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  1. #1

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    As the investment bankers say "past performance is no guarantee of future performance".

    Buy guitars because they are tools to make music with. Buy wisely and your investment will be better than if you buy poorly, and if your guitar both is a gem to play and appreciates in value, be thankful!

    If you are looking to make money with something to buy, hold and sell, IMO, there are better things to buy than guitars.

    I'd suggest real estate myself.....

  4. #3

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    I dunno, I can't quite accept a CBS-era Tele being thought of as a high-value vintage investment piece (let alone one with a crooked Bigsby). That just seems to fall into "the world is going to hell in a hand basket" territory to me. And I don't even have a lawn.

  5. #4

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    The suit appears to be playing a headless Les Paul. Surely that must be worth something.

    News just in
    : global temperatures are accelerating toward 1.5 degrees Celsius of warming. We must keep the average annual global temperature from lingering at or above 1.5 degrees Celsius to avoid the most catastrophic and long-term effects of climate change: massive flooding, severe drought and runaway ocean warming that fuels tropical storms and drives mass die-offs of marine species.

    To return to the question, are guitars worth investing in? With a a 90% chance that one of the next five years will be the warmest on record, the answer has to be no. We are facing global catastrophe, so investments will soon be worthless, and the least of our worries.
    Last edited by Litterick; 05-31-2021 at 05:25 AM.

  6. #5

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    Better than diamonds...

    Early in my marriage, my wife (now ex) gave me the "Diamonds are a good investment" spiel after she tried to tell me guitars are not. I told her I've made money on them when money was tight and asked her how dead she would have to be before we could sell her diamond trinkets to pay past due bills.

    I never got that argument again :-)

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    The suit appears to be playing a headless Les Paul. Surely that must be worth something.

    News just in
    : global temperatures are accelerating toward 1.5 degrees Celsius of warming. We must keep the average annual global temperature from lingering at or above 1.5 degrees Celsius to avoid the most catastrophic and long-term effects of climate change: massive flooding, severe drought and runaway ocean warming that fuels tropical storms and drives mass die-offs of marine species.
    one word:


    paddles

  8. #7

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    You can paddle to the gig with a '53 Telecaster, wipe it off, and play the gig.

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Litterick
    The suit appears to be playing a headless Les Paul. Surely that must be worth something.

    News just in
    : global temperatures are accelerating toward 1.5 degrees Celsius of warming. We must keep the average annual global temperature from lingering at or above 1.5 degrees Celsius to avoid the most catastrophic and long-term effects of climate change: massive flooding, severe drought and runaway ocean warming that fuels tropical storms and drives mass die-offs of marine species.

    To return to the question, are guitars worth investing in? With a a 90% chance that one of the next five years will be the warmest on record, the answer has to be no. We are facing global catastrophe, so investments will soon be worthless, and the least of our worries.
    My experience is that when this kind of pessimism becomes widespread, opportunities to make great investments arise.

    The sky is not falling Chicken Little and humans are very adaptable.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by John A.
    I dunno, I can't quite accept a CBS-era Tele being thought of as a high-value vintage investment piece (let alone one with a crooked Bigsby). That just seems to fall into "the world is going to hell in a hand basket" territory to me. And I don't even have a lawn.
    The CBS Strats and Teles made up to 1975 are not much different than the Pre CBS Strats and Teles. It is the late 70's CBS guitars that made the pre CBS units so desirable by comparison. A rising tide lifts all ships, as they say.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stringswinger
    The CBS Strats and Teles made up to 1975 are not much different than the Pre CBS Strats and Teles. It is the late 70's CBS guitars that made the pre CBS units so desirable by comparison. A rising tide lifts all ships, as they say.
    No, they did not stay the same up to 75. Changes started in design and materials started in 67, and quality control started dropping very early in CBS ownership.

  12. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by John A.
    No, they did not stay the same up to 75. Changes started in design and materials started in 67, and quality control started dropping very early in CBS ownership.
    Did I say that they stayed the same? Certainly there were cosmetic differences (bigger headstocks) and some materials differences. I have played may pre-CBS Fenders and many post CBS Fenders in my time. Some of the post CBS Fenders were, IMO, better guitars than some of the pre-CBS Fenders. I have not played any post 75 Strats or Teles that I have really liked, but perhaps there are some of those out there that might change my mind.

    I judge each guitar on it's individual merits. I currently have an $800 Martin Dreadnaught that sounds (and plays) better than most $4,000 Martin Dreads that I have played.

    Slamming all Fenders made in the CBS era or all Gibsons made in the Norlin era is, IMO, without justification. But in general, I would agree with the usual assertions that quality controls was not the best during those years and that some of the changes made during those years was not for the best.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stringswinger
    Did I say that they stayed the same? Certainly there were cosmetic differences (bigger headstocks) and some materials differences. I have played may pre-CBS Fenders and many post CBS Fenders in my time. Some of the post CBS Fenders were, IMO, better guitars than some of the pre-CBS Fenders. I have not played any post 75 Strats or Teles that I have really liked, but perhaps there are some of those out there that might change my mind.

    I judge each guitar on it's individual merits. I currently have an $800 Martin Dreadnaught that sounds (and plays) better than most $4,000 Martin Dreads that I have played.

    Slamming all Fenders made in the CBS era or all Gibsons made in the Norlin era is, IMO, without justification. But in general, I would agree with the usual assertions that quality controls was not the best during those years and that some of the changes made during those years was not for the best.
    "Not much different" "stayed the same" tomato tomahto. It's not just the headstock. Much more significant changes happened long before 75 (e.g., 3 bolt necks, very bright pickups, issues with neck pockets). There's no single point in time or event that marks the transition from good to bad, but the transition was complete by 72-ish, not 75, and people were grumbling before then. A friend of mine once gave me a 72 Strat. It was so bad I gave it back.

    In any event, the point is that for people of a certain vintage veneration of CBS-era stuff as vintage sparks a certain amount of incredulity. Nothing wrong with saying "this one is really good". But saying "this one is really good because it's vintage," not so much. I find Norlin bashing to be less valid than CBS bashing, based on my experience with actual instrument s.

  14. #13

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    Guitars are a horrible investment. I bought my first D'angelico Excel in 1980 from George Gurhn and paid $2000 it was a a blond 1953. Had I put the $2000 in almost any ordinary stock and just left it there I wonder what it would be worth today. I am not a stock marker player ( guitars much more fun) but maybe someone here can calculate what the value of my investment would be had I bought Ford Motors, General Electric, or some ordinary company like Walgreens or Coca Cola. My guess is I would have way more money than what a D'angelico Excel today is worth approx $16-22K.

    I bet some financial wizard could figure this in a hurry or even guesstimate I would be much better off.

  15. #14

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    I just checked that if I had bought Colgate-Palmolive in about 1980 and put my $2000 in the company it would be worth today about $140,000.

    Now that would buy myself a fair number of great guitars starting with D'angelico New Yorker, Super 400, L5, D'aquisto even. If I was going for numbers I could have most all the Gibson Carved tops. I tell you don't invest in guitars unless you have money to burn.

  16. #15

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    It's not a bad time to buy a guitar that is likely to hold it's value. On the other hand, guitars are not typical investment vehicles. You have to be set up to take good care of them and there's always the risk of theft, fire, and flood. You can insure them but that's part of the cost and not sure how that plays out with typical insurance riders. Of course it's nice any gains you might realize aren't taxed for capital gains (looking at you Biden) though there will be sales tax in most states. Also, have you seen what Reverb and Ebay charge? As we see investment move away from business into things like real estate don't think a lot of investors will be thinking about guitars.

    Overall, IMHO, real estate is the way to go right now if you're up for the research and work that goes with it. Guitars are a hobby and while you might be able to enjoy it for less cost by flipping guitars, I've never enjoyed that aspect of it.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stringswinger
    My experience is that when this kind of pessimism becomes widespread, opportunities to make great investments arise.

    The sky is not falling Chicken Little and humans are very adaptable.
    Like last March, when Covid hit. Great time to invest.

    Guitars- you never know, so buy what you want to play. The increase in ability should be payment enough. But if you're lucky....

    ....you would have bought a '63 strat, '60 ES345, '60 Bassman, '54 Telecaster etc pre-1990.

    I wasn't smart, I bought what I needed for tones. Then I got lucky. Not expecting that kind of luck again.

    Still, it's not close to buying Microsoft stock at the same time.

  18. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stringswinger
    The CBS Strats and Teles made up to 1975 are not much different than the Pre CBS Strats and Teles. It is the late 70's CBS guitars that made the pre CBS units so desirable by comparison. A rising tide lifts all ships, as they say.
    Sorry, I completely disagree. There were many changes starting around '66, the pickups alone became shrill and nasty. Just one example, I had a '66 or '67 transition period Custom telecaster. Really nice guitar, great shape, I liked it a lot. Then I came across a very cosmetically similar '61 Custom telecaster. No comparison, the pickups were like night and day. The '61 was warm and fat, no shrill sounds to be had. Up until that moment I thought the '67 was pretty good.

    And that was a desirable transition era Fender, not into the '70's. I know, there are great '70's Fenders. But in general, '70's Fenders are why the vintage Fender market happened. IMHO.

    I did have a great '68 LP Custom and have played great later Gibsons. And I agree for sure, great guitars are being made right now. I have played some great current Fenders.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by deacon Mark
    Guitars are a horrible investment. I bought my first D'angelico Excel in 1980 from George Gurhn and paid $2000 it was a a blond 1953. Had I put the $2000 in almost any ordinary stock and just left it there I wonder what it would be worth today. I am not a stock marker player ( guitars much more fun) but maybe someone here can calculate what the value of my investment would be had I bought Ford Motors, General Electric, or some ordinary company like Walgreens or Coca Cola. My guess is I would have way more money than what a D'angelico Excel today is worth approx $16-22K.

    I bet some financial wizard could figure this in a hurry or even guesstimate I would be much better off.
    Around that time, my brother in law, who lived in Seattle, decided to put his wife's IRA Into a little known local company he'd heard about, Microsoft. 'Nuff said.

    He had a similar experience with Starbuck's. Seattle was a great place to hear about companies then, But I think he missed Amazon!

  20. #19

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    The problem is, most of us are old grey bastards. Our investments should be geared towards succession.

    My best friend died with about 500 guitars in his collection. His executor got clobbered trying to move them without losses. Stocks, real estate, it'd been no big deal.

    Buy tulips, I say!

  21. #20

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    Deacon Mark, If you had bought $2000.00 of Coca Cola stock in 1980 and reinvested your dividends you would have $ 266,986.03 today.

  22. #21

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    Depends on the guitar, just like other investments. I made a multi-k KILLING on an original 1986 PRS I purchased from Paul back then. On most others it has been a wash. But I don't mind, never considered them as investments . I'm just glad to get most of my original $ back after using them for so many years. They are artistic tools, and I appreciate being able to use them and not have them devalue. I am not concerned about making a profit. It's not about that for me.

    Of course, in the early 80's I stumbled upon a blond pre-war L5 for $100. Made a killing on that one too.

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stringswinger
    As the investment bankers say "past performance is no guarantee of future performance".

    Buy guitars because they are tools to make music with. Buy wisely and your investment will be better than if you buy poorly, and if your guitar both is a gem to play and appreciates in value, be thankful!

    If you are looking to make money with something to buy, hold and sell, IMO, there are better things to buy than guitars.

    I'd suggest real estate myself.....

    Perfect response Stringswinger.

  24. #23

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    I agree that guitars are not the way to go if you are looking to invest and build wealth. On the other hand, I don't have as much fun with my stock portfolio as I do with my guitars. My feeling is - invest carefully and regularly in the financial market from an early age, so you will be able to enjoy a comfortable retirement. Having said that, you should be able to treat yourself to a few guitars along the way instead of buying other material things that depreciate much more quickly. Also, I don't believe in buying guitars with issues that will make them hard to sell if you change your mind later. Spend a little extra and buy a guitar that will at least hold value, because we often flip and trade them over time.
    Keith
    Last edited by floatingpickup; 06-01-2021 at 06:05 PM.

  25. #24

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    $2100 invested in 100 shares of MSFT on 13 March 1986 would be worth about $4.8m today, not including dividends along the way.

    $2150 invested in 1000 shares of Nio ADR in February 2020 would be worth about $40 000 today.

    $3000 invested in Tesla in February 2020 would be worth about $33 000 today.

    Apple? Amazon? AMD? NVDA? You do the research.

    I spent $35K on guitars in 2020 that would have given me $700 000 today if I had put them in the stock market...Enough to buy me the same guitars twenty times over!

    I do enjoy stroking my guitars but rue the opportunity cost of owning them. Cheaper to borrow from the bank and pay monthly instalments and put the capital in the stock market.

  26. #25

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    I buy guitars I want and play them for all they're worth. They have brought me more pleasure, more joy, than any amount of money. Full stop.