The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by ruger9
    It's there now, altho still limited specifics.
    Custom Gallery | Collings 470 JL #19005

    There's a video where he plays both the Nachocaster and the Gretsch back-to-back, and other than saying the Gretsch is louder, he doesn't say anything about the differences in play/ergonomics between them. I have teles and a Gretsch, and I can switch between them no problem. The only real difference is the scale length and the neck angle... neither matters for me. I have played some guitars where a steep neck angle did make the guitar feel "weird" compared to something like a tele, and I did not like it- it wasn't comfortable for me- but my Gretsch 6120 is no problem.
    Yes, I've seen that video before. Just some casually amazing playing from him and Jorge Roeder. I do wish he'd played one of the tunes on the Gretsch though.

    Neck angle is really what I wonder about. Since Julian Lage looks like he's gently planting his pinky a lot of the time when he's playing there is some micro-adjustment that's necessary (probably unconscious). And since I've read before that he's had some dystonic issues and was/is(?) into Alexander technique for musicians, my inquiring mind wonders whether he might have developed some helpful insights regarding adapting playing positions on differently shaped instruments.

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  3. #27

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    there are moments that make you roll your eyes, and moments that make you want to punch him (only collings can build a duo jet? really, foo?). i know he's just doing his job, but come on. but they don't look bad, and they sound great, of course.

    didn't know they came in three finishes. i still don't know what the hell the third one is supposed to be, though. it's not orange, it's not a gold top. it sort of reminds me of tang. that's brave. i like it. i'm also just now noticing it has plain old gibson reflector knobs. that's my preference on a gibson, but it's pretty wrong for a gretsch.

  4. #28

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    [QUOTE=feet;1091598]
    /QUOTE]

    well there's no doubt he's jazzed about it...good for him!

    he makes some good points..as to the dynamic quality of dynasonic(type) pickups...and about the importance of acoustic properties of an electric guitar...kudos for that

    no gretsch mention is sad tho...but thats business


    cheers

  5. #29

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    For that sort of money, I would want an original design.

  6. #30
    1) I agree.... he's trying WAY too hard with his words LOL

    2) I'll never pay 7K for a guitar

    3) He kept talking about it's "acoustic properties", and how it sounds "acoustically", it would have been nice to HEAR that...

    4) I want one. It may be the best Jet ever made. (but see #2)

  7. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by ruger9
    2) I'll never pay 7K for a guitar
    neither did he!! haha

    cheers

  8. #32

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    Wonderful guitar. That video is just business...I like Julian a lot, so live and let live. Still no information if it‘s chambered (>Gretsch Duo Jet construction) or -like it‘s mentioned on the website- fully hollow (>Guild M-75 Aristocrat construction).
    Which was the blueprint for this model?

    The Ron Ellis pickups are obviously fantastic!

    Concerning $:
    Buy a Gretsch custom shop guitar and you‘re in the same price range. And I bet the Collings is the better choice.

  9. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
    Wonderful guitar. That video is just business...I like Julian a lot, so live and let live. Still no information if it‘s chambered (>Gretsch Duo Jet construction) or -like it‘s mentioned on the website- fully hollow (>Guild M-75 Aristocrat construction).
    Which was the blueprint for this model?
    I would have to assume his '53 Duo Jet he's been playing for a few years now.


  10. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
    Wonderful guitar. That video is just business...I like Julian a lot, so live and let live. Still no information if it‘s chambered (>Gretsch Duo Jet construction) or -like it‘s mentioned on the website- fully hollow (>Guild M-75 Aristocrat construction).
    ...
    He says it's chambered with a centre block.

  11. #35

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    Just my take on it .... If I was to redesign the Duo Jet for a clean based jazz based player ...I`d a made it with a 15" lower bout a a hair deeper at the sides .... then it wouldn`t be a Duo Jet . I`m absolutely sure however that this JL model will take you "further" than a Gretsch in terms of freqs,resonance,evenness and whatever a great acoustic delivers

  12. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by docsteve
    He says it's chambered with a centre block.
    That's what he said about the '53 Jet... in the Collings video he says "semi-hollow with trestle block going down the middle"... which is what the Collings website says. Not sure exactly what that is. I know what a centerblock is, I know what trestle BRACES are, I know how old Jets were chambered... but no one really knows what's going on inside this new Collings...

  13. #37

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    There’s a lot of information online now on the Collings website.

    I totally totally dig the semi shine of the guitars surface and the see-thru headstock coating.
    Last edited by Stefan Eff; 01-19-2021 at 01:34 PM.

  14. #38
    all the website says is "fully hollow trestle block body". No one but Collings knows what that is, lol. I have a Gretsch with trestle braces. If I had to wager a guess, I's say the Collings was like a fully hollow, trestle-braced Gretsch, without the F-holes.

    Now if we can figure out what the differences between trestle BRACES and a trestle BLOCK are...

    these are trestle braces: 2 individual braces connecting the front and back... perhaps the "block" means it's machined out of a solid piece of wood (solid wood beneath the pickups and bridge, like a 335 centerlbock, but hollowed out like the braces? Who knows. All I know is, I want one, but will never be able to afford such an extrvagance. If it were my ONLY guitar, maybe.


    Julian Lage's new Collings (Gretsch Duo Jet copy)-jpg

  15. #39

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    Hot take from someone well outside the target demographic for this guitar:
    While waiting to pickup one of my guitars from getting a seasonal setup adjustment, I picked up a Collings Eastside Deluxe LC off the wall of the shop and noodled around for a bit. I have to say I was blown away by how inspiring and musical the thing was. I didn't even plug it in, but the thing just sang. The playability was stunning, and it just resonated so naturally. Really eye opening.

    Now, with my values and aesthetic (both sonic and visual), of course I'm gonna stick with my 30's L-5's and ES-150.

    But for everyone throwing shade, especially at the price.... The sonic qualities I experienced with that Eastside, I mean I've certainly never seen a Gretsch that has that kind of mojo. Sure, a really good Gretsch can have it's own mojo, but it's not *that* thing, I got from that Eastside (and that I've similarly gotten from an AT-16). Given how Julian talks about the acoustic resonance of the guitar, I feel like he's talking about exactly what I noticed.

    Is it worth it? Well, that's a subjective thing, but at the scale Collings is making guitars, I don't personally feel like they're gouging anybody.

    I've not played a Nacho-caster, but something tells me there's a similar resonance that somebody like Nacho manages to get that is something beyond what other builders have to offer. It might only be that last 1%, but if you're a pro of a certain level, that's a different math. When an instrument speaks to someone and inspires them, it's worth more than merely the cost or resale value of a guitar. And if you really can build one just as good in your garage, then do it and give Nacho a run for the money.

    Lastly I've not met the guy, but I don't think Julian is just making his gear choices on what's "cool". He's gone from Manzer archtops, to a 16" L-5, to Blackguards, to Duo Jets, etc.... And none of those choices was based on what the new "hot" gear fetish was.

  16. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by ruger9
    all the website says is "fully hollow trestle block body". No one but Collings knows what that is, lol. I have a Gretsch with trestle braces. If I had to wager a guess, I's say the Collings was like a fully hollow, trestle-braced Gretsch, without the F-holes.

    Now if we can figure out what the differences between trestle BRACES and a trestle BLOCK are...

    these are trestle braces: 2 individual braces connecting the front and back... perhaps the "block" means it's machined out of a solid piece of wood (solid wood beneath the pickups and bridge, like a 335 centerlbock, but hollowed out like the braces? Who knows. All I know is, I want one, but will never be able to afford such an extrvagance. If it were my ONLY guitar, maybe.


    Julian Lage's new Collings (Gretsch Duo Jet copy)-jpg
    The covers on the back are maybe a sign for a chambered body :-P

    They didn‘t mentioned the weight. Strange thing is the cheap Delrin nut (I‘ve changed a Delrin nut on a Telecaster neck for a customer a few weeks ago, was a nightmare).Why not a really good TusqXL if not bone?

    Also interesting is the neck dimension.

  17. #41

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    This is a really good post I've been thinking of commenting along the same lines but this really says it all. I recently bought a Collings Eastside LC used and I really have to say they get a lot right. I wouldn't have thought that I could ever consider buying one new, but after owning this, I have to say knowing what I know now I would. I hear the Collings personality in the video. What is worth what is for you to decide, but I have no doubts it's a top tier guitar.
    Quote Originally Posted by campusfive
    Hot take from someone well outside the target demographic for this guitar:
    While waiting to pickup one of my guitars from getting a seasonal setup adjustment, I picked up a Collings Eastside Deluxe LC off the wall of the shop and noodled around for a bit. I have to say I was blown away by how inspiring and musical the thing was. I didn't even plug it in, but the thing just sang. The playability was stunning, and it just resonated so naturally. Really eye opening.

    Now, with my values and aesthetic (both sonic and visual), of course I'm gonna stick with my 30's L-5's and ES-150.

    But for everyone throwing shade, especially at the price.... The sonic qualities I experienced with that Eastside, I mean I've certainly never seen a Gretsch that has that kind of mojo. Sure, a really good Gretsch can have it's own mojo, but it's not *that* thing, I got from that Eastside (and that I've similarly gotten from an AT-16). Given how Julian talks about the acoustic resonance of the guitar, I feel like he's talking about exactly what I noticed.

    Is it worth it? Well, that's a subjective thing, but at the scale Collings is making guitars, I don't personally feel like they're gouging anybody.

    I've not played a Nacho-caster, but something tells me there's a similar resonance that somebody like Nacho manages to get that is something beyond what other builders have to offer. It might only be that last 1%, but if you're a pro of a certain level, that's a different math. When an instrument speaks to someone and inspires them, it's worth more than merely the cost or resale value of a guitar. And if you really can build one just as good in your garage, then do it and give Nacho a run for the money.

    Lastly I've not met the guy, but I don't think Julian is just making his gear choices on what's "cool". He's gone from Manzer archtops, to a 16" L-5, to Blackguards, to Duo Jets, etc.... And none of those choices was based on what the new "hot" gear fetish was.

  18. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by campusfive
    Hot take from someone well outside the target demographic for this guitar:
    While waiting to pickup one of my guitars from getting a seasonal setup adjustment, I picked up a Collings Eastside Deluxe LC off the wall of the shop and noodled around for a bit. I have to say I was blown away by how inspiring and musical the thing was. I didn't even plug it in, but the thing just sang. The playability was stunning, and it just resonated so naturally. Really eye opening.

    Now, with my values and aesthetic (both sonic and visual), of course I'm gonna stick with my 30's L-5's and ES-150.

    But for everyone throwing shade, especially at the price.... The sonic qualities I experienced with that Eastside, I mean I've certainly never seen a Gretsch that has that kind of mojo. Sure, a really good Gretsch can have it's own mojo, but it's not *that* thing, I got from that Eastside (and that I've similarly gotten from an AT-16). Given how Julian talks about the acoustic resonance of the guitar, I feel like he's talking about exactly what I noticed.

    Is it worth it? Well, that's a subjective thing, but at the scale Collings is making guitars, I don't personally feel like they're gouging anybody.

    I've not played a Nacho-caster, but something tells me there's a similar resonance that somebody like Nacho manages to get that is something beyond what other builders have to offer. It might only be that last 1%, but if you're a pro of a certain level, that's a different math. When an instrument speaks to someone and inspires them, it's worth more than merely the cost or resale value of a guitar. And if you really can build one just as good in your garage, then do it and give Nacho a run for the money.

    Lastly I've not met the guy, but I don't think Julian is just making his gear choices on what's "cool". He's gone from Manzer archtops, to a 16" L-5, to Blackguards, to Duo Jets, etc.... And none of those choices was based on what the new "hot" gear fetish was.
    Good take. The way I see this guitar is that Julian got to work with a great company to create his absolute dream guitar. A $7,000 instrument for a player of Julian's magnitude seems like a bargain. And if you want one too you can buy one (though don't expect to sound like him lol). I'm not running out to buy one but I don't find it absurd, I'm sure they'll sell.

  19. #43

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    Lage posted the marketing vid already shared in the OP on youtube today .. followed by this a bit later .. I guess it belongs here?


  20. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by campusfive
    ...
    I've not played a Nacho-caster, but something tells me there's a similar resonance that somebody like Nacho manages to get that is something beyond what other builders have to offer. It might only be that last 1%, but if you're a pro of a certain level, that's a different math. When an instrument speaks to someone and inspires them, it's worth more than merely the cost or resale value of a guitar. And if you really can build one just as good in your garage, then do it and give Nacho a run for the money.

    Lastly I've not met the guy, but I don't think Julian is just making his gear choices on what's "cool". He's gone from Manzer archtops, to a 16" L-5, to Blackguards, to Duo Jets, etc.... And none of those choices was based on what the new "hot" gear fetish was.
    Thanks for your post. So true.
    As mentioned before- that‘s Gretsch custom shop price range and I doubt you‘ll get the same from there.

  21. #45

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    Jonathan's post is spot on. Collings makes great instruments. They're always inherently musical. I am curious if the construction of this 470 JL model is more akin to the old Guild Aristocrat M-75 than the Duo Jet as Collings mentions it's fully hollow as opposed to chambered.

  22. #46

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    I wonder why Julian wanted a Bigsby on his signature guitar. Another interesting detail:
    one Mastervolume but two Tonepots.

  23. #47

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    you guys are seriously, seriously underestimating the gretsch custom shop. it's a much smaller shop, and stephen stern learned the craft under a some nobodies like jimmy d'aquisto and bob benedetto before becoming a fender master builder and finally, the gretsch guy. i'm not sure you'll find many guys or gals with a better pedigree anywhere on earth, if that kind of thing means anything to you.

    i sat down with a couple of custom shop duo jets in a shop once. given the price tag, i was afraid to plug them in and compare them to the standard pro line gretsches that i was after. but you could hear and feel it even unplugged. the best way i could explain it is that the pro lines were like a new acoustic, and the custom shops were like a vintage one; all matured and opened up.

    and i think that most days, you could easily get one cheaper than one of these collings, if you were so inclined. and they're comparable items, which we still haven't confirmed yet. and then there's the price. all collings have become way more expensive in recent years. it's not that the guitars have gotten better, it's that austin has become super expensive and the costs of business and living wages are being passed on to the consumer.

    having said all that, collings still knocks out a quality product. i almost bought one of their flat tops last year and they were kind enough to return a few emails and were very helpful, but covid made it impossible to try one out and i ended up with something else. but i'm a long time admirer of the soco (especially when they were about $2000 cheaper) and a statesman could still be a pipe dream down the road. i often wonder about a statesman vs a custom shop gretsch that would be similar.

    i know a lot of guys complain about collings being sterile and "mojoless" compared to their custom shop gibsons with warped necks and bad frets, but i couldn't speak to that. guitars are awesome or they aren't.

    now i'll sit and politely wait for someone to buy one of these and compare it to a custom shop duo jet and one of those guild american patriarch aristocrats. man, i wanted one of those.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
    I wonder why Julian wanted a Bigsby on his signature guitar. Another interesting detail:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
    one Mastervolume but two Tonepots.
    because they're awesome. and that's probably what was on his old duo jet and he didn't want to mess up a good thing. and the 1 master, 2 tones is pretty common for a gretsch.

  24. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Eff
    I wonder why Julian wanted a Bigsby on his signature guitar. .
    Because it's a Jet.

  25. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by feet

    now i'll sit and politely wait for someone to buy one of these and compare it to a custom shop duo jet and one of those guild american patriarch aristocrats. man, i wanted one of those.
    .
    Yeah man! And even a regular production Vintage Select Duo Jet...

  26. #50

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    I‘ve asked because I never heard Julian playing a guitar with a Bigsby, even on the Collings the arm is turned away when he‘s playing. And yes, I‘m a Bigsby guy:
    Julian Lage's new Collings (Gretsch Duo Jet copy)-80d42509-5b8c-4692-8e30-bc89258e166f-jpeg
    (took this picture while writing )

    His vintage Duo Jet‘s got no Bigsby, by the way.