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Yes, but it's fun. If you think this is bad, go on a photography/camera forum, or a home stereo/audio forum. Those guys are nuts.
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08-03-2022 07:31 AM
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No, I could go much worse…
My daughter has the wisest words for this question. « Dad, why do you say it’s your last guitar? It’s the last guitar you’ve bought for now, that’s all… »
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Any idea of the nut width on the axe George is playing here?
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I understand gear lust, I have succumbed to it with audio gear all my life, but only after I knew what to do with it - in other words, as part of a quest to fine tune, or incrementally improve my work in the professional audio engineering domain. But go to Gearspace and you'll see a million tome like threads where newbies and veterans alike engage in tiresome debates about things like which dithering plugin sounds the best when you know full well not one of them would pick any difference in a double blind test.
We pros do not waste time on these discussions, we figured out what dithering was back in the day, did some of our own tests, chose what worked for us, then went back to work. If a new fangled converter came on the market that could improve our work by 0.01%, we checked it out, decided if it was worth the expense or not, and moved on. Ditto for pre amps, mics, consoles, monitors, outboard, computers etc etc.
I have spent over a million $ in gear, but if I mixed a record using a laptop and some free plugins, I can make it sound 95% as good as my expensive kit. However, that 5% means everything when you're at the top of your game. The problem is, I see thousands of people on Gearspace fussing over gear way more than I ever did, and they have zero audio skills! I know this because they often post their "work". It's nearly always entry level.
OK, so I'm sorry if anyone is offended by this, but when I see long drawn out discussions about guitars, amps, pedals etc my default reaction is to assume that these people can't play. Is that unfair?
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In the 60’s our available data came from a paper catalog that you wrote to the manufacturer for. If you were lucky the local store might give a kid a copy. Not a lot of data to nit pick!
Now with the internet there’s far more data (correct or not!) out there to feed obsessive compulsive desires to make the “right” decision. I suppose it’s pretty much harmless, like splitting production years into months to identify differences between bridges or pots. But seems many nit pickers are more about weaponizing their data troves to slam someone on a forum with data they’ve collected using your overwhelming Google abilities.
As pointed out its not just here, it’s practically any forum I’ve ever looked into. Sports cars, classical music, and photography…. Unquestionably the meanest and self-aggrandizing bunch around!
So I am going to look into forums like knitting, or darning socks and see if they go ape over nits. ‘Well I use needle number four only…..’
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Yes. The current obsession with neck profiles is an Internet phenomenon, I am sure. Before social media, enthusiasts did not have the information to be picky about, or fellow obsessives to tell.
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I would add fretboard radii to that. Before there were only a few choices: 7.25, 12-ish, and maybe a bit flatter for acoustics. Now people are all about flat boards and conical boards mostly due to the hype IMHO. I still like the original choices better.
Originally Posted by Litterick
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People have been talking about fretboard radius for a long time. Fender has offered 9.5" radius on many models since the mid 80s, and flat fretboards were a selling point since the dawn of the superstrat. I remember people talking about Martin fretboards being flatter than Gibson acoustics since way, way back as well. People probably talk about it more since the internet came along, but they talk about everything else more since then, too. Discussion boards where people go on and on about minutiae is the reason the internet was invented in the first place (I might have made that last bit up ...). Originally Posted by lammie200
Last edited by John A.; 08-03-2022 at 04:38 PM.
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Good luck getting piano manufacturers to make different sized pianos. The same sized piano has existed for 2 centuries. Perhaps it’s time for those lowly souls to study clarinet, or violin? Originally Posted by stylo
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Audio, for sure! But it’s all in fun that the internet buzzes with noise. Originally Posted by Woody Sound
Yes, but it's fun. If you think this is bad, go on a photography/camera forum, or a home stereo/audio forum. Those guys are nuts.
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I’ll say this once. As a piano player who came here to learn guitar, I’ve never met a guitar I didn’t like. And I’ve owned more than most here.
For 18’s, 17’s, 16’s, Nylons, I enjoyed and played each equally, without a single thought to size. It’s simple, see guitar, play guitar. Perhaps this is more about “guitarist’s” obsessing over their instruments?
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2Bop said: “Perhaps this is more about “guitarist’s” obsessing over their instruments?”
Or, perhaps human nature? I can’t help but wonder if it’s a “mine is bigger than yours” kind of thing. Lots of cases here and on other forums seem to bear that out. One comment or question gets piled on with facts and figures WITHOUT addressing the OP’s question. Sort of a ‘look how smart I am’ thing.
interesting, it’s a lot like junior high, isn’t it?
In the words of that great humanitarian, St Francis Sinatra of Hoboken:
”Some people get their kicks stepping on others dreams, but that’s life”
(Yes, Frank funded the entire rebuild of the Atlantic City hospital.)
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Yes.
GAS is a bad thing. I know some guys who are constantly buying and selling guitars, amps and especially pedals. Totally crazy.
I don't know what's being compensated with it, but it's not healthy.
Honestly, no one really needs more than, let’s say 4-6 guitars. Why more? Buy a good guitar and get happy. Better one real fantastic one rather than three good ones. Play her and watch her get better and better over time. How it helps you to get better with this guitar.
Less but better gear, more playing, more success, more piece of mind.
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Not sure, but a lot of those shredder guitars are 42mm. I kind of want to try one because I have a feeling I would get along with wider nut width than my current guitar, but a slim D style neck. Originally Posted by Peter C
I agree with the earlier comment that said, gear chasing for "tone" is overrated, but ergonomics is very underrated. I almost don't care how it sounds at this early point in my playing life, I want it to feel good in the hands.
It's a shame those St. Vincent guitars are so expensive, I love the body design of them.
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@stylo: thanks for taking the trouble to reply; I was actually kidding (should have made that clearer, perhaps)
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All guitarists are very similar to each other ... they talk too much about gear and not practise enough.
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I find myself on forums such as this to get advice that I think I might need or to read about things that I think i might need to know. It is great to build information from players across the world with varied experience but it is up to me what to do with this and with all Internet related things it is probably too much information...
Mostly I dial in because I am in a situation where I cannot play - i.e. at work or should I say avoiding work/taking a break and the fine details of everything seem more important and interesting than work! Problem arises when I do have a chance to play and instead i choose to "check" something online or worse look at gear I don't have rather than play the gear i do have...
if my ability to play it ever matches my ability to google I hope i'll be happy...
I need to get back to work...
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Fixed it for you. Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
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I play in a 15 horn big band with a lot of older guys. Probably a combined 700 years of horn experience and not one of these codgers has ever had a mouthpiece he liked. They talk about it more often than their urinary issues.
As far as guitar goes, I find that the very same rig sounds good on some days and not others. Obviously, I need new gear on the bad days.
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Yes...
and sometimes, I waste my time twisting knobs... if I want to waste even more time synthesizer programming is better, and ultimately the best waste of time is dealing with midi issues... I feel like I really doing something.
I have my collection. It takes me about 30 minutes to get use to the change, when I swap out guitars. Then it takes about a week for the guitar to become mostly invisible. (Some guitars do fight me more, and there are good things and bad things about that).
When it comes to amps, and pedals. I basically end up setting then to do very similar sounding things. However some pedals work better with certain amps. Basically they all fall into certain groups. So if I never changed out amps, then I would just need one set of pedals.
I have meet people who buy gear, but can not play. For a long time, I had one guitar I played (Am Tele), one amp (Blues Deluxe), and one pedal (an oldish Morley Wha). I was really into getting everything I could out of my limited gear. There were problem: the amp had too much headroom for many gigs. That was before attenuators showed up... or if it was around I could not afford one anyway... because, I was working as little as possible to practice as much as I could.
I used to go see Steve Kimock with Zero a lot. One time I noticed a cool sounding effect. I was told it was a envelope filter. Then I had two pedals for years.
The truth is, less is so often more. (Not when it comes to health care or other basic needs). There is an artistic principle there.
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The one guitar that becomes the most invisible for me is my 1998 Gibson Howard Roberts Fusion III. Whatever they did designing that guitar, it is perfect, the small body, short scale, and wide string spacing despite the 1 11/16" nut. Originally Posted by st.bede
Tony
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A comment on a rock guitar forum about a member's photo of his guitar:
'That is a beast of a plectrum you have wedged under the strings. It must be about 2.5mm thick !!'Last edited by Litterick; 08-04-2022 at 07:35 PM.
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Picks, I don't mind talking or reading about - it's the guitarists equivalent to the horn player's mouthpiece. I don't see it as "gear", but as an extension of the human body, so the "Player", not the gear. Tone production pretty much starts with the pick. Ever notice how the same guitar, pedals and amp given to different players to try (who bring their own pick) sound totally different? Not talking about style, talking about Tone. Originally Posted by Litterick
I recall a session where I was playing a Les Paul with high action and heavy strings through a Princeton using a 2mm pick with a roughened edge. There was another guitarist in the room who was liking the sound so much that he wanted to try playing my guitar. He made it sound like it was a different guitar and amp! It's because I pick so much harder, i set the amp sound to match my dynamic, clean when soft, edgier when harder. This other guy (well, most other guitarists really) had a much softer touch with his thin pick, so he sounded clean and un articulated because my set up didn't suit him at all. But it wasn't just the guitar and amp setting, it was the pick. When I tried to explain that, I asked to use his pick to show how the tone is different, even with my harder attack. I sounded different too, I couldn't dig in with the thinner pick, and it made my dynamics sound totally off.
So I say the pick is an extension of your fingers (much like a fingernail). If CG guys talk about fingernails, that's not talking about "gear". Also, those guys only start talking about fingernails once they can play well. Same goes for horn players and their mouthpieces, I reckon...
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To the thread starter: Yes we do! I am sick and tired of mythology and buying by spec sheet. I have worked for many years in music retail and I am especially irked by electric guitar players. One of my regulars came in with a great Fender he'd gotten used, and he was ecstatic. I tried it and said "Whoa, didn't think you'd ever go for a vintage radius style!" and he said "what do you mean, this is standard" and I said "no it's not" (and measured it) - he put it up for sale again the next day. That's some asinine bullshit if you can excuse my language.
Meanwhile, acoustic players are the exact opposite. First, I probe and find out what I -think- might suit them, and give them a couple of recommendations. I then see how they react to those guitars. They just play them and go "this is nice" or "not this". I don't think I've ever sold an acoustic guitar over $2000 to someone who's had a single question about spec (beyond wood types) - we've just talked about sound and feel. It's delightful, and it makes the intagible seem almost material. Every single >$4500 acoustic I've sold has been sold to someone who only played the guitar and who had philosophical questions, which are great fun!
Electric players will ask me a thousand questions about every single little thing, and THEN pick it up and say whether they like it or not. What was the point of the questions? Additionally, when you love a guitar, you just love it. It's simple. People tell me (without having tried it) that my ES is neck heavy and suffers from tuning instability, even that it's got muddy pickups (without having heard it). Huh? Maybe? How would I know, I just play the damn thing.
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The owner of the plectrum explained that his daughters bought it for him, from Timber Tones, unaware of the subtleties: "I didn't have the heart to say that it was going to be like playing guitar with a trowel, so I've just gone with it."
Originally Posted by princeplanet
I buy as many different plectrums as I can find. Yesterday, I returned from a local music store disappointed that the amp I wanted had been sold, but consoled with five new plectrums. I tried one that is new to me, a Gibson XH, immediately. It made my elegant Gibson L6-S – which I had carefully adjusted to produce a tone reminiscent of English church bells – sound like swamp rock.
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