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looks like urethane (foam) glue and brad nails. Maybe a top repair?
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09-07-2019 03:18 PM
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Are there actually staples in there or is it just kerfs cut in the brace to make it conform to the top profile a little easier? Can't think of any reason to have staples going that direction in the brace. I can see kerfing it a little though just like the kerfed lining around the edges. Looks kind of like Gorilla glue that tends to foam like that little.
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Wouldn’t the top or back have to have come off to do that?
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I think previous poster was right. Those are just kerfs but the top appears to have been re-glued with gorilla (foam) glue
Originally Posted by Woody Sound
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Looks like the caps got replaced too.
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What year 175 is it?I had a 1975 Es-175 and it was very poorly constructed. I guess to save time on carving the braces to shape the top they made 'braces' using 2 thing slats with blocks glued between with gaps to allow them to bend the 'braces' to the top. Result: By the time I got it in the late 80s the top was caving in. Shameful!
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it's a '68
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all electronics were replaced. Seller specified that in front. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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That is something I have never seen on a 175 and taking the top off is the only way you could do it on a repair. I doubt that is the case as taking the top off is a major surgery. I am completely lost expect if it is a 68 I would be concern about the neck width. Some of those were getting narrow like 1 9/16 and I cannot do those even 10/16 is not much better.
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There's a sophisticated, successful repair technique to reglue detached tonebars from the outside directly through the top, i.e. without taking off the top or back, by using a very thin steel wire (like the high E string). Correctly done, you can barely spot it from the outside. It looks though like a rougher technique was used here.
As a side note, the grain line orientation of this spruce brace doesn't show the wood cut that good luthiers prefer. Maybe, or maybe not, the reason for the underlying problem …
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everyone in the forums always makes such a big deal about the 1 9/16 nut width but it's a total non issue for me. I have no problem going between my 25.5 / 1 11/16 guitars and this 24.75 1 9/16 guitar. I think often times, people make such a big deal about scale length and nut width but it's never really hampered me. I actually prefer the thinner width to the 1.75 and wider that has become popular in these forums...YMMV Originally Posted by deacon Mark
Unfortunately, the guitar just doesn't sound good.
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Jack, you are a lucky man if the 1 9/16 nut works for you. I am OK with a nut anywhere from 1 5/8 up to 1 3/4. Anything outside those numbers hampers my playing (My wide nut Thames classical sounds great, but gets played less and less. Perhaps I should find one with a 1 3/4 nut?). Same with scale length. 24 3/4 up to 25 1/2 works for me, anything outside those numbers hampers my playing (my 26 1/4 scale Gypsy guitar sounds great, but I only use her when it is required for the gig. Perhaps I should find another one with a 25 1/2 scale length?). I have owned two Gibsons with the 1 9/16 nut, a 1968 ES-335 and a 1967 ES-175. Neither guitar worked for me. I was sad when I sold both of them. It was like breaking up with a beautiful girl that I could not get along with. Originally Posted by jzucker
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I wonder if the thinner neck of this contributed to the lack-luster tone. It seems like the bigger neck guitars have a fatter sound whether it's an archtop or solidbody. It's one reason I sold my kiesel headless guitar. I never felt that it had the fullness of my strat or tele and I'm thinking that the extra mass of the headstock actually contributes something... Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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I think it all adds up. While I am not a fan of thick necked guitars, I have noticed that they often sound great. Perhaps there is a reason the 59 neck profile is so popular..... Originally Posted by jzucker
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24.75" vs 25.5" Scale length doesn't matter to me (I have both plus one in between), but nut width does. I had two different 9/16-nut guitars, both for many years. I always found it harder to finger chords and hybrid pick/finger pick on these than on others I owned or tried, but wasn't aware of nut width as a dimension that influenced this. Originally Posted by jzucker
Then at some point I took a bunch of measurements and discovered that 11/16 is good for me, but less is not. Figured this out by real-world experience, not forums. Some people do that.
John
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There's a reason Gibson came to their senses in '69.
People were complaining about those pencil necks and they've been back to 1 11/16" since.
They didn't randomly pick that width, it's what works best for the majority of people.
That said Kenny Burrell has huge hands and plays a narrow nut Super 400
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Jack you are different than me considerably in neck preference. I can deal with different scale lengths pretty well no issues. A 25.5, 25, 24.75 all fine maybe not the Birdland 23.5, but like SS I need some width. Originally Posted by jzucker
My hands are pretty large and left hand stretched from years if playing Johnny Smith chords. No I no JS for sure but my hand messures 8 1/4 inches from wrist to tip of finger. I don’t have fat fingers but wow I need 1 11/16 best in 1 3/4.
Also you may well have a great point about sound and the neck. Neck does influence the sound much and I never thought of it in terms of width.
We like to talk about carved tops guitars and sound but funny, all the it iterations of the 175 can be just as amazing. Some have the real smoking sound and hard to at times quantify.
Someone ought to put on a 175 guitar show. Everyone who brings in a 175 gets in free if we could line them all up and play. Put out some classic amps and.........oh wait reality I am dreaming.
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Oops, I thought this thread was about kerfed bracing and urethane glue repair, not about nut width. I've had an ES-175 with a loose brace. It was sent back to the factory. My current -59 VOS has kerfed bracing. It's said to be period perfect. Not being a luthier, I would imagine that it's possible to dose glue to the braces with a syringe and an injection needle, with silicone tubing between the two. PU glue is forgiving in that it expands and fills voids. If the guitar is a 175D, one can use one PU opening for an endoscope and the other for steering the needle into the right place. Luthiers, please confirm or correct. The repair revealed by the OP looks crude indeed. Not much help structurally but enough to stop a buzz.
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