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  1. #1

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    Hello to everyone on the forum,

    I will pose this question here, even though I have this feeling that it has been answered about a million times already.
    I am studying classical guitar and through the works of Takemitsu and Dyens I have found myself to be more and more interested in jazz. I also started out by playing the piano when I was 10 but always stayed within the classical music frame, except for Nikolai Kapustin and Gershwin works which follow the vocabulary of jazz but it's sheet music and not improvisation based.

    As a teen I started playing rock and was a massive fan of the Red Hot Chilli Peppers, so when we formed a band to play similar type of rock/funk style I bought myself a ESP Ron Wood telecaster and I even have recorded an album with it. This guitar is really good for that type of music, but I was wondering whether I could use it to try and learn jazz on the guitar, in the style of Joe Pass let's say (finger rather than with a pick).

    It's always fun to buy more new gear and I am currently obsessing about buying an Epiphone Joe Pass II Emperor hollow-body for my jazz initiation. Do you think it's a wise choice for a beginner or should I stick to my telecaster and try my best with what I already have?

    What can I do to get a nice fat jazz sound out of my tele? Should I use flatwound strings (12) and stick to the neck humbucker? What type of amp should I go for? Is a Blackstar ID V2 good enough for home practice?

    Any advice highly appreciated

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    ...and absolutely: yes!

  4. #3
    Stick to your tele (if you like it) until you can afford the epiphone. After that, play both!
    There was recently a string gauge discussion here, and I for one am convinced that you can get a perfect jazz sound with 10s. It's more about feel than tone imo.
    The most common is to use the neck pickup with tone rolled off, but you can achieve alot just by altering your pick attack, using your fingers etc. Experiment! Who knows, maybe you'll find your own, unique signature tone on the bridge pickup!

  5. #4

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    Welcome! Lots of tele love here, including how to get "jazz sounds" (whatever that means!) on one. Explore around -- lots to be found!

    Marc

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    Hello to everyone on the forum,

    I will pose this question here, even though I have this feeling that it has been answered about a million times already.
    I am studying classical guitar and through the works of Takemitsu and Dyens I have found myself to be more and more interested in jazz. I also started out by playing the piano when I was 10 but always stayed within the classical music frame, except for Nikolai Kapustin and Gershwin works which follow the vocabulary of jazz but it's sheet music and not improvisation based.

    As a teen I started playing rock and was a massive fan of the Red Hot Chilli Peppers, so when we formed a band to play similar type of rock/funk style I bought myself a ESP Ron Wood telecaster and I even have recorded an album with it. This guitar is really good for that type of music, but I was wondering whether I could use it to try and learn jazz on the guitar, in the style of Joe Pass let's say (finger rather than with a pick).

    It's always fun to buy more new gear and I am currently obsessing about buying an Epiphone Joe Pass II Emperor hollow-body for my jazz initiation. Do you think it's a wise choice for a beginner or should I stick to my telecaster and try my best with what I already have?

    What can I do to get a nice fat jazz sound out of my tele? Should I use flatwound strings (12) and stick to the neck humbucker? What type of amp should I go for? Is a Blackstar ID V2 good enough for home practice?

    Any advice highly appreciated
    No, you must absolutely not ever play jazz on your ESP Ron Wood Telecaster! The harm this would do to you, and all living beings in the universe would be vast and irreversible! You must immediately send it to me so that I can protect you and all living beings in the universe by making sure jazz is never played on it! Also, the warranty on your car appears to have expired ...


    John

  7. #6

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    With a Seymour Duncan 59 in the neck position, you can play jazz with a street broom.

  8. #7

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    I just called the Jazz Police
    They're coming to get you
    Better run, better run, better run!

  9. #8

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    It appears to be in direct violation of the Jazz Constitution Article 2 section 1:

    Article 2, section 1: Guitars suitable for jazz performance shall solely utilize hollow body construction. Consequences of failure to comply with the instrument construction requirements are outlined in the jazz treason clause.

  10. #9

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    First, listen to Ted Greene on youtube. The one at the wedding gig.

    His Tele sounds like a chorus of angels.

    Then, just start playing whatever jazz you like. Experiment with the tone controls.

    If you really can't get a sound you like, you might try a humbucking pickup (if you want a darker tone) or maybe a change in capacitor value. I use the Duncan Lil 59 in a cheap Strat copy, which you can hear on the jam thread for Unit 7 under Improvisation on this forum.

    Great jazz has been played on every kind of guitar.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    Hello to everyone on the forum,

    I will pose this question here, even though I have this feeling that it has been answered about a million times already.
    I am studying classical guitar and through the works of Takemitsu and Dyens I have found myself to be more and more interested in jazz. I also started out by playing the piano when I was 10 but always stayed within the classical music frame, except for Nikolai Kapustin and Gershwin works which follow the vocabulary of jazz but it's sheet music and not improvisation based.

    As a teen I started playing rock and was a massive fan of the Red Hot Chilli Peppers, so when we formed a band to play similar type of rock/funk style I bought myself a ESP Ron Wood telecaster and I even have recorded an album with it. This guitar is really good for that type of music, but I was wondering whether I could use it to try and learn jazz on the guitar, in the style of Joe Pass let's say (finger rather than with a pick).

    It's always fun to buy more new gear and I am currently obsessing about buying an Epiphone Joe Pass II Emperor hollow-body for my jazz initiation. Do you think it's a wise choice for a beginner or should I stick to my telecaster and try my best with what I already have?

    What can I do to get a nice fat jazz sound out of my tele? Should I use flatwound strings (12) and stick to the neck humbucker? What type of amp should I go for? Is a Blackstar ID V2 good enough for home practice?

    Any advice highly appreciated

  12. #11

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    No, it will invalidate the guitar’s warranty.

  13. #12

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    It should actually be a very nice guitar for playing jazz. Just try dialing in the cleanest tone you can and turning the volume down a bit and you'll have a starting point.

  14. #13

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    You can play jazz on any guitar.

  15. #14

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    Get an archtop. It’s traditional.

    See the tele thread for all things tele. There’s no need to create another thread about your thoughts on a tele.

  16. #15

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    Heheh:


  17. #16

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    Ask Ron Wood.

  18. #17

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    ron "wood"

    cheers

    ps- i always liked those esp tele's and strats...very nice quality at a time when fender was floundering a bit...

    and you don't have to go to 12 flats..try 10 flats first!

    cheers

  19. #18

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    Ask your classical guitar teacher. He knows everything and is smarter than you’ll ever be.

  20. #19

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    I sold my first decent guitar, a 1989 or 1990 Strat Plus several years ago, when I was old enough to know better, and now regret it every time I think of it. That was the guitar I learned to play on, and although I have several “nicer jazz guitars” now, none of them has ever felt as comfortable in my hands as that guitar. I recently reached out to the buyer to see if I could buy it back, but he appears to be a dealer/collector of Strat Pluses, and my guitar was long gone.

    You can play jazz on anything. If you like your ESP and it feels good, play jazz on it.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by wzpgsr
    I sold my first decent guitar, a 1989 or 1990 Strat Plus several years ago, when I was old enough to know better, and now regret it every time I think of it. That was the guitar I learned to play on, and although I have several “nicer jazz guitars” now, none of them has ever felt as comfortable in my hands as that guitar. I recently reached out to the buyer to see if I could buy it back, but he appears to be a dealer/collector of Strat Pluses, and my guitar was long gone.
    retrospect can be a dangerous thing...esp. when it comes to the one that got away!!...

    stick with the niceties you presently have

    there’s an old adage, adapted for the title of a 1940 Thomas Wolfe novel, that states, “You can never go home again.”

    cheers

  22. #21
    Thanks peeps, I feel like I have received a warm welcome to your jazz cave.

    One more thing, I'm thinking of equipping my tele with flatwounds ECG25, hope they're not too difficult to play?

    Also; there's an ad for a Fender Champion 40 just here where I live, brand new. Do you consider it a versatile enough amp to get a good fat jazz sound or will it be too treble-y with my telecaster? I'm really asking if it pairs well with a tele, but with a humbucker at the neck. I'm currently using a friend's bass amp and the sound is not bad at all. But eventually the friend would want his amp back, so...

  23. #22

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    This may be of interest:


  24. #23

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    CAN I PLAY JAZZ ON MY ESP RON WOOD CUSTOM TELECASTER?

    Definitely!!, but you must only play the following tunes:

    Sympathy for the Satin Doll
    Brown Stella
    (I Can't Get No) Salt Peanuts
    Jumpin' Jack Freedom Jazz Dance
    Basin Street Beast of Burden
    etc.

  25. #24

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    It's not easy to play jazz on Telecaster.
    You have to look for the right sound, strings, etc.
    A guitar that is designed to play jazz is easier to handle.

  26. #25

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    OK, let's keep it civil people.

  27. #26
    Ok guys, I have just realized the magnitude of my ignorance with regard to my question because I have just stumbled upon the name of Ed Bickert.
    Thank you for being patient with me, you're a great bunch

    I bought some Daddario's and also a set of Thomastik swing flatwounds 012-050 on an impulse. I'm searching the forum for advice on "getting the Ed Bickert tone". I'm leaning towards getting a VOX pathfinder 10, since I will be playing mostly indoors for the foreseable future anyway...

    Problem is, I'm still kind of itching to get an archtop and that Joe Pass I checked out yesterday was such a sexy piece. I don't want to get my tele jealous. The grass is always greener.

  28. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    Ok guys, I have just realized the magnitude of my ignorance with regard to my question because I have just stumbled upon the name of Ed Bickert.
    Thank you for being patient with me, you're a great bunch

    I bought some Daddario's and also a set of Thomastik swing flatwounds 012-050 on an impulse. I'm searching the forum for advice on "getting the Ed Bickert tone". I'm leaning towards getting a VOX pathfinder 10, since I will be playing mostly indoors for the foreseable future anyway...

    Problem is, I'm still kind of itching to get an archtop and that Joe Pass I checked out yesterday was such a sexy piece. I don't want to get my tele jealous. The grass is always greener.
    If the TI 12s feel too stiff, 10s or 11s can work great to alleviate some stiffness. I found 10s to be more useable for me on a Tele even though I use 12s on several other guitars.

  29. #28

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    Can you play jazz? That's really the question. If so, almost any guitar will do. If not, even Wes Montgomery's guitar won't help.

  30. #29

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    the great ted greene wound up using 11-48 nickel plated steel roundwounds..and he tuned down!

    bickert used lighter rounds as well...supposedly 10-46's at some point in his career

    no reason to go too heavy on the flats either with tele

    cheers

  31. #30

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    I find lowering the neck pup so the bass side is almost flush to the pickguard helps.

  32. #31

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    Hi,

    I've played jazz on a tele for years, albeit with an EMG tele neck pickup.

    Mostly I play with my thumb, which gives a darker mellow tone.

    One nice thing about heavier strings (esp with a wound 3rd) is that it keeps you from bending that much. But I use 10s and it sounds just fine.

    Something to keep in mind is that the lower pitched strings on a tele have longer sustain than on a hollow body archtop. Sometimes I even lightly mute with the heel of my right hand, to make the string die out a little quicker.

    In the end it really comes down to the feel in your playing.

    btw, I looked up the ESP Ron Wood and it looks like a great guitar.

    My 0.02€ of course

  33. #32
    If Lenny Breau can play a Hagstrom 12 string with 6 strings I imagine anything with tone will do! I rather doubt Ron Wood cares much about jazz guitar. This my birthday so I am gonna repeat an old joke. A rock guitarist is a guy who knows very few chords playing for thousands of people. A jazz guitarist is a guy who knows thousands of chords playing for very few people. Pick your poison.

  34. #33

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    Getting the Ed Bickert tone (to the extent that's possible if you're not Ed):


    1. Get a Telecaster. Use the neck pickup. Roll the Tele's volume off slightly which rounds off the highs, tone control to taste. Pick with a light touch, pick between thumb and index finger and use the ring and middle fingers to "pluck" rather than strum the chord.


    2. Get an amp that has a fairly flat tonal response (so probably not a Fender). Ed used a Standel, later an orange Roland Cube 60 for a long time, later in life had an Evans amp that was loaned to him.

    3. Learn Ed Bickert "grips."

    4. And the fun part: listen to all the Ed you can find.