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  1. #151

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    No, and they never did. Gibson is a company that sales their guitars B2B. Their dealers are listed on the site, as they have been for years. If one really wishes to find out - as opposed to tire kick - one should call Wildwood Guitars. Ask for Troy.

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  3. #152

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzstdnt View Post
    No. The fact is that he did not say that.
    That is what I was saying.

    I've read some of your other posts; have you been taking your medication ?

  4. #153

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    Quote Originally Posted by va3ux View Post
    That is what I was saying.

    I've read some of your other posts; have you been taking your medication ?
    I was hoping post no. 123 "A few final thoughts ".....would have indeed been the end of the ongoing contentious responses from this individual........but unfortunately it continues.

    Sent from my GT-N5110 using Tapatalk

  5. #154

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    As you can see with this new breed of disrespectful members, us long time members rarely post anymore.

  6. #155

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    As you can see with this new breed of disrespectful members, us long time members rarely post anymore.
    Social media combined with the shield of the Internet provides a platform for the rude. And when it comes to politics or the subject of Gibson guitars, sparks will fly.

    Whenever an old thread is brought back from the dead, I see posts by many posters who are no longer present. I guess a social media platform like this one is as temporary as life itself for us all.

    Having strong convictions and debating well in a gentlemanly fashion is admirable. Being rude is shameful.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  7. #156

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    Unfortunately as stated the edit button is not used enough.And I am definitely guilty of this as well. But sometimes we need to let harsh comments go from other members,and just move on.
    Remember we're passionate about our instruments as well as our taste in music. And that's a really good thing! Especially in the Sea of Bad Music out there,lol!

  8. #157

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    As you can see with this new breed of disrespectful members, us long time members rarely post anymore.
    Hi Vinny, you can post anytime as far as I'm concerned.

    I agree there are some young pups who don't play by the rules. There were also some members in years past (no names) who could chew you a new one for a perceived transgression. Sometimes their excuse was "I was off my meds", sometimes it was just "I know more about this than you do." My take is that some people just need a little internet vacation from time to time.

    C'est la vie. The web ain't for sissies.

    I agree with Stringswinger: "Having strong convictions and debating well in a gentlemanly fashion is admirable. Being rude is shameful."
    “Without music, life would be a mistake”--Friedrich Nietzsche

    Current lineup: Gibson ES-135 ('02), Peerless Sunset, Harmony Brilliant Cutaway ('64), Godin 5th Avenue, Alvarez AC60 A/E classical, Kay K37 ('56), Fender Squier VM Jazz bass, several ukes. Amps: Fishman Artist, Fender SCXD, Pignose 7-100.

  9. #158

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    As you can see with this new breed of disrespectful members, us long time members rarely post anymore.
    Which is a loss deeply felt by many of us. I try to ignore the distasteful stuff and appreciate all the more the well-reasoned, respectful posts of the grown-ups.

    JGO and its membership remains the single best source of jazz guitar information, lore, and appreciation on the planet.
    Best regards, k

  10. #159

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    There's a bunch of folks that were really valuable here and they're gone.
    I'm not sure if it was because of a lot of these aggressive posts or other circumstances but it's disappointing.
    Like where's Monk been? That guy always had meaningful posts.
    That said, there's still a good amount of long timers lurking and every once in awhile some newer cats pop up w good points.
    This place is an excellent resource as citizenk pointed out (one of those respected longtimers along w those cats that have already liked this thread)
    Carry on gents....(and ladies of course, we still have a few here)

  11. #160

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    Quote Originally Posted by va3ux View Post
    That is what I was saying.

    I've read some of your other posts; have you been taking your medication ?
    Well that's interesting. You quoted my response to someone else, not you, who stated a manipulative, complete misrepresentation of what you said, and I simply corrected the record by stating a fact. That's pretty dry.

    My earlier response to your post was a bit harsh so I apologize for being so direct with you about your point. To be clear, your claim was completely false, and not backed up by any shred of evidence, or even simple observation. Honestly, it seems clear that it was just something that you wanted to sling against the wall on the internet to see if it would stick. It didn't, and it doesn't.

    You stated that the 40s and 50s are gone. Yes, that's obvious. Then you stated that archtops may have been profitable then but not now, and makers may face market doom, etc.

    Here's the truth - a simple observation reveals that there are more archtops being made and sold on earth now than there were in 1940, 1950, 1960, 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000, etc. They are being made by companies like Eastman at the bottom, Gibson in the middle (every day), and true custom luthiers like Benedetto, Monteleone, Buscarino, Manzer and others at the top. (See the thread regarding the festival in Denver last month). These companies have been at it a while and are continuing. Some are more successful than others, and they will come and go, just like any other industry. I already pointed out that "profit" for them is not the same as profit for the iPhone - but it's still profit. You said it wasn't.

    I worked in a music store in the early 80s and we sold Gibson archtops, Guilds too, as well as Martins, Ramirez classicals, and lots of lower priced guitars too, of course. Archtops were not a volume product for Gibson relative to their other offerings at that time, and that hasn't changed since.

    I'll admit this much. I'm not a fan of Gibson bashing and never have been. I love to take Gibson bashing to task, I freely admit it. I worked and bought my own ES-335 when I was 16. When I was 21 I bought a brand spanking new L5 with my own hard earned money. Was it cheap? No. Was it affordable? Apparently so. Back then (1979) I heard people whining about their prices. "Poor me" whining victims. The truth is that most of the people I've met who complain about them could afford them - if it were a priority - but it wasn't/isn't. They buy a house, they buy a car, they go on vacations, they buy all kinds of material things. So it's really just their choice. Yet they feel compelled to bitch and moan about it...

    In more recent times "Henry haters" have gleefully licked their chops while watching Gibson move towards bankruptcy. Others have been saddened, others just mocked it all. People have imagined that the guitar company was failing - it wasn't (it was the "lifestyle" electronic junk). People have imagined that archtops are cancelled - they aren't.

    So, you made a statement - archtops aren't profitable. The context was Gibson, and that is clearly false. They are making them on special order basis, every day, and with firm pricing. This is a point of debate, it's not personal, at least not with me. So do you wish to support your claim, or do you concede that it was just something to say off the cuff in cyberspace, without much reflection or observation?
    Last edited by Jazzstdnt; 10-14-2019 at 01:11 AM.

  12. #161

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    Look at you, flexing your paragraph breaks.

  13. #162

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    Old timer: 2014
    New breed: 2017
    Internet is a funny place.

  14. #163

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175 View Post
    Old timer: 2014 New breed: 2017 Internet is a funny place.
    I'm probably at least half the age of 90% of the userbase here, but I'll enjoy the "oldtimer" moniker... :P

  15. #164

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    Stringswinger and others are correct. The folks who used to post regularly eight or nine years ago seldom do anymore. Their replacements are, by and large, a younger crowd. Etiquette seems to follow the tendencies of most web "generational" turnovers. Things seem to get more brusque as the under-hmm-60 crowd settles in.This seems perfectly natural, to me. I'm not put out in the least, though I do miss the regular musings of some of the folks who used to check in regularly.If you've been with the World Wide Web from the beginning, you've seen this happen on all kinds of boards and forums. To quote the Ruttles, "life goes on, whether or not there's a reason, life goes on, enter a change of season."

  16. #165

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    I always liked the bar / tavern / pub analogies with forums......If you're out of line, then so advised, and continue acting like that, you're asked to leave / escorted / shown the door. And you don't get back until you talk to the Boss.......Why not, with no allowances made or considerations given for an offender's age ?

    Maybe once in their lives, everyone should be required to have / keep a job where they have to wait on the public. Then I'm betting there'd be less ' aggressive ' behavior.

    Just MHO

  17. #166

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    Back to Gibson
    Attached Images Attached Images What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-c29d2d2e-4abf-4eed-ad48-f23b5739c466-jpg What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-c7c2ec5e-b349-4f2d-a7c1-50f09c6864f3-jpg What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-d5e9f48a-99aa-4c08-ad7c-ef09b9fd66e3-jpg 

  18. #167

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    What a beautiful guitar! What's the model again?

  19. #168

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    As you all know I dislike 2 pu archtops. I had Culberson build me that Crimson shop ES175 above. I inquired recently about making me a reissue 1948 ES350 but the price was $9K. If you have the cash Gibson will make you anything you want.

  20. #169

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    As you all know I dislike 2 pu archtops. I had Culberson build me that Crimson shop ES175 above. I inquired recently about making me a reissue 1948 ES350 but the price was $9K. If you have the cash Gibson will make you anything you want.
    And that is probably a pretty good business model for Gibson archtops at the moment. Building them for spec in a flooded market serves no proper business interest. Making them as a one-off, while expensive, provides both profit and a new iconic Gibson (or a new customized Gibson) to those who can pay the price of admission.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  21. #170

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    If I had the cash, I think I'd love to custom-order a 1-(routed) pickup version of the L4c with all the trimmings. That would be a stunner of a guitar.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  22. #171

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    As you all know I dislike 2 pu archtops. I had Culberson build me that Crimson shop ES175 above. I inquired recently about making me a reissue 1948 ES350 but the price was $9K. If you have the cash Gibson will make you anything you want.
    Vinny, between your two beautiful Gibsons (ES175 and avatar Tal Farlow), which do you prefer?

    This one makes my knees weak!


  23. #172

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    I would love a single pickup L4c too. But the problem with the custom orders is that you pay first and you're stuck with it no matter how the guitar turns out. You can decide on the physical features in advance but the tone will be an unknown. Too bright. Not acoustic enough. Too acoustic.
    I wish there were L4 stores you could go and try a whole bunch. Now that's a profitable business idea! L4 store chain.

  24. #173

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175 View Post
    I would love a single pickup L4c too. But the problem with the custom orders is that you pay first and you're stuck with it no matter how the guitar turns out. You can decide on the physical features in advance but the tone will be an unknown. Too bright. Not acoustic enough. Too acoustic.
    I wish there were L4 stores you could go and try a whole bunch. Now that's a profitable business idea! L4 store chain.
    For me that's what's lovely about "electric." Assuming the guitar is well built according to specs-solid spruce top, solid mahogany back/sides, mahogany neck, MHS or Classic 57 pickup... I imagine I can dial in the tone on my amp. You're not as locked in when you are not bound to the acoustic tone of the guitar.

    But alas, this requires money, and I'm tapped out due to another recent acquisition.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  25. #174

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tal_175 View Post
    I would love a single pickup L4c too. But the problem with the custom orders is that you pay first and you're stuck with it no matter how the guitar turns out. You can decide on the physical features in advance but the tone will be an unknown. Too bright. Not acoustic enough. Too acoustic.
    I wish there were L4 stores you could go and try a whole bunch. Now that's a profitable business idea! L4 store chain.
    Yep, a custom guitar is a huge gamble. Not only do you not know how it will sound and feel, but you are guaranteed a monetary loss if you decide to sell in almost all cases.

    If I buy a guitar sight unseen, it has to be at a price good enough to insure that my "Demo fee" is not a waste of scarce resources.

    My experience with single PUP vs Double PUP electric archtops (built in PUPS) is that the guitars with single Pups tend to be a bit more "acoustic" and a bit brighter. They lack the tonal variety of a two PUP model, but have fewer rattles. Joe Pass had a one PUP custom 175 at the end of his career that sounded great, but the PUP was in L-4 position, the body slimmed and let's face it, Joe Pass could sound better than any of us playing a Squier Strat, then we would playing a vintage D'angelico New Yorker.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  26. #175

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    My experience with single PUP vs Double PUP electric archtops (built in PUPS) is that the guitars with single Pups tend to be a bit more "acoustic" and a bit brighter.
    True. And that's exactly the reason that some prefer the ES 175 with 2 pups. They tend to sound a bit darker/warmer.

    DB

  27. #176

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    I like my Tal's the best though 2 pu I wish they were single. I never use the bridge pu ever.
    Attached Images Attached Images What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-a5331fca-a216-484a-a876-94dd9a4f928a-jpg What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-6908cab8-afe3-49aa-bddc-0814a63516a0-jpg 
    Last edited by vinnyv1k; 10-14-2019 at 03:37 PM.

  28. #177

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    I am not familar with gibson's other holdings, As I am of Fender Musical Instraments, But I am shure that they could Build only top shelf guitars and leave the other lower quality guitars to thier other guitar builders/ over sea's holdings.

  29. #178

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    Dennis D is correct--if you work waiting on people you learn to be much less aggressive with them. You don't miss much about their behavior, though.

  30. #179

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    I like my Tal’s the best though 2 pu I wish they were single. I never use the bridge pu ever.
    I wonder if the custom shop would build you a Tal with only 1 pickup? Now that would be a unique instrument! Unless the bridge pickup has some unknown impact in creating the distinctive tone that the Tal's seem to have.
    - Lawson
    "Whenever you come near the human race, there's layers and layers of nonsense." - Thornton Wilder, Our Town

  31. #180

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    I like my Tal’s the best though 2 pu I wish they were single. I never use the bridge pu ever.
    I never use the bridge pup on my Tal either but I am convinced that it contributes to the way it sounds. I'm not sure a Tal with only one pup would sound better. I prefer the 175 with 2 pups too. Never use it on my 175 either but it makes the 175 sound the way it should sound IMHO.

    DB

  32. #181

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    Quote Originally Posted by DB's Jazz Guitar Blog View Post
    I never use the bridge pup on my Tal either but I am convinced that it contributes to the way it sounds. I'm not sure a Tal with only one pup would sound better. I prefer the 175 with 2 pups too. Never use it on my 175 either but it makes the 175 sound the way it should sound IMHO.

    DB
    I had a single PUP 175 and did not like it. All three of my 175's (my main gigging guitars) are two Pickup models. I also prefer the tone of my L-5CES to my L-5 WESMO. I too am convinced that the second PUP contributes to a warmer/darker and fatter sound. Plus in a dark room, blending the bridge PUP in, can be a big help.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  33. #182

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    To each his own. I've owned countless 2 pu 175's and other archtops as well. My single pu 175 is the best I have ever owned. I have also owned 2 L5CES guitars that were great but heavy. My favorite guitar is my Wesmo's and I love a dark sound also which I can easily achieve with my tone knob and my Henriksen 312. I also don't like the cluttered look with all the knobs and toggle that I never use. I like simple. Nothing wrong with loving 2 or 1 pu archtops. No wrong choice just a personal one. Just like floaters. Some guys love them which is great. I like a set in humbucker. A archtop with Gibson on the headstock is most likely going to sound pretty darn good.

  34. #183

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    The best 175 type guitar I've played recently (I'm looking for a single pup 175 in Europe btw) is an acoustic 165 of second generation. All electronic was removed and it sounds better than my carved guitars. I hesitate to buy it and put a single Mccarty on it.Do someone know if it fils the 165 ?Sorry if I'm off-topic.

  35. #184

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    Lawson I checked into a single pu Tal Farlow. It was a $2k upcharge. Typical Gibson. I got lucky with the single pu 175. Only a $500.00 upcharge but well worth it being Crimson made instead of Memphis. Hutch or Culberson on the label is significant when it comes to fit and finish.

  36. #185

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    $2000 for not cutting holes for an extra pu, switch and knobs?
    they should offer it @ a discount!


  37. #186

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    Quote Originally Posted by wintermoon View Post
    $2000 for not cutting holes for an extra pu, switch and knobs?they should offer it @ a discount!
    That's Gibson
    Last edited by vinnyv1k; 10-14-2019 at 06:47 PM.

  38. #187

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    Here is something else that makes no sense with Gibson. The huge upcharge for natural finish. A sunburst finish is way more labor intensive and requires very skilled binding scrapers. Yes Gibson claims to use the finest figured woods for Blondes but I have some VSB's that have as nice or nicer figured wood than my Blondes. Currently for carved, a Blonde is a $2K upcharge. About 10 years ago I asked Culberson about this and he said when they do natural nothing in the booth can have any color only Blondes and they must make sure the booth is completely dust free. I still say VSB is way more work. Campellone would much rather do a Blonde then VSB I am sure and no upcharge.

  39. #188

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    When I learned that Gibson had halted production of the 175, I started looking for an alternative. I found this used Eastman 371 a few weeks ago for a fraction of the price of an Epiphone ES175. I am very happy with it.

  40. #189

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    Gibson has always had an upcharge for blonde.
    When they started offering natural finishes in the late 30s a sunburst Super 400 was, $400, natural $410
    In 1960 it was $650 sunburst, $675 for natural.
    Of course that's a small amount compared to the 2K upcharge today.
    One thing to consider is the fit of the neck to body joint has to be very clean on a blonde, not so much on sunburst.

  41. #190

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    Vinny,That's a great single-pu ES-175. They were always my favorite.

  42. #191

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    Quote Originally Posted by grandstick01 View Post


    When I learned that Gibson had halted production of the 175, I started looking for an alternative. I found this used Eastman 371 a few weeks ago for a fraction of the price of an Epiphone ES175. I am very happy with it.

    Well I think the Epi listed for about $800, and was usually available for a bit less than that. If you got it for a fraction of that price, that would be a good deal indeed.

    That is a sweet-looking guitar, by the way.
    “Without music, life would be a mistake”--Friedrich Nietzsche

    Current lineup: Gibson ES-135 ('02), Peerless Sunset, Harmony Brilliant Cutaway ('64), Godin 5th Avenue, Alvarez AC60 A/E classical, Kay K37 ('56), Fender Squier VM Jazz bass, several ukes. Amps: Fishman Artist, Fender SCXD, Pignose 7-100.

  43. #192

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    What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-img_0681-jpgWhat’s Going On Now at Gibson?-img_0674-jpgWhat’s Going On Now at Gibson?-img_0683-jpg
    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    Here is something else that makes no sense with Gibson. The huge upcharge for natural finish. A sunburst finish is way more labor intensive and requires very skilled binding scrapers. Yes Gibson claims to use the finest figured woods for Blondes but I have some VSB's that have as nice or nicer figured wood than my Blondes. Currently for carved, a Blonde is a $2K upcharge. About 10 years ago I asked Culberson about this and he said when they do natural nothing in the booth can have any color only Blondes and they must make sure the booth is completely dust free. I still say VSB is way more work. Campellone would much rather do a Blonde then VSB I am sure and no upcharge.
    Yep, I agree. I have seen this "figuring superiority" thing cut two ways. There have been some naturals that made me say "huh"? And there have been some sunburst samples that made me say "wow!". But on average...
    Attached Images Attached Images What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-img_0682-jpg What’s Going On Now at Gibson?-img_0677-jpg 
    Last edited by Jazzstdnt; 10-15-2019 at 12:52 AM.

  44. #193

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    Here is something else that makes no sense with Gibson. The huge upcharge for natural finish. A sunburst finish is way more labor intensive and requires very skilled binding scrapers. Yes Gibson claims to use the finest figured woods for Blondes but I have some VSB's that have as nice or nicer figured wood than my Blondes. Currently for carved, a Blonde is a $2K upcharge. About 10 years ago I asked Culberson about this and he said when they do natural nothing in the booth can have any color only Blondes and they must make sure the booth is completely dust free. I still say VSB is way more work. Campellone would much rather do a Blonde then VSB I am sure and no upcharge.
    The Gibson archtops that I have seen that were built pre-1970 informs me that the best woods were saved for the Blondes, hence the upcharge. In the 70's all the archtops had plain woods so the upcharge made no sense, but at least it was a small upcharge. By the mid 80's the better woods were used for both the Bursts and the Blondes, so there should be no upcharge, particularly the large upcharge they have been charging in recent decades. They do it because they can.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  45. #194

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    Quote Originally Posted by wintermoon View Post
    $2000 for not cutting holes for an extra pu, switch and knobs?
    they should offer it @ a discount!


    Check out deleting anything on a Porsche, or check out their ' RS ' models...' delete factory a/c, power seats & windows, radio, ' - 400 # weight savings - - usually upcharge, or maybe close to even money............

    ..but hey, ' if ya gotta ask, maybe you're not a Porsche buyer '.....
    Last edited by Dennis D; 10-15-2019 at 09:50 AM.

  46. #195

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    Yeah, it may be a matter of these things being modifications to a "template" in a manufacturing line. Gibson has had a lot of models, and it seems to me (from a distance) that any "one-offs" are best conceived by them, at least price wise.

    In that sense they aren't really "custom" or truly bespoke. (bespoke - "the man spoke, and the tailor listened").

    There are luthiers who are true "custom" guitar makers, but we know the financial implications of that. (Just like with a custom tailor. )

  47. #196

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    And having gone through my employer's bankruptcy and reorganization, the new guys come in and basically say, among other things :
    " Are we sure we know what our costs are ? "...." We probably know what our costs aren't, because if these old costs worked, then the previous owners wouldn't have gotten into trouble."

    Just my two cents.....
    Last edited by Dennis D; 10-15-2019 at 01:36 PM.

  48. #197

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    Well the previous owner had a successful guitar business, but got into trouble with diversification of product lines. Henry wanted to diversify Gibson into a "lifestyle brand" with electronic gadgets. That where things went south.

    The guitar division had annual sales of $1Billion. A guitar company should be able to make a go of things with that level of revenue, especially considering that some of it was/is built using Asian labor.

    OTOH - that doesn't mean that the guitar business was optimized, few businesses are.

  49. #198

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzstdnt View Post
    Well the previous owner had a successful guitar business, but got into trouble with diversification of product lines. Henry wanted to diversify Gibson into a "lifestyle brand" with electronic gadgets. That where things went south.

    The guitar division had annual sales of $1Billion. A guitar company should be able to make a go of things with that level of revenue, especially considering that some of it was/is built using Asian labor.

    OTOH - that doesn't mean that the guitar business was optimized, few businesses are.
    I'm not sure where you're getting that $1 billion dollar sales number for their guitar business. I'm looking on-line and I see $122 Million for 2017.

    Gibson guitar maker files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection

    Here's the actual quote from the article regarding revenue from guitar sales.

    "Gibson’s guitar business has actually been on the uptick, according to the bankruptcy filings, rising 10.5% from January 2017 — $110 million to $122 million during the same 12-month period."

    MORE: In fact, according to the Washington Post, the entire guitar market worldwide for all manufacturers for 2017 was only $1.3 Billion

    https://www.digitalmusicnews.com/wp-..._2017_full.jpg
    Last edited by Jim Soloway; 10-15-2019 at 02:08 PM.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  50. #199

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Soloway View Post
    I'm not sure where you're getting that $1 billion dollar sales number for their guitar business. I'm looking on-line and I see $122 Million for 2017.

    Gibson guitar maker files for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection

    Here's the actual quote from the article regarding revenue from guitar sales.

    "Gibson’s guitar business has actually been on the uptick, according to the bankruptcy filings, rising 10.5% from January 2017 — $110 million to $122 million during the same 12-month period."
    Having been in business (3 restaurants and one night club) in the 1980's and having practiced law and represented many closely held businesses in the 1990's, I learned that high sales figures in no way indicates high profits, and can actually hide the fact that a company is operating at a loss. If it cost Gibson 125 million to do that 122 million in sales, the guitar business may not have been so wonderful.

    I would presume that the new owners/bankers either found the guitar division to be profitable, or think that it can be made profitable, otherwise we would have seen a Chapter 7 end to the Company. In today's global economy, manufacturing things in America is expensive. I suspect that the reluctant new owners of Gibson are wishing they had never funded Henry J.'s foolhardy expansion into industries that were beyond his competence.
    _____________________________________________
    "When the chord changes, you should change" Joe Pass

  51. #200

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnyv1k View Post
    Here is something else that makes no sense with Gibson. The huge upcharge for natural finish. A sunburst finish is way more labor intensive and requires very skilled binding scrapers. Yes Gibson claims to use the finest figured woods for Blondes but I have some VSB's that have as nice or nicer figured wood than my Blondes. Currently for carved, a Blonde is a $2K upcharge. About 10 years ago I asked Culberson about this and he said when they do natural nothing in the booth can have any color only Blondes and they must make sure the booth is completely dust free. I still say VSB is way more work. Campellone would much rather do a Blonde then VSB I am sure and no upcharge.

    My Gosh Vinny spoken like a real pro...….A Sunburst finish is by far more complicated and the only reason to upcharge a blond is because you might pay more for it have better figured wood. In fact Bill Barker and Bill Hollenbeck sort of liked sunburst finishes because they allow the maker to put the final flourishing mark on the guitar. I have said this many times before than finishing a guitar in nitro is an art in-and-of-itself. Making and carving a guitar are one aspect but the finish is another animal indeed. Requires to me the most experience to pull it off well. Many attempts need to be done and practice to do a great nitro finish. Finishing it the one part of guitar repair that I can do but have not for awhile. I really could make a better mark if I would get at it again but I have enough work just doing other regular stuff.

    Right now if I had a request for someone to have there guitar refinished and they wanted the guitar blond...……...I am all in that is pretty basic and straightforward. If you need me to match a sunburst for a 1955 Gibson L5...……...I would do it but I sure would need to go through a high re-learning curve to get a sunburst match. I also would lose money doing if for awhile given the time I would need to get up to speed. I tell you I like a nice sunburst now better than I did 25 years ago when blonds were the king.

    Vinny your Gibson are fantastic my I am impressed in fact I believe I may be in the midst of a NGD. Going to pick one up tomorrow...…….
    specializing in repair and setup, does your guitar play like it should?