Dating a Gibson L-12 for CITES

[doc w]

As some of you already know, I bought a Gibson L-12 and I am now waiting for it to clear CITES certification. I just got an email from them saying that they needed a confirmation of the serial number and date. Here is what they said:

"... please provide a copy of the Gibson catalog that shows the guitar's serial number and the date that it was manufactured to support the statement on the age of the guitar."

I don't know what they mean by "Gibson catalog." Is there any such thing? How can I validate the date of manufacture?

Has anyone been through this before?

[Eck]

I would expect any information from Gibson that looks like it’s not fraudulent would be accepted, included an email from their service department.
Gruhn’s guide probably lists the year of manufacturing for your serial number. Maybe someone on this forum can scan the page with that info.

[ThatRhythmMan]

Maybe someone will have some good ideas about what to submit, but I don’t know if anything that would exactly fulfill their request. You might try asking Joe Spann. He can be reached at Gruhn guitars. I think his email address is Joe@gruhn.com.

[doc w]

Thanks for the quick responses, guys!

Given the serial number and the features, we all know that the date of this damn guitar is 1936 or 1936. The serial number is 92507. But that wasn't enough for CITES. They want some official Gibson catalogue listing which as we know, does not exist.


Eck, great idea! I just called Gibson and the man on the phone confirmed within a few seconds that the guitar is a 1936 or 1936. He said to email Gibson with photos and they will confirm the date. I guess an email or letter from Gibson oughta be enough.

[doc w]

Maybe someone will have some good ideas about what to submit, but I don’t know if anything that would exactly fulfill their request. You might try asking Joe Spann. He can be reached at Gruhn guitars. I think his email address is Joe@gruhn.com.

Another good idea. I did just that and discovered that they could provide some official expert dating, and in very short order. Gruhn is my back-up if Gibson cannot provide me with something

Gruhn had a nice L7 for sale but I was looking for an L12 because it looked sexier. I should have gone with Gruhn. They do the CITES paperwork and if one has to buy a guitar sight unseen, I would trust Gruhn above anyone else. Really helpful and nice guys too.

Oh well live and learn.

[waltf]

I thought the cites restrictions were lifted for musical instruments?

[ThatRhythmMan]

I thought the cites restrictions were lifted for musical instruments?

They weren’t lifted for Brazilian rosewood, which has regulations which predate the recently lifted ones. I don’t expect the Brazilian rosewood restrictions to ever be listed.

[doc w]

TRM has it right. Trade in Brazilian rosewood (or, as it is affectionately know, Bazillion rosewood), is prohibited unless the wood in question was harvested before the various treaties came into effect. I think that the cut-off date is 1992. So, if you have a guitar containing Brazilian rosewood and it was made before 1992, all you have to do is prove it. That is not as easy as it might sound. So far, the terminology, the forms, and the procedure all have been very difficult for me, exacerbated by the fact that I have to be both the exporter (from the US) and the importer (into Canada).

I sure hope that this guitar turns out to be a good one. I don't think that I could ever go through this again.

[doc w]

I realized yesterday that Gruhn's guide to vintage guitars should do the trick. I checked and my serial number is definitely a 1935 number. I hope that CITES will accept this as valid. After all, Gruhn wrote the book on vintage guitars, quite literally, lol.

[Hammertone]

I sure hope that this guitar turns out to be a good one. I don't think that I could ever go through this again.

No worries. If you don't like the guitar, you can sell it up here and get all your $$ back. Then you can buy my L-12, without the need for any CITES paperwork!