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  1. #1
    Hello together,

    I thought, I'd quickly buy myself an amp. Should have known that this is not as simple as that.


    Usage: little combo (voc.,drums, bs) and little to medium room-size, probably outside too.
    Axe: Epipone Emperor Archtop

    Desired sound: kind of Fender Twin

    At the moment I've got a list of interesting devices and I would appreciate, if someone could answer me a few questions:
    There are (ignored Twin - also tonemaster)


    • DV Mark Jazz 12
    • Boss Katana MKII
    • Line 6 Spider MKII
    • Fender Champion 10


    DV Mark:
    Is the ventilator really as unbearable loud, as it is described in so many posts? Isn't it possible to use it reasonably at home?

    Fender Champion 10:
    According to the manual there is a Twin simulation. It is nowhere listed as jazz amp - but software should be software anyway and I do not believe it is another one, than used in the tonemaster...
    Is it approximately as good as the original?
    Does anybody use the champion?

    Boss Katana:
    Here also is a fender simulation contained - same question:
    How far is the sound from the twin or deluxe amps?
    Does anybody even know, if it relates better to the original than the champion?

    Line 6:
    The tone seams a little warmer and emphasizing less the mids. But I also heard, that it's a pain in the ass during recording.
    Has anybody experienced this, too?

    Currently it is difficult for me, due to infrastructur and corona, to test them in the shop, so I would try to get them online. Therefore I would be very thankful for your experience.
    Is it approximately as good as the original.

    regards
    oxi
    Last edited by GolanTrevize; 11-20-2020 at 07:15 AM.

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    das ist doch das schöne am internet handel. thomann schickt dir das alles zum ausprobieren nach hause...

  4. #3

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    Fender Super Champ X2. You can make it much louder if you buy the head and use a cab with a better/louder speaker. If you can spend more, Fender Tonemaster Twin.

  5. #4

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    If you are after a twinnish sound, are you sure the 4 amps on your list are going to get you there? I really doubt it.

    That being said. If you are looking for an amp that will deliver in a combo situation, i would go for a small tube amp or a good (!) small ss-amp.

    The DV Mark is a good amp. It will deliver. I never had any trouble with a ventilator.

    Fender makes a few smaller amps that seem great for this type of job: the blues junior or the pro junior.
    Last edited by Marcel_A; 11-25-2020 at 02:51 AM.

  6. #5

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    I have a DV Jazz 12, the fan noise is greatly exaggerated online... Yeah, there's fan noise, but it's not disruptive. Not exactly a Twin sound. Undoubtedly my favorite amp, but if you specifically want a Fender tone, this isn't it -- it sounds much better, with much more midrange.

  7. #6

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    I have a Champion 20 (not 10; I've never heard of that). It works great with small groups in small rooms. It can get quite loud if needed. It has models of BF Twin, Deluxe, and Princeton Reverbs, plus tweed Champ, Deluxe, and Bassman.

    The models are not programmable. I think the Deluxe Reverb sounds the best of the bunch and is what I use when I play jazz through the C20.

    John

  8. #7

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    Replaced my Katana 100w combo Version 1 with a ToneMaster Twin when I stopped lying to myself about how good the Katana’s Twin emulation sounded.

  9. #8

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    My tonemast deluxe reverb is great! Cannot call it a twin sound necessarily but I bet the TM twin would get you there.

  10. #9
    Thanks everybody for your input.
    Now the Fender Champ 100 (yes its 100 not 10 - typo) is substituted by the mustang GTX100. And no Line 6 anymore. Katana is also not in the list anymore - mainly because of the need to program it via computer, which seems to be selfcontained by the Fender amps.

    I suppose I prefer the not so heavy amps for practical reasons and so the tonemaster-amps will not satisfy my wishes.

    So I only have to decide between the DV Mark and the Fender Mustang GTX.

    The main advantage of the Mustang is the main disadvantage. It is software based. The features seam really cool, and it seams to provide the sounds I'd like to hear (from some YT videos). But it is software - and I'm quite sceptical with software... The DV Mark has a very nice sound too and thanks for the answers regarding the vent. Both are small and affordable...

    Now - has anybody experience with the mustang gtx series?

    And then I suppose I will flip a coin

  11. #10

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    "I suppose I prefer the not so heavy amps for practical reasons and so the tonemaster-amps will not satisfy my wishes."

    I am a little confused. The Tonemaster amps' greatest advantage is their light weight.

  12. #11

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    Tonemaster is lighter than it looks.

    Otherwise get a TOOB metro, an H&K spirit of Vintage and a reverb pedal. Sorted

  13. #12

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    I have a Fender Mustang GT200 (same brains, more power), not exactly apples to apples but it does a convincing (to my ears) twin/clean Fender sound better than Katana. The GTX100 at 22 lbs is tantalizing. I'm thinking of getting one or a used GT100, which is essentially the same hardware and update the firmware. Once you get the hang of it, editing from the front panel is easy though the Tone software for iOS/Android is convenient it is buggy. No one does Fender better than Fender.

  14. #13

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    Oxi, what do you want more - A simple amp that does ONE THING spectacularly well, or an amp with many more options?
    I always found the Mustangs disappointing, but that's because I couldn't find, among its wealth of options, the sound I desired - which was that of plugging into a DV Jazz 12.



    I think these guys sound amazing, this is the smaller, 1x8 model, however, I think that this video captures the tone of the Jazz amps by DV mark better than other youtube videos.

    The tradeoff is that it does only this one thing.

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by tpandela
    I have a Fender Mustang GT200 (same brains, more power), not exactly apples to apples but it does a convincing (to my ears) twin/clean Fender sound better than Katana. The GTX100 at 22 lbs is tantalizing. I'm thinking of getting one or a used GT100, which is essentially the same hardware and update the firmware. Once you get the hang of it, editing from the front panel is easy though the Tone software for iOS/Android is convenient it is buggy. No one does Fender better than Fender.
    I love Fender amps. But I would not buy another Fender modeling amp. The reason is I have a Fender Mustang III modeling amp that used the Fender Fuse Software. Fender decided first not to update this software then not support it then removed all reference to it on their website. All this within a couple of years of purchasing the amp.

    I understand technology changes rapidly but to completely abandon your customers so quickly left me with a bad taste on any modeling product Fender has.

    I’m considering a Line 6 HX Stomp. Based on my research so far, it looks like Line 6 has a better modeling product. And continually updates it without making its past products obsolete so quickly.

  16. #15

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    Here was your original list:

    • DV Mark Jazz 12
    • Boss Katana MKII
    • Line 6 Spider MKII
    • Fender Champion 10 (you meant 100)


    Here's their weights:

    • DV Mark Jazz 12 22.5 lbs
    • Boss Katana MKII 25 lbs
    • Line 6 Spider MKII 23 lbs
    • Fender Champion 100 40 lbs


    A Fender Tonemaster Deluxe Reverb is 23 lbs, making it a match with the second lightest amp in your list

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by fasteddie
    I love Fender amps. But I would not buy another Fender modeling amp. The reason is I have a Fender Mustang III modeling amp that used the Fender Fuse Software. Fender decided first not to update this software then not support it then removed all reference to it on their website. All this within a couple of years of purchasing the amp.

    I understand technology changes rapidly but to completely abandon your customers so quickly left me with a bad taste on any modeling product Fender has.

    I’m considering a Line 6 HX Stomp. Based on my research so far, it looks like Line 6 has a better modeling product. And continually updates it without making its past products obsolete so quickly.
    Though I have been happy with my Headrush pedalboard, I'm fairly certain I'll migrate to Helix if my HR unit fails at some point. Line 6 just outclasses all of the competition when it comes to long-term product support. Headrush last had a major update in 2018... Fender & Boss just release new products instead of perfecting and continually working on what they already released...
    I have a Boss SY-300. Super cool kit, but no post-release support or marketing at all, really. Instead, they released the SY-1 and SY-1000...

  18. #17

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    TM Deluxe is also significantly more expensive than the amps listed by the OP just saying.

    Seriously, for a small amp I'm not really sure I'd go combo again. If weight is an issue, being able to break up that weight when transporting the amp is extra helpful. Plus you get to try out different amp/speaker combos.

    The DV Mark heads have the Little Jazz Sound, if you like that sound.

    I am tremendously impressed by the H&K spirit of vintage - it responds and sounds like my Princeton... $200 IIRC. No reverb though. So you'd need another pedal for that.

    BAM200 is $150 and has a warm tone for guitar even though it's designed as a bass amp. Again, no reverb.

    If you use a modelling pedal like the HX Stomp, getting a clean power amp is straightforward. Plenty of options on the market for any price point.

    For a speaker you could get a 1X10 or 1X12 off your choice (the H&K TM110 is a decent cheap option) but I am a massive shill for TOOB products because they are GREAT.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by GolanTrevize
    Thanks everybody for your input.
    Now the Fender Champ 100 (yes its 100 not 10 - typo) is substituted by the mustang GTX100. And no Line 6 anymore. Katana is also not in the list anymore - mainly because of the need to program it via computer, which seems to be selfcontained by the Fender amps.

    I suppose I prefer the not so heavy amps for practical reasons and so the tonemaster-amps will not satisfy my wishes.

    So I only have to decide between the DV Mark and the Fender Mustang GTX.

    The main advantage of the Mustang is the main disadvantage. It is software based. The features seam really cool, and it seams to provide the sounds I'd like to hear (from some YT videos). But it is software - and I'm quite sceptical with software... The DV Mark has a very nice sound too and thanks for the answers regarding the vent. Both are small and affordable...

    Now - has anybody experience with the mustang gtx series?

    And then I suppose I will flip a coin
    I would go for the Champion 40 or 50xl rather than any of the Mustangs (I compared the series in person when I bought my Champion). The Mustang and Champion amps all have the same basic sounds, but the Champion series don't involve programming or have menus. It's all just knobs on the front panel (the 50xl has more effects, including overdrive). They're also a little lighter.

    John

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by GolanTrevize
    Hello together,

    I thought, I'd quickly buy myself an amp. Should have known that this is not as simple as that.


    Usage: little combo (voc.,drums, bs) and little to medium room-size, probably outside too.
    Axe: Epipone Emperor Archtop

    Desired sound: kind of Fender Twin

    At the moment I've got a list of interesting devices and I would appreciate, if someone could answer me a few questions:
    There are (ignored Twin - also tonemaster)


    • DV Mark Jazz 12
    • Boss Katana MKII
    • Line 6 Spider MKII
    • Fender Champion 10

    regards
    oxi
    If you're looking for a Twin sound, I agree with the poster above who suggested that none of the amps on that list are going to give it.

    The DV LJ (which I think is the same electronics as the one on your list) is a great sounding amp for what I do, but I had a silver face Twin years ago and they're nothing alike. Comparisons between the LJ and the Mark 12 jazz suggest that the difference is relatively subtle.

    I have played through a Katana and it didn't remind me of a Twin.

    Of course, not all Twins sound the same. Mine had JBL's, which gave the amp a very quick attack. At the time, I felt like I wished the note would take a little longer to emerge.

    One thing that you might check out is pedals which are designed to sound like a Twin. Google it. The idea would be to play through an amp with a clean, plain sound and use the pedal to make it sound like a Twin. I've never used one, so I don't know how well they work.

  21. #20
    Thanks everybody for their input. You all were a great help - and helped me to the (in my case) right decision.

    Eventually I ordered the DV Mark. And yes it is not a fender sound - but I like it very much, too.

    I'd like to share my considerations, why it became this device.

    I bought it mainly because of the sound - and thanks for all the reassurance in this respect: the little thing sounds exactly as described and as I imagined it. It's warmer and more natural than the recordings I heard of the fender gtx. The second reason is the weight - it is really the lightest of the different amps.

    Of course the many emulations and toys that come with the modeling amps are quite tempting. But in the end I realized, I don't need them. Yes a looper is nice - but I could as well buy a specific looper, which does exactly what I want. Yes - different sounds are nice - but to be honest: I own a xvamp (behringer) and normally use exactly one sound.

    And there it was the nice sounding little and light DV with exactly the sound I like to continue playing with, that does not require to enlist at a university to be mastered, because it is a simple amp and not a computer, and that might be carried in one hand and the guitar in the other to get from the car to the rehearsal room - or even use public transports.
    It just promises to be so carefree and simple and nevertheless sound as I like it.

    Anyway you suggested and described so much, that it will even influence the decision for my next amp, which might as well be a modelling amp, because they seem also really cool.

    The DV already arrived and it is everything I wished for at the moment - and I don't like to stop playing.

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by mr quick
    Oxi, what do you want more - A simple amp that does ONE THING spectacularly well, or an amp with many more options?
    I always found the Mustangs disappointing, but that's because I couldn't find, among its wealth of options, the sound I desired - which was that of plugging into a DV Jazz 12.



    I think these guys sound amazing, this is the smaller, 1x8 model, however, I think that this video captures the tone of the Jazz amps by DV mark better than other youtube videos.

    The tradeoff is that it does only this one thing.
    Man, that is some SERIOUSLY nice playing. And the sound is perfect. I don think you ever ask for more than that.
    Joe D