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  1. #1

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    Quoting Mr. lawson-stone...

    "I hope someone will give us a thread on the
    ToneMaster Deluxe Reverb (TMDR) as well, but for now, it's the Twin!"

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________

    I would like to hear comments from anyone who purchased the TMDR over the ToneMaster TWIN Reverb (TMTR)

    Apart from the factors of less overall weight/physical size and a lower price, what were the other deciding factors that
    helped you to deicide?

    Thanks.

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    For me the main factor was that I don’t need more than the 22w that the TMDR delivers. I really don’t need 85w out of my amp.

    Additionally:

    • The price difference at that level was not an issue.
    • The absence of a “middle” tone control can be solved by any half-decent eq pedal.
    • The absence of a “bright” switch can be solved by channel jumping.


    For someone playing with a loud drummer, or who needs massive amounts of clean headroom I can see the benefits of the TMTR - but that’s not my situation.

  4. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray175
    • The absence of a “middle” tone control can be solved by any half-decent eq pedal.
    • The absence of a “bright” switch can be solved by channel jumping.

    Your response is much appreciated. Merci.

    Do you find that you you need to do the channel jumping to achieve the "jazz tones" you prefer?

    I do have an EQ pedal to help with the absence of a "mids" control.

  5. #4

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    The most obvious reason to choose the TMDR over the TMTR is simply a preference for that signature Deluxe Reverb sound. The DR is not just a 22 watt Twin Reverb, but has its own distinctive tone that most players really enjoy. I have a SuperChamp X2 head and I keep it on the 65 Deluxe model. I'm pondering getting a TMDR just because I enjoy that tone so much. The Twin also has its virtues and they are not merely calculated in watts. The two speakers at any volume have a fullness of sound, moving lots of air. The 6L6 modeling produces a different tone from 6V6 modeling, and the super clean tone is very nice.

    Fender did a good thing by bringing out these two Tone Masters first.

  6. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greco
    Your response is much appreciated. Merci.

    Do you find that you you need to do the channel jumping to achieve the "jazz tones" you prefer?

    I do have an EQ pedal to help with the absence of a "mids" control.
    Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.

    Lawson is right to underline the fact that the TMDR and theTMTR have their own distinctive sounds - since my musical tastes are pretty eclectic, I prefer breakup to come in earlier on the dial - theTMTR has more clean headroom and pushes more air with its 2 speakers, so at mid to high volume I guess you can physically feel the sound more than on the TMDR. A question of personal taste and functional need :-)
    Hope this helps.
    Ray

  7. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    The most obvious reason to choose the TMDR over the TMTR is simply a preference for that signature Deluxe Reverb sound. The DR is not just a 22 watt Twin Reverb, but has its own distinctive tone that most players really enjoy. I have a SuperChamp X2 head and I keep it on the 65 Deluxe model. I'm pondering getting a TMDR just because I enjoy that tone so much. The Twin also has its virtues and they are not merely calculated in watts. The two speakers at any volume have a fullness of sound, moving lots of air. The 6L6 modeling produces a different tone from 6V6 modeling, and the super clean tone is very nice.

    Fender did a good thing by bringing out these two Tone Masters first.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ray175
    Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.

    Lawson is right to underline the fact that the TMDR and the TMTR have their own distinctive sounds - since my musical tastes are pretty eclectic, I prefer breakup to come in earlier on the dial - the TMTR has more clean headroom and pushes more air with its 2 speakers, so at mid to high volume I guess you can physically feel the sound more than on the TMDR. A question of personal taste and functional need :-)
    Hope this helps.
    Ray
    Thank you for all the valuable information. I am learning a lot from this... and I hope it helps others.

    I know our local store has a TMDR, but I'm not sure if they have received a TMTR to date. The "proof is in the pudding" and I need to try both amplifiers models side by side.

  8. #7

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    Love the TMTR! Never played a Deluxe new or old. All previous amps have been 1x12s or smaller so I jumped on the chance to move more air at low volumes. But I wonder. Can someone release their inner poet and describe the difference in tone and... feel?

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by TedBPhx
    ...But I wonder. Can someone release their inner poet and describe the difference in tone and... feel?
    That would be wonderful!

    Hopefully, someone will try.

  10. #9

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    I have the TMDR. My main reason for the DR over the TR: I wanted something that would fit in the front seat of my Honda Civic. The lightweight was awesome and the attenuating feature was great and useful.

    I'm lucky I guess. I didn't really understand the sound and tonal differences between a DR and TR. Those factors didn't influence my decision.

    I know that from day one I've been totally happy with my TMDR. In trade, I dumped a couple of heavy amps I wasn't using and spent only a $100 cash for the difference. I've used the TMDR at numerous gigs and use it everyday at home. It's my go to daily amp -- and that's saying a lot since I also have a Roland JC-60, an AER Compact Mobile, and a Henriksen Bud. To my ears, the TMDR is just fine for rock, jazz, blues, reggae, and more. Tonight I'll take it out for an acoustic-set of music and see how it works. I suspect it will be just fine.

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by archtopeddy
    I have the TMDR. My main reason for the DR over the TR: I wanted something that would fit in the front seat of my Honda Civic. The lightweight was awesome and the attenuating feature was great and useful.

    I'm lucky I guess. I didn't really understand the sound and tonal differences between a DR and TR. Those factors didn't influence my decision.

    I know that from day one I've been totally happy with my TMDR. In trade, I dumped a couple of heavy amps I wasn't using and spent only a $100 cash for the difference. I've used the TMDR at numerous gigs and use it everyday at home. It's my go to daily amp -- and that's saying a lot since I also have a Roland JC-60, an AER Compact Mobile, and a Henriksen Bud. To my ears, the TMDR is just fine for rock, jazz, blues, reggae, and more. Tonight I'll take it out for an acoustic-set of music and see how it works. I suspect it will be just fine.
    Truth spoken. My TMTR is my default amp for most daily practice and playing. The output power selector is a wonderful feature and the line out with its own level knob makes recording from it so drama-free. These are truly "working" amps.

  12. #11

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    Let me jump in here, from FAR- left field, disregard if you like.

    Without ever trying a Tone-Master, I watch these threads. Professionally, I play in a Blues/rock group, in smaller venues (bars), at home , it's jazz and blues-jazz.

    My Princeton Reverbs, original and Rivera II, are too loud for my gigs. I have owned 3 or 4 Twin Reverbs in my days of gigging the big rooms, and just recently sold my Fender Concert of 60 watts with 2 -10's, because it was TOO loud. Seriously Twin Reverb loud!

    Hard for me to understand why anyone needs a Twin, unless you are playing LARGe rooms, and if you are, my hat's off to you. I would go for the DR. And, I would love to see a DR with 2-10's. Maybe Leo had it right when the Vibrolux Reverb came about - and how many players have pined for the VR to be re-issued in it's BF form? I'll bet most would have a vintage VR if they were affordable. I would. ToneMaster is a great start, but the VR should be the next TM

  13. #12

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    Hi Jimmy Mack. A TMVR would be very cool, but I suspect that the next TM might be a TM Princeton. There's been a bit of talk about that on some of the other sites. And, it would give Fender a third, smaller size TM. While many would say that a Princeton is already pretty light weight, I'd imagine a 12 pound Princeton with the output power selector and line outs and level knob would be an attractive item. Just my thoughts...

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray175
    Channel 1 has neither reverb nor tremolo, so jumping channels not only allows to bypass the bright cap, but also to be able to use reverb when the guitar is plugged into channel 1 and “jumped” to channel 2. I prefer the jumped Channel 1 sound for jazz and pop, but pure Channel 2 for blues and rock.
    Aren't the channels on the Blackface amps out of phase?

  15. #14

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    Just a quick update on yesterday's gig with the TMDR: I used a 40's laminated Harmony archtop with a $20 Chinese floating Johnny Smith pickup and it all went great! The guitar has it's own woody and unique tone. People always comment positively about it -- especially other guitar players.

    I set the output power selector to 5w. It had plenty of headroom for the gig (restaurant-size bar and meeting room; band included two guitars, bass and drums). I also took a page from Jonathan Stout's book about using a clean boost and used my Grace Design "Bix" instrument preamp for quick volume adjustments between solos and rhythm. I didn't use any other pedals.

    I've used the amp now with Teles, Strats, Ibanez Roadstar, vintage '59 Airline Town and Country, 30's Gibson ES-150CC, etc., etc.; every time I've been happy with the sound. It's a Fender sound. Sometimes I may want a different sound; in that case, I'll use a different amp. But overall, it's a great jack-of-all trades Fender-sounding amp.

    BTW, I also bought a thick-padded TUKI cover for it. It has the velcro flap on the bottom and fits the amp snug as a bug. I figure as much as I plan to use this amp, I'll be knocking it around a bit so a good padded cover was in order. (If you wish to get one, you need to order one for the TMDR not the regular DR. There is a slightly difference in size).

  16. #15

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    Thanks again to everyone for the very helpful comments.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175
    Aren't the channels on the Blackface amps out of phase?
    Tube Blackface amps indeed have their channels out of phase, and a jumpered non reverb tube Deluxe produces a stronger overdrive in my experience.

    Whether the solid state circuitry of the ToneMasters follow a similar logic, I have no idea - I don't have the technical knowedge or understanding to check that out. What I can say is that jumpering my TMDR clearly gives me channel 1 sound plus reverb and tremelo.

    Interesting post on this subject here

  18. #17

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    I would buy a TM Princeton Reverb the moment it’s released - I really hope it’s coming.

    I’ve played a SFPR for a long time and am in the market for a subway-friendly amp. Some good options like the forthcoming ZT Lunchbox Reverb, but I’d much rather have a PR. Plus a PR has much better tremolo than a DR, IMO.

    I suspect Fender would sell a ton of them.

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by GregoryL
    I would buy a TM Princeton Reverb the moment it’s released - I really hope it’s coming.

    I’ve played a SFPR for a long time and am in the market for a subway-friendly amp. Some good options like the forthcoming ZT Lunchbox Reverb, but I’d much rather have a PR. Plus a PR has much better tremolo than a DR, IMO.

    I suspect Fender would sell a ton of them.
    I expect you're right many because of product placement. The Twin Reverb sits at the top of the power hierarchy with the 2x12 and 85 watts of seismic clean. Then the Deluxe Reverb comes in at a moderate power 22w and 1x12, with a distinctive clean and driven tone signature. The Princeton would nicely fill in the lower end of the line, 1x10", 12-15 watts, and it's own distinctive tone yet again. These 3 would be a powerful lineup. I have the Princeton Reverb Reissue and while it's not unduly heavy, the same performance in a package 1/3 to 1/2 lighter would really catch fire.

    Much as some of the others like the Vibrolux Reverb or Band Master make sense, my hunch (all it is, just a hunch) is the symmetry and cleary produce placement of TR/DR/PR would be the likely plan.

    But who knows... I"m still pondering whether to sell off some stuff to get a Tone Master Deluxe Reverb... not that I need it, but since when has this really been about NEED??

  20. #19

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    If this TM thing really takes off.... IF! A PR seems like a given, and so does the VR. 1 10" spkr,
    2-10's, 1 12", 2- 12's. Don't forget the Tweeds! Bassmen, Deluxes, Supers, Harvards.
    Time will tell

  21. #20

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    The last non tube amp I tried was 45 yrs ago and we know what they were like back then.

    As I grow weary of chasing bad tubes etc the idea of trying one of these seems interesting.

    I would love to see a comparison of the TM amps with Fender's Mustangs. They just introduced a new line of Mustangs at NAMM. I'd be curious to see how close the Mustangs, with their extra bells and whistles, would come to a TM.

    https://www.fender.com/articles/gear...the-namm-floor

  22. #21

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    The Jensen NAMM booth had both TMDR and TMTR. The DR received all the attention and was the most tested amp. Despite sound-proofing, there was too much background noise for proper A/B listening, but to me the DR sounded just great. The Jensen guys have worked hard to make the new N 12 K Neo sound as authentic as possible. It will be available as a replacement speaker during Q1. Of course, most of the testing was with distortion, but haven't Fender's SS cleans always been ok?