn to pronounce
adjective
- 1.
not influenced by considerations of personal advantage.
"a banker is under an obligation to give disinterested advice"
Similar:
unbiased
unprejudiced
impartial
neutral
nonpartisan
nondiscriminatory
detached
uninvolved
objective
dispassionate
impersonal
clinical
open-minded
fair
just
equitable
balanced
even-handed
unselfish
selfless
[COLOR=#BDC1C6 !important]free from discrimination[/COLOR]
[COLOR=#BDC1C6 !important]with no axe to grind[/COLOR]
without fear or favor
Opposite:
biased
- 2.
having or feeling no interest in something.
"her father was so disinterested in her progress that he only visited the school once"
Similar:
uninterested
indifferent
incurious
unconcerned
unmoved
If you have to go to the manufacturer's website it's not a good user information model. Additionally, the site does not make it clear where all models are manufactured. A quick search turned this up.What I was trying to say is that Ibanez emphasizes "made in Japan" on their MIJ models, and downplays country of origin for the others. For instance, the website has a "Made in Japan" banner for the GB10, but doesn't show CoO at all for the SE or the EM. If you know the model designation, you can tell whether or not it's from Japan via the website, but if it's not from Japan you can't tell where it's made. There are some obvious differences between an EM and the other two, and I can tell that the guitar you're picturing is not an EM. But without seeing the headstock I can't tell the difference 10 and an SE. So the best I can do is "not Indonesia".
GB10SE | GB | HOLLOW BODIES | PRODUCTS | Ibanez guitars
No indication whether this is indonesian, chinese or japanese. An ibanez geek might know that only the japanese models say "japan" on it but it's an informational #FAIL
- 1.
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I expect you are greatly confused regarding George Benson. Through personal experience, and first hand accounts of many others, George Benson shows great respect to others. I never met George Duke [RIP] but never heard any accounts of him being an A-hole. Originally Posted by RJVB
AKALast edited by AKA; 12-20-2022 at 11:14 PM.
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He isn’t confusing anybody. He’s clearly saying GB has the reputation of being an asshole (why doesn’t je just write the word?)
First of all talking bad about people just on reputation facts is not a good attitude.
Moreover doing it on a public forum, and GB is very respected here, is just nasty.
« sounds like you have the pockets and ground to sue them »
Sounds like GB could sue YOU for irrespect and insulting him on a public forum
And by the way my brother met GB after a concert in Morocco a few years ago. He was having a tea in the « souk » alleys. My brother was in awe and intimated (we’ve been listening GB since our teens)
The man let him sit with him for a tea and was just really nice and natural. Nothing of a a… hole.
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I don't understand this thread. It's a cheap guitar but the expectation is it be the same as a more expensive guitar. The only way to produce a guitar at this price point is to lower labor cost lower material cost. This is the end result. It would suit some players some not. So why the discussion?
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I think we’re agreeing here. If you have a guitar in hand there’s a country of origin label you can read. If you don’t, then you look at the website, which is vague for non-MIJ guitars. But I suspect only an Ibanez geek actually cares about country of origin. Originally Posted by jzucker
dis·in·ter·est·ed
/dis?int(?)r?st?d/
adjective
- 1.
not influenced by considerations of personal advantage.
"a banker is under an obligation to give disinterested advice"
Similar:
unbiased
unprejudiced
impartial
neutral
nonpartisan
nondiscriminatory
detached
uninvolved
objective
dispassionate
impersonal
clinical
open-minded
fair
just
equitable
balanced
even-handed
unselfish
selfless
[COLOR=#BDC1C6 !important]free from discrimination[/COLOR]
[COLOR=#BDC1C6 !important]with no axe to grind[/COLOR]
without fear or favor
Opposite:
biased
- 2.
having or feeling no interest in something.
"her father was so disinterested in her progress that he only visited the school once"
Similar:
uninterested
indifferent
incurious
unconcerned
unmoved
If you have to go to the manufacturer's website it's not a good user information model. Additionally, the site does not make it clear where all models are manufactured. A quick search turned this up.
GB10SE | GB | HOLLOW BODIES | PRODUCTS | Ibanez guitars
No indication whether this is indonesian, chinese or japanese. An ibanez geek might know that only the japanese models say "japan" on it but it's an informational #FAIL
- 1.
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No, the expectation is that a company with a reputation for high quality at all price points not sell guitars that have severe defects. I don’t think anyone on this thread expects that a guitar be the same as one that costs 2.5x as much, but I think we all expect it to be put together correctly, especially if it costs north of $1000. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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Quality comes at a price. You don't expect it to be the same as the one that costs 2.5 more, but at the same time it should be all right. Look around, this is below most offerings. $1000. dollars seems like a big number until you look at the price of everything else. You can have quality, you can have cheep, but you can't have both. Take your pick. It is what it is.... Originally Posted by John A.
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Sorry, but that's just not the case. We are in an age of phenomenally high quality of assembly and performance and low cost when it comes to guitars. It's not reasonable to expect that a cheaper look-like will be as good in every way as the high-end model it's based on. However, it's entirely reasonable to expect that the look-alike is made without major defects and be a usable instrument; nearly all the time this is what happens, which is why people are talking about the case in which it didn't. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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There is nothing I see in the first page showing this guitar has "major defects" rendering it unusable. Remember the only way this price point can even be accomplished is with low cost labor and material. I'd love for you to show me an example of a guitar made in the USA that can even come close to the price. We both know you can't. We will have to agree to disagree on this one.....
Originally Posted by John A.
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Look again. The photos show the neck separating from the body, frets separating from the neck catching the strings, and gaps between the nut and the neck, along with other more cosmetic problems. I never said a that a US made guitar could come close to this price. This entire thread is about Ibanez's different versions of the GB10 made to different price points, and usually doing so well but not in this case. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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Just one other thing. High quality players have much more stringent demands for their instruments. They know the difference. Ibanez has a guitar for you. This is for a market that is much different than something you would be looking for. I think they expect you to know that. Originally Posted by John A.
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Looks like you have difficulty reading or willing to understand what I actually wrote. Originally Posted by Jx30510
I won't go into what I think of anyone sueing for this kind of thing but rest assured that I have a principle of not going to countries where jurisdiction allows such things.
It also looks like you are calling me a liar (I have indeed always confused GB and GD), which is more an objective statement than a personal opinion.
Anyhew, let me amend my remark. [i]I understand from things read in a distant enough past that someone who may have been George Benson or another George has or had a royal a'hole reputation. I also understand from what has been written here in reaction that this was either an unfounded rumour or something based on an isolated incident probably taken out of context, or that I associated the anecdote with the wrong person. In which case I'm sorry I brought it up. Either way it was never meant to reflect on GB's qualities as a musican - I know other musicians whom I estimate greatly as such but who do have a reputation of being capable of bullying or indeed just being an a-hole.
To go back to guitars and workmanship: my Cordoba fits the description of a cheapish instrument that is (really) beautifully built but still unplayable because certain crucial build steps were not performed with the same level of quality as the rest. A flawless paint job, headstock inlay, complex purfling/binding or beautifully finished bracing & kerfing without a trace of glue stains is nice but I for one prefer a bit less attention to those cosmetic aspects and more attention fret, nut and bridge/saddle fit, seating and finish, plus to intonation. IMHO if workers can learn how to pull the former off they can also learn how to set action and intonation.
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I typically won't buy any guitar without playing it first, but it's even more important with instruments made overseas. You may get a great one for a great price, but then again you may not. Buying used would be advisable because green wood issues presumably would have surfaced by then.
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How many "high quality” musicians in the real world do you know? Cause I know a bunch who play modestly priced guitars. What people actually like tends to be personal and idiosyncratic, and keeping up with the Joneses is much less of a thing with people who really play than it is with people who talk about playing on the internet. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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This is a totally foolish comment. Originally Posted by John A.
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« Either way it was never meant to reflect on GB's qualities as a musican - I know other musicians whom I estimate greatly as such but who do have a reputation of being capable of bullying or indeed just being an a-hole.
So on a gear thread with someone upset with a Signature guitar, it comes at the end saying the artist has the « reputation « of being an .. … whatever.
the OP has disapeared after bashing the entire world.. troll or not ? ?
ok if it’s alright with you .. and you explain you are not even sure it concerns the « right « George?
wow. This forum is really getting absurd. I’m leaving this one for sure. Regards.
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Thanks. Coming from you, that's quite a compliment. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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I believe its time to change this thread title from:
Appalling quality of Ibanez
to just
Appalling Thread
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to the original poster: you get what you pay for when you buy instruments how are you could expect a $600 guitar or even a $1000 guitar to sound as great as a MIJ guitar that retails for $3500 is beyond me. Send the damn thing back to the merchant you bought it from
end of story.
And as for people talking smack about George Benson he is an incredible gentleman very very decent and accommodating man incredibly generous I know firsthand so if you haven’t met him shut the fuck up
I’m big Mike and I approve this message
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Really...terrible topic...the guy was upset about finishing issues, not the sound! And yes...even 500 dollar guitars come with good workmanship...more than 1000 have to be perfect and sound...never mind the comparison with the japanese version! there are many out there to prove it...I have a 699 gb10em better than this one! Did the guy overdo it? Yes... just send it back and be happy without having a hysterical attack! However this thread has become a bunch of people just wanting to be right at all costs...including insulting who is present...or not!
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I haven't read everything, but this has got to be the first time I read about such QC issues with an Ibanez at any price. Very surprising.
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Do not need to look far at the lower mid-price point. I would go so far to say that a majority have poor action due to careless ( too high ) neck break angle for starters. Issues such as this are structural faults that affect playability and should not occur at any price point. They are not cosmetic. Important to see Ibanez really as a company that commissions stock from a wide range of constantly changing asian factories rather than as guitar 'makers'. Think of Vivitar lenses in the 70s and 80s - same business model. 'Design by accountancy'. QA interventions/frequency are the key to all this. Ibanez site and marketing = first class! Originally Posted by m_d
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Well, I don't remember reading about any complaints of high action due to structural faults in the past. I'm no Ibanez expert but owned a Chinese Artcore for a time which had no issue with the build. I read many reviews at the time, and structural issues were never mentioned. To my mind they were kind of a Toyota of the guitar world, but the OP's pictures certainly tell another story. There isn't a really a "bad" Toyota from basic models to the Lexus range. In addition to strict QC on site, Ibanez used to have QC processes in destination markets. Far fetched idea, but could it have been a counterfeit? Could covid restrictions have disrupted some manufacturing or QC processes? Originally Posted by blackcat
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