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Mine is a 93, with 490 pair of pups, it sure is a tone machine. Curiously other gits I have and have had with the 490's in them didn't sound nearly as good. I can't think of a single cut semi from Gibson that has done well with players, it seems as if a DC in a semi and a single cut in fully hollow are THE paradigm that players expect from Gibson and most other makers.
The of the very few exceptions, the D'Angelico EX-SS and Comins GCS-1 seem to have gained traction and stay in the product lines, for now.
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07-30-2018 11:13 PM
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I almost consider this guitar to be the stopbar version of the EX-SS
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I had a Gibson from around that era with a sticky neck. I've had a Heritage as well like it.
What upset me about the Gibson was that I talked with some at the factory in repairs who said he never heard of such a thing. He also kept telling me it was out of warranty since I bought it used and it was over 10 years old. I had said at the outset that I know this isn't Gibson's problem and that I just wanted advice. It pissed me off each time he'd bring up the warranty issue.
At my request, the guy in charge of alterations and repairs called me a few weeks later. He told me he's been at Gibson for more than 20 years and has never heard of sticky lacquer and suggested refinishing the guitar. I pointed out that most large guitar forums have discussions on this very topic. He remained defensive.
I brought the guitar to Pete Moreno. He recognized it immediately. It required several scrubbings with a solvent and buffings to get it right. His best guess was that someone put a paraffin spray on it. I was able to fix it at home, but it was a stubborn project.
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Mid 2000’s? Sticky goo finish? Never heard of such a thing.
In another direction:
For such a great sounding guitar (small, balsa block, fat PU’s), it is unfortunate the HR III never caught on as a great and very road-worthy robust working guitar.
I can understand why the SG never caught on for Jazz what with the Batman look and the fact that you are required to wear short pants when playing it. Despite that, a thin mahog SG sounds superb with heavy strings.
But the HR III has a great look as well. So no excuse to not bring it to the blues fusion patio gig, or a tuxedo job. I do not recall what the HR III sounded like with the factory plinky strings, but even the modest mass of the T-I JS-112 set really had a voice on the guitar.
Wildcat, I hope this one does it for you. Great guitar design.
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”Impedance” is a VERY interpretive and analog thing, particularly when it comes to high impedance passive guitars.
But I think a majority of players through a majority of amps would find that the PU’s in the HR III want to see a higher impedance to ground than a set of 300K pots provides. Sure the top end loss is minuscule with 300K vs. 500K, but it is noticeable to most in my opinion.
To argue the other side of the coin, Benedetto will install 250K pots is a guitar with a fat (low resonant freq.) PU, yet Jazz happens without incident.
Mine sounded great to me in stock configuration. If I had it back, I would just re-do the finish and keep it. I suppose if the current Cardinal lacquer had been available (or known to me) back then I would have just fixed the goo.
Looking forward to your opinion on the HR III.
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Most of the Humbucker Gibsons in which I changed to 500K pots gave the sonic impression of removing a bedsheet that was covering the amplifier. (Not a towel or heavy blanket, however). On the HR Fusion, it was just an experiment. Having owned the guitar since 1996 and not playing it too much because I was not that into its sound. When replacing the pots, I kept the roll-off caps and original tone caps values. I bought that guitar new, so I try to make the pot change look like it came that way from the factory.
BTW if changing pots on a ES335 is a "8" in difficulty then the HR Fusion III is a "10."
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BTW if changing pots on a ES335 is a "8" in difficulty then the HR Fusion III is a "10."[/QUOTE]
Why? Is it the closeness of the center block to the pot and jack holes?
I have used aquarium pump tubing to go over the stalk of the pots. I put the tubing into the top hole and bring it out of the f hole, more or less, then pull the stem out of the hole.
Heritage thinlines are thinner than Gibsons. The first time I did a harness change it was over an hour and there were copious f-bombs. Now it's about a half hour. The language hasn't changed though.
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Originally Posted by Marty Grass
The hole at the base of the bridge pickup is smaller than in an ES335. Also, the way the harness is looped in there, the harness can get twisted. In the picture the first three items have the strings fed through the holes, but waiting to get those in place before strings for the last two (bridge pickup controls) are fed through. Tubing might work better for this though there may not be enough room in the hole to squeeze a pot with orange-drop cap along side 4 or 5 pieces of tubing.Why? Is it the closeness of the center block to the pot and jack holes?
I have used aquarium pump tubing to go over the stalk of the pots. I put the tubing into the top hole and bring it out of the f hole, more or less, then pull the stem out of the hole.
Heritage thinlines are thinner than Gibsons. The first time I did a harness change it was over an hour and there were copious f-bombs. Now it's about a half hour. The language hasn't changed though.
Both volume controls have a 'bleed' capacitor that can be bent or damaged as the pots get stuffed in the hole.
Also there is added difficult because the distance between the neck controls does not allow one to just bridge them with the tone capacitor leads.
Other options are to make brand new harness with a little extra length on the wires to the pickups and jack. But I wanted to re-use the existing harness for originality purposes.
For documentation purposes, from my notebook, indicating the guitar came with 470pf ceramic bleed capacitor, 300K pots and 0.047 ceramic tone cap.
11/2013 300K volume pots changed to 500K linear. 470pf treble bleed caps maintained. 500K tone pots changed to 500k auido with new orange 0.022 caps. Old 0.047 tone caps removed.Last edited by icr; 07-31-2018 at 02:47 PM.
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This guitar is a dream to hold and play sitting down. Wasn't sure about the 490's pickups as I have never owned them before. Regardless I am very happy with them. The larger upper bout cut sort of bothered me. But with the thicker rim 2 1/4" I think it makes up for any lost in the sound cavity. Yes she is some what bottom heavy. Perhaps from the finger tail piece. But nothing to get upset about.
So this year I own 3 15" lower bout guitars. 2 Gibson ES-275, Vintage burst and red one. Also, the PRS JA-15 guitar. Perhaps another 15" lower bout. But I sold them all. I had been playing the D'Angelico Excel SS. Probably keep it as a backup and the Fusion being my main player.
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Wildcat,
It's good to hear a player update after initial thoughts, give a git a few weeks in hand and opinions can change for the better or worse. I'm a "love the one you're with" player but I really like playing the EX-SS and HRF when I do, and whatever they have that bothers others just doesn't register on my radar screen.
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HAH! It was not my eyes deceiving me! Originally Posted by ptchristopher3
I have looked at photos of the HR Fusion and thought "am I nuts or is the centerline of the strings not in the middle of the guitar?" There is one for sale locally on Craigslist off and on, the photos of that make it pretty obvious, but it seemed odd and I assumed it was the angle of the guitar to the camera. There is a logic to the asymmetry, though, which is that it would raise the position of the strings when playing seated, helpful with a smaller bodied guitar (at least for me at 6'3" as playing smaller guitars seated without a strap causes me back pain).
The sound of those guitars is amazing, not a bad tone in 'em. Yes, the center block is balsa- technically a hardwood but it lends a nice sound. HR was a guitar tinkerer and knew a lot about how they work; I don't know how much input he had into the design and construction, but he at least had to approve the final product.
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I always wonder about products that are associated with and endorsed by players and how much input they have on the design and implementation of ideas. Originally Posted by Cunamara
My Cort Triggs NAMM is absolutely the nicest sounding (unplugged) small hollow body I've played but I cannot believe for a minute that Mr. Triggs went along with the tacky pearl buttons (long gone for gold kidney type) or a screwed into the top Bigsby which is also long gone for a trapeze.
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I suspect it varies with the interest of the individual and probably the contract they negotiate. Johnny Smith and Tal Farlow were deeply involved in the nuts and bolts of their signature guitars. Tal flat-out rejected the first prototype and sent it back with a list of changes; rejected but kept the second prototype (and liked it well enough to play it for years after the third and final prototype was stolen); and approved the third protoype. Originally Posted by GNAPPI
George Benson and Bob Weir were both very involved with their Ibanez models (the large headstocks on both came from Weir for increased sustain, as well as the pickup switching on his "Cowboy Fancy" model; the GB10 body design came from Benson, as I have heard anyway; both played multiple iterations before final approval. BTW, Weir allegedly walked off with one of George's prototypes that the Ibanez US staff showed him; he sometimes plays it in shows).
But it seems likely to me that Barney Kessel never saw his signature guitar until it rolled off the assembly line and the marketing was ready to go- I just can't imagine him approving such a radical departure from the aesthetics of jazz guitars, given that he played two nearly identical and very traditional guitars for decades. But the BK model, if looking nontraditional, sounds absolutely amazing. Some of the fattest, warmest and jazziest sounding guitars ever.
Les Paul of course was quite involved in the design and pulled his name when the design changed briefly to the SG form factor without his prior approval.
And I suspect that in many cases the endorser is given to believe he or she has more influence than they really do. I would imagine that a lot of times their design requests are very idiosyncratic and not likely to sell well to the general public, which the manufacturer has to manage with an eye on the point of the exercise (sales and profit).
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How the Howard Roberts Fusion came to be.
From:
The Jazz Guitar Stylings of Howard Roberts
By Mitch Holder
Mel Bay,
2006
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I had recorded this quite some time ago before I setup my studio. This is recorded right from the computer's mic. This was with the 300k pots in the guitar.
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Interesting looking guitar showed up this week at the shop. Replaced pickups. Light gauge round wound strings. I didn't find the tone very compelling... maybe if it had flats. Or maybe different pickups. Or maybe if the player had different ears.
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Those pickups don’t look original.
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They are Sadowsky pickups.
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My HRF came with the 490 set I th8nk Gibson picked them perfectly for the git.
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i had one that was a dud, it sounded fine, but the neck was a mess... if i could find a nice one, i'd try another
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Gentlemen,
Can anyone supply measurements of the HRF at the 12th fret, between fret wire and underside of string, both bass E and treble E, so as to ascertain action?
I’m currently looking to buy a used HR Fusion online, and I’d like to compare notes. I’m an older player and used to low action (Les Paul, Steinberger, Parker Fly Mojo). Of course, I can probably get the action I need by trussrod adjustment, but I’d still like to get some ballpark figures.
I’ve only bought a guitar once online and it did NOT turn out well. Unfortunately, waiting for a HRF to come along any time soon in my local Guitar Center is hardly likely.
I am in love with the size and whole mystique of HR and this guitar!
Thank you in advance,
Pete
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On this guitar you set the action where ever you want. It's adjustable with the bridge. The only limitation you have is if you're extremely low and you have any high frets, you'll become aware of them at some point, but that's for REALLY low. Originally Posted by chromefree
NEVER adjust action with a truss rod adjustment though, that's for neck relief. Set the relief to give you the relief you need (this is very slight to nearly none for most people) and take the action up or down through the adjustments on the posts of the bridge.
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That's an odd request.
Beside fret wear, rod adjustment, string type/gauge, player preference and how hard a player is on the strings all add up to a meaningless measurement.
Like you Pete, I'm an older player who likes low action, but my picking style is rather light and what a guitar I own will play like may be a fret buzzer for anyone with a harder pick attack.
A different tack might be to put your geographical area of the world in your profile and perhaps a member near you could arrange a test try. Even then you'd have to understand that another HRF may not play anything like mine or any other you try. An example or two... I have a few 335's and LP's all are different just enough set to my playing style to make my advice to play one in person and if it's for sale WITH a request to have it setup to your liking before buying.
Oh, the HRF is yet another unappreciated Gibson model... too many negatives. Too thick, not available in fave color, natural, blue etc... too heavy for a hollow poser, finger TP, Single cut semi, too many (wrong) pickups, chromite block, ... and the moniker "fusion" must have turned a few noses up too. Eye players, sheesh.
Anyway, if you get to south Florida, I'll be happy to let you give mine a test run, except for at a gig in a bar, full of drunks who play strats, with a small stage. :-)Last edited by GNAPPI; 05-13-2020 at 06:35 PM.
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Thank you Gary,
I'd never been one to make action adjustments, but you remind me that the HRF has the tunomatic bridge which can be used to adjust string height.
Funny you mention south Florida, as the guitar is located in Melbourne. I also have siblings in Boynton Beach, but I visited in early March and do not plan to return any time soon.
Anyway, thank you for your input, I truly appreciate it,
Pete
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Thank you Jimmy,
Of course, the tuneomatic bridge will allow me to make string height adjustments.
This thing we're going through has got my head spinning.
Thanks again,
Pete
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My GF lives in Boynton. The offer stands... If you haven't made a decision by then I'll get you a tryout. Originally Posted by chromefree
I did not know of an HRF in Florida, I get to Melb a few times a year, I'll look into it if I go there, there's only a few git stores in that area.
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