Hollowbody $1000 and Under - Thin Necks Need Not Apply

[EllenGtrGrl]

I got mega GAS for a decent parlor guitar (bye-by Eastman archtop, and hello Eastman parlor guitar - due to ye olde Covid, supply issues, the guitar isn't expected to arrive until just about doomsday). I also had to take care of some unexpected bills, which put getting another archtop on hold - it's not the end of the world, my Tele works great for jazz, and my Yamaha LS6M ARE does a decent job for acoustic flavored jazz. Still, I miss having an archtop, and financially, things have settled down. Sooooooo, once again, I'd like to get another archtop, but being budget conscious, I'd like to keep the cost under $1000. Oh, and here's the kicker - no thin necks please (I find them uncomfortable playing-wise) A baseball bat neck would be nice, but knowing how rare those are nowadays, I'm also willing to settle for a Medium C neck. Does anybody have suggestions about what to consider?

[John A.]

I got mega GAS for a decent parlor guitar (bye-by Eastman archtop, and hello Eastman parlor guitar - due to ye olde Covid, supply issues, the guitar isn't expected to arrive until just about doomsday). I also had to take care of some unexpected bills, which put getting another archtop on hold - it's not the end of the world, my Tele works great for jazz, and my Yamaha LS6M ARE does a decent job for acoustic flavored jazz. Still, I miss having an archtop, and financially, things have settled down. Sooooooo, once again, I'd like to get another archtop, but being budget conscious, I'd like to keep the cost under $1000. Oh, and here's the kicker - no thin necks please (I find them uncomfortable playing-wise) A baseball bat neck would be nice, but knowing how rare those are nowadays, I'm also willing to settle for a Medium C neck. Does anybody have suggestions about what to consider?

Godin 5th Ave Kingpin P90, Kingpin II, or HB. Necks on these are pretty chunky, and they all can be found for under a grand.

[AllanAllen]

$1,000 acoustic archtop, I think your only new option is Loar. No idea what the neck is like, or anything else for that matter. I just know that exist and they're under a grand.

https://www.theloar.com/instruments/archtops/acoustic

[JN Thomas]

Hi Ellen

I assume your Eastman was an electric hollow body? I was fortunate enough to come across a Peerless Monarch a couple of years ago and I can vouch for its superb build and finish. It cost me £500 (UK), so well within your budget. Its acoustic voice is good enough for home practice but needs amplification to be heard properly anywhere else. I love mine, especially since I removed the pick-guard with its rather obtrusive volume knob and wired the p/u to a Shatten-type double thumbwheel control which sits underneath the edge of the lower f-hole and gives me both volume and tone control. The neck I would describe as a medium D shape; it is very comfortable, the best neck I have ever played, bar none. The Peerless brand is very under-rated in my humble opinion and well worth a look, if you can find one. The Peerless Gigmaster is another cracker. Listen to Jonathan Cordy play My Favourite Things on youtube with his. Hope this helps.
JN Thomas.

[Cunamara]

The couple of Epiphone Joe Pass guitars I have tried had substantial necks (my reference "fantastic" neck is an Ibanez GB10, I found the EJP to be approaching baseball bat by comparison).

[whiskey02]

Eastman has about the best medium to medium large necks you're going to get outside of custom or at least $$$$ custom shop. Have you actually played the Martin necks? Their MLO neck is terrible for anyone who likes a real "medium C" shape; it's as bad as Taylor, closer to a V neck, no shoulder left on it just not as sharply carved. Yamaha and Alvarez can have a decent neck carve but can vary from model to model. If you have not played a Martin low oval, please check one out before buying online. I went to GC to see how I liked them and sadly realized I would never own one. Good luck.

[rabbit]

I've got a Godin 5th Avenue (no pickup) and John A. is correct, I think.

The Godin's neck rests right at the very beginning of the "clubby" spectrum.

Happy hunting!

[richpiv]

How about this one? First class player and first class person - Price Drop - $650 2003 Epi Emperor Regent - Excellent condition

[EllenGtrGrl]

Eastman has about the best medium to medium large necks you're going to get outside of custom or at least $$$$ custom shop. Have you actually played the Martin necks? Their MLO neck is terrible for anyone who likes a real "medium C" shape; it's as bad as Taylor, closer to a V neck, no shoulder left on it just not as sharply carved. Yamaha and Alvarez can have a decent neck carve but can vary from model to model. If you have not played a Martin low oval, please check one out before buying online. I went to GC to see how I liked them and sadly realized I would never own one. Good luck.

I can't stand Martin's MLO neck profile, due to it being so thin. It's the reason why my DSS-17 went bye-bye only 2 1/2 months after I bought it. As for Taylor - I wanted to like them (I got the erroneous assumption from information I found online, that they had a decently thick c-shaped neck), but 2 plus years of a sore fretting hand after an hour of playing my 150e 12-string for the church band, and a sore fretting hand after only a half hour of playing my AD-27, swore me off of all Taylors.

I love Eastmans. They have great necks (hence the reason why my favorite acoustic guitars in the past year or so, have been Eastmans, and I have an Eastman E20P on order), and unlike those pieces of Eastman firewood I played back in 2007, they really have upped their quality game - it's just that I can't afford one at the present time. Ditto for Peerless guitars, which are also very nice guitars.

I've thought about the Godin 5th Avenue Kingpins, but I can't decide if I like the P90, or the humbucker models more.

Some of the Epiphones mentioned are cool, but I've kind of learned from first hand experience (from a Sheraton I used to have, that I thought I could live with its neck - no), that it's hard to determine Epiphones neck-wise, unless you try them out. A lot of them have the Slim Taper neck, though every now and then (like the Epiphone Inspired by Gibson J-45 I have), you try one out, and find out to your surprise that they it has a relatively chunky neck.

Thanks for the input everybody.

[EllenGtrGrl]

I'm leaning more and more towards a Godin 5th Avanue Kingpin II, due to its neck, and the fact that I can get a great deal on one, but I can't make up my mind about whether I'd get the P90 version, or the humbucker version. I like humbuckers and P90s equally. What do all of you think is better for the guitar?

[Gabor]

The couple of Epiphone Joe Pass guitars I have tried had substantial necks (my reference "fantastic" neck is an Ibanez GB10, I found the EJP to be approaching baseball bat by comparison).

you should try my 75 years old Levin. Epi Joe Pass has *slim* neck compared to it

Btw I never understood the neck shape mania. It is true that there is a wide spectrum of neck shapes. I also agree that nut width and scale length do matter, because both determines the fretboats dimensions and nut width also jas effect on the picking hand. (I do not count nut width and scale length as neck shape, which is a third attribute in its own right)

However talking about minor differences of neck *shape*... there are dozens much more important attributes of an instrument.. be a man and get used to it if the neck is not exactly the shape what you would imagine to be ideal.

[Gabor]

If you mean hollowbody as not strictly archtop, but center block hollowbody also counts, then Epi Dot 335 have really slim neck

[EllenGtrGrl]

you should try my 75 years old Levin. Epi Joe Pass has *slim* neck compared to it

Btw I never understood the neck shape mania. It is true that there is a wide spectrum of neck shapes. I also agree that nut width and scale length do matter, because both determines the fretboats dimensions and nut width also jas effect on the picking hand. (I do not count nut width and scale length as neck shape, which is a third attribute in its own right)

However talking about minor differences of neck *shape*... there are dozens much more important attributes of an instrument.. be a man and get used to it if the neck is not exactly the shape what you would imagine to be ideal.

Hi Gabor, for me, neck thickness and shape are more about playing comfort. I play classical style - thumb behind the neck. My thumb never sticks much above the neck, and I never hang, or wrap it over the neck. It is the way I was taught by my uncle (Guitar Player Generation #2 in my family), who at the insistence of my grandfather (Guitar Player Generation #1 - he was also a luthier), received some classical guitar training. Therefore, necks that are too thin for me feel uncomforatable - it's as though my thunb, and fretting fingers are acting like a C-clamp on the neck. My playing is less fluid, and I end up with a sore fretting hand (typically within an hour of when I start playing).

I put up with thin necks and playing discomfort for about the first 30 years of my guitar playing. Part of it was due to the belief in the misconception that a thin neck was a "faster, and easier playing" neck (and as a lead guitarist, wouldn't you want a faster, and easier playing neck?). About 2009 or 2010, out of curiosity, I tried out some guitars that had chunkier necks, and realized that while I would put up with thin necked guitars, the chunkier necked guitars were much more comfortable for me to play. Oh yeah, and I played just as fast if not faster, on thicker necked guitars, due to the increased playing comfort. I wasn't always fighting the guitar. As a result, I drifted away from thin necked guitars, to thicker necked guitars (a Medium C or thicker), to the point that by 2017 I decided that I would not play thin necked guitars if I could help it. Unfortunately, that has not always been the case, due to a lack of neck dimension data by guitar makers, which resulted in the rather expensive (for me) failures of a PRS 7-string, a Martin DSS-17, and 2, Taylor acoustics (I was under the mistaken impression that Taylors were at the low end of acceptable neck thickness for me - wrong!).

So, thicker necks it is. I'd also like a 17 inch hollow body, but guitars with 17 inch hollow bodies, and thicker necks, seem to be even rarer, than guitars with 16 inch hollow bodies and thicker necks. Oh well.

[Spook410]

Yunzhi and Wu guitars have thicker necks. Korean D'Angelico's (IMHO not in the same class as Yunzhi and certainly not a Wu) have a medium not-skinny neck.

[rpjazzguitar]

I may be at the opposite end of the spectrum from some players.

The very first thing I check out on a guitar is how the neck feels. At GC, I don't even take them off the wall, just put my hand on the neck.

Because of arthritis, I prefer a very slim neck. In fact, my favorite is the Yamaha Pacifica 012. It's small in every dimension except scale length and feels great to me.

Obviously, I'm not the person to recommend a guitar to the OP.

[EllenGtrGrl]

I may be at the opposite end of the spectrum from some players.

The very first thing I check out on a guitar is how the neck feels. At GC, I don't even take them off the wall, just put my hand on the neck.

Because of arthritis, I prefer a very slim neck. In fact, my favorite is the Yamaha Pacifica 012. It's small in every dimension except scale length and feels great to me.

Obviously, I'm not the person to recommend a guitar to the OP.

Maybe not, but I've learned the hard way, that if possible I should check out the neck or try a guitar first if possible (though, it's hard to find much in the way of hollow body guitars variety-wise at local guitar stores [the only one locally who carries them in any quantity, carries mainly Gretsch, which are too thin neck-wise for my preference, or the occasional Ibanez]). Even then, I will often just CAREFULLY place my hand around the neck (putting the hang tag between the strings and my fingers (I have a severe allergy to nickel, which of course includes nickel strings), to get a quick idea about how the neck feels. If it seems OK, I'll take the guitar for a spin (wearing nitrile gloves, to avoid having issues with the nickel strings), to really determine if I can live with the neck.

[jazzkritter]

You might change that thumb technique. in fact you should IHMO. Watch some videos of world class classical players, you will see most if not all freely moving their thumbs to different positions behind the neck. (Very doubtful you will see thumb over.) I was taught at Peabody you play the guitar, not you played by the guitar. Do what should be done to minimize pain, maximize playability.
My teacher was a PhD in music, a PhD in musicians injuries. Oh also she’s a research MD. I do wish she would write a book a brilliant and humble and very good guitarist.
Our hands simply should not be locked especially the thumbs as yes damage will occur. We are not built for unnatural rigidity.
Give it a try and I wish you luck… makes picking out a guitar a bunch easier

[lammie200]

I have tried a couple Korean builds (Guild and Peerless,) a Chinese build (Hagstrom,) and a Canadian build (Godin) as budget archtops. Guild was by far the best. Proper neck construction (three piece and mahogany, not scarf jointed maple) and properly hollow (not with a sound post under the bridge.) Nice medium depth neck profile and 9.5” fretboard radius. Guild might be worth considering.

[jads57]

Hard enough to find big necks on guitars over a $1k. Occasionally a used Eastman 810CE or 805CE but not any of the other models.
Loars have a large V shape on some of their L-5 early copies.

[EllenGtrGrl]

You might change that thumb technique. in fact you should IHMO. Watch some videos of world class classical players, you will see most if not all freely moving their thumbs to different positions behind the neck. (Very doubtful you will see thumb over.) I was taught at Peabody you play the guitar, not you played by the guitar. Do what should be done to minimize pain, maximize playability.
My teacher was a PhD in music, a PhD in musicians injuries. Oh also she’s a research MD. I do wish she would write a book a brilliant and humble and very good guitarist.
Our hands simply should not be locked especially the thumbs as yes damage will occur. We are not built for unnatural rigidity.
Give it a try and I wish you luck… makes picking out a guitar a bunch easier

I kind of disagree, but whatever works for you. IMO, because I keep my thumb behind the neck, I'm not "fisting" the neck like so many players do, who don't keep their thumbs behind the neck. As a result, I get greater hand span for fingering notes, and I'm not always having to slide up and down the neck 2 or 3 frets to play some fingerings (Losing playing speed in the process). Also, I don't have to rotate my hand (like many if not most players, who don't play with their thumb behind the neck do), in order to change how it sits position-wise for playing different voicings at the top or bottom of the fretboard (width-wise), which also slows down thing playing-wise.

In most ways, it has nothing to do with the guitar playing me. For decades, I believed that I would just "get used to the guitars," and I put up with their necks. I got sick of that. Hence the reason why I have gotten pickier about guitar necks. As a result, the necks have become more comfortable for me.

It's not really something worth arguing about. Many, if not most guitar players I've played with in bands, don't play classical (thumb behind the neck) style. I don't hassle them about it. If that's the way they want to play, that's fine.

[EllenGtrGrl]

I have tried a couple Korean builds (Guild and Peerless,) a Chinese build (Hagstrom,) and a Canadian build (Godin) as budget archtops. Guild was by far the best. Proper neck construction (three piece and mahogany, not scarf jointed maple) and properly hollow (not with a sound post under the bridge.) Nice medium depth neck profile and 9.5” fretboard radius. Guild might be worth considering.

It would have to be an older Guild. The newer ones have pretty thin necks. I wish I had the money for the 22 year old Guild X-700 a local shop has, but at $3800, that's not happening anytime soon (even if I traded all of my gear towards it to help cover the cost).

[lammie200]

It would have to be an older Guild. The newer ones have pretty thin necks. I wish I had the money for the 22 year old Guild X-700 a local shop has, but at $3800, that's not happening anytime soon (even if I traded all of my gear towards it to help cover the cost).

They aren’t chunky that’s for sure. However, they are fairly flat and the tighter radius make them more comfortable than others for me. And I like necks that taper to about an inch at the 12th fret. You certainly won’t get that with a newer Guild but the other factors might help.

[ronjazz]

You might want to look into the Gretsch Streamliner series. Give yourself a chance at something different, well-made and not overpriced.

[sgosnell]

Wu can make you a 17" archtop with a thick neck, but not for under $1000. His prices start at $1500, and you'll have to wait awhile. There may be used examples available occasionally, either on Reverb or ebay, but since he builds to order, the neck could be almost any shape or thickness. I'm not sure used is a great way for you to go. Lora at YolandaTeam also works with Yunzhi, and they may be somewhat cheaper, but I've never checked.

[wintermoon]

"be a man and get used to it if the neck is not exactly the shape what you would imagine to be ideal."

I may be wrong but judging from EllenGtrGrl's user name and avatar I'm guessing that she's a she, so show some respect please.