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  1. #1

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    I'm experimenting with Reaper, modeling add-ins, and video software to see how it all works together on YouTube. This is about 30 seconds. It's really about the sound and the output level so please don't pay too much attention to the video. I just used the camera on my laptop to have something to work with.

    EDIT ... Here's a new version using a Limiter as suggested.

    Last edited by Jim Soloway; 04-12-2019 at 01:33 PM.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    The recording clear but the volume seemed a bit low. I use a headphone amp with the iPad and had to turn it up more than usual.

  4. #3
    Yep. I back to backed this vid from the one you shot with your old Godin, and this one is lower volume / not as rich.

  5. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Soloway View Post
    I'm experimenting with Reaper, modeling add-ins, and video software to see how it all works together on YouTube. This is about 30 seconds. It's really about the sound and the output level so please don't pay too much attention to the video. I just used the camera on my laptop to have something to work with.



    The sound is fine, volume a touch low, but not terrible.

    May I suggest putting a limiter on the master, and pull it down 2db, bounce, 4 dB, bounce, 6 dB, bounce.

    There will always be a trade off between fidelity and volume. Take the mixes and listen, and decided what the loudest one you can live with is.

    ps, you may want to check out maximizer effects. Also, if you’re using a compressor, high pass the sidechain so the lows aren’t overwhelming the compressor.

  6. #5

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    I thought it sounded great. I listened on a pair of earbuds on my laptop. Volume seemed fine, and I had it maybe a third of the way up.

  7. #6

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    Volume seemed to match the dynamics of the playing, and was not too low volume, using flat eq monitor speakers on my desktop.

  8. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove View Post
    The sound is fine, volume a touch low, but not terrible.

    May I suggest putting a limiter on the master, and pull it down 2db, bounce, 4 dB, bounce, 6 dB, bounce.

    There will always be a trade off between fidelity and volume. Take the mixes and listen, and decided what the loudest one you can live with is.

    ps, you may want to check out maximizer effects. Also, if you’re using a compressor, high pass the sidechain so the lows aren’t overwhelming the compressor.
    At the risk of sounding like I'm completely clueless, could you possibly explain some of this?

    And thanks to all for the input.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Soloway View Post
    At the risk of sounding like I'm completely clueless, could you possibly explain some of this?

    And thanks to all for the input.


    No problem, first off what DAW are you using?

    Most daws have a built in limiter effect. It likely has 2 controls. Output level, set to -.1 this will prevent your signal from crossing zero and clipping. The other control is likely labeled threshold. Pull that down 2db, bounce, 4db, 6db. The further you pull it down, the louder it gets. At some point, the increase in volume becomes too much and the signal is compromised. Find a compromise between pristine audio and volume.

    Regarding compressors, high pass your side chain means, cutting out the lows from the compressor “detector”. The lows will often overwhelm the compressor and cause it to really pump and leave unwanted artifacts. Letting the lows pass through the compressor unaffected can often result in far more natural compression.

    Hope that helps.
    Last edited by vintagelove; 03-20-2019 at 06:59 PM.

  10. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove View Post
    No problem, first of what DAW are you using?

    Most daws have a built in limiter effect. It likely has 2 controls. Output level, set to -.1 this will prevent your signal from crossing zero and clipping. The other control is likely labeled threshold. Pull that down 2db, bounce, 4db, 6db. The further you pull it down, the louder it gets. At some point, the increase in volume becomes too much and the signal is compromised. Find a compromise between pristine audio and volume.

    Regarding compressors, high pass your side chain means, cutting out the lows from the compressor “detector”. The lows will often overwhelm the compressor and cause it to really pump and leave unwanted artifacts. Letting the lows pass through the compressor unaffected can often result in far more natural compression.

    Hope that helps.
    I'm using Reaper (a recent move for me). And yes that helps a lot. The one thing I don't understand is what you mean when you say "bounce" in reference to the limiter.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  11. #10

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    Hi Jim,

    First let me say for me the volume was fine. If I want more volume as a listener I can just turn up the volume control on my listening device.

    Reaper uses the term "Render" which allows you to Render to another track, which is a "Bounce". That way you have multiple tracks with different levels of compression that you can compare.

    Another way is to add the compression to the track, right click the track and select duplicate which will give you two identical tracks, set the compression of each track differently, and audition each track to compare. This is easier for me in that you only have two tracks and you haven't committed to the effect settings as you would when you Render. You can then tweak away as you audition.

    Before considering compression or limiting...

    If you want to just increase the volume, the first thing to do is just increase the volume in Reaper as much as you can before you render. Or you can normalize the track.

    You can squeeze more volume out with compression but there is a potential cost

    Compression will change the tone, especially of a sound with a peaky initial transient like an acoustic guitar. Your sound and style has the transient characteristic that I would want to preserve. So, if I where to use compression or limiting I would be listening to what is happening to the transient and would be careful. Not to say that I wouldn't consider compression, I would just be very careful. You can let the transient through by increasing the time before it kicks in with the the "attack" dial... I'll stop here as I'm going down a road of too much detail for this post.

    I'm thinking of two benefits of compression:

    - More volume... For a solo guitar I don't care about increasing the volume from what I can already do with normalization. Unless...

    - More clarity of the lower volume notes. Compression will make the relative volumes of the quieter bits louder. In a mix where part of a performance is lost because of the dynamic range you can reduce that dynamic range of individual tracks so all of the performance can be heard more clearly. With a solo guitar performance this is seldom an issue and was not an issue in what you presented to us.

    These Reaper Mania videos by Kenny Gioia are really good. If you watch the first 4 minutes of this video you will see the normalize function. This is not just for multiple takes, double click any audio media item and the screen that includes the normalize button will pop up.

    Last edited by fep; 03-20-2019 at 07:11 PM.
    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  12. #11

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    Second the normalization advice (kinda assumed you knew that).

    And yes, bounce just meaning export so you can listen.

    I will say that the volume was a touch low, I was listening on an iPad, and had the volume maxed out. Just a bit more and I would be happy.

    Good luck!!!

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove View Post
    Second the normalization advice (kinda assumed you knew that).

    And yes, bounce just meaning export so you can listen.

    I will say that the volume was a touch low, I was listening on an iPad, and had the volume maxed out. Just a bit more and I would be happy.

    Good luck!!!
    Assume that I know very, very little and you won't be disappointed or surprised.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by fep View Post
    Hi Jim,

    First let me say for me the volume was fine. If I want more volume as a listener I can just turn up the volume control on my listening device.

    Reaper uses the term "Render" which allows you to Render to another track, which is a "Bounce". That way you have multiple tracks with different levels of compression that you can compare.

    Another way is to add the compression to the track, right click the track and select duplicate which will give you two identical tracks, set the compression of each track differently, and audition each track to compare. This is easier for me in that you only have two tracks and you haven't committed to the effect settings as you would when you Render. You can then tweak away as you audition.

    Before considering compression or limiting...

    If you want to just increase the volume, the first thing to do is just increase the volume in Reaper as much as you can before you render. Or you can normalize the track.

    You can squeeze more volume out with compression but there is a potential cost

    Compression will change the tone, especially of a sound with a peaky initial transient like an acoustic guitar. Your sound and style has the transient characteristic that I would want to preserve. So, if I where to use compression or limiting I would be listening to what is happening to the transient and would be careful. Not to say that I wouldn't consider compression, I would just be very careful. You can let the transient through by increasing the time before it kicks in with the the "attack" dial... I'll stop here as I'm going down a road of too much detail for this post.

    I'm thinking of two benefits of compression:

    - More volume... For a solo guitar I don't care about increasing the volume from what I can already do with normalization. Unless...

    - More clarity of the lower volume notes. Compression will make the relative volumes of the quieter bits louder. In a mix where part of a performance is lost because of the dynamic range you can reduce that dynamic range of individual tracks so all of the performance can be heard more clearly. With a solo guitar performance this is seldom an issue and was not an issue in what you presented to us.

    These Reaper Mania videos by Kenny Gioia are really good. If you watch the first 4 minutes of this video you will see the normalize function. This is not just for multiple takes, double click any audio media item and the screen that includes the normalize button will pop up.


    This is great Frank. Thanks. Between you and VL I've learned a lot today.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove View Post
    Second the normalization advice (kinda assumed you knew that).

    And yes, bounce just meaning export so you can listen.

    I will say that the volume was a touch low, I was listening on an iPad, and had the volume maxed out. Just a bit more and I would be happy.

    Good luck!!!
    Yes, that is a third reason to increase the volume beyond where it is. If on some devices people can't play the recording as loud as they want.

    If I'm being really diligent, in addition to listening to a mix on my reference monitors and reference headphones I'll listen also on my, earbuds, noise canceling Bose headphones, my Sony headphones, and my car stereo. It's amazing how different a mix will sound in the various headphones and my earbuds sound like crap in comparison, and the Bose really hype the bass. Now-a-days premium car stereos are about as good of systems that many own. This is all probably overkill for my purposes, but I enjoy the process. Nerdy, no?
    B+
    Frank (aka fep)

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Soloway View Post
    Assume that I know very, very little and you won't be disappointed or surprised.

    Considering you’ve been making very pleasant recordings for a while now, you’re off to a great start.

  17. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by vintagelove View Post
    Considering you’ve been making very pleasant recordings for a while now, you’re off to a great start.
    Thanks. Without knowing much I worked out a system in Garageband that seemed to work pretty well but once I moved to a PC it was mostly guess work. Now I've switched to Reaper and while it seems like a really good program, it doesn't seem to respond very well to guessing.

    I've done some more experimenting with both the Normalize function and the limiter and I think I like the one with just the limiter best. I've replaced the video link in the OP with the updated version.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  18. #17

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    Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this one?

    http://www.solowayguitars.com/Record...1-04-12-19.mp3
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  19. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Soloway View Post
    Just wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this one?

    http://www.solowayguitars.com/Record...1-04-12-19.mp3
    Yes, I had a thought.

    I thought that I wish I could play that.

    Nice!

  20. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar View Post
    Yes, I had a thought.

    I thought that I wish I could play that.

    Nice!
    Thanks. It's the opening minute or so of a piece that I wrote last summer. It's part of a backlog that I'd like to do complete recordings and possibly videos for but I've been going through all these recording machinations first. It really feels like I'm pretty close (thanks in large part to all the help I've gotten here).

    And if it makes you feel any better, it took me a while to consistently get my hands around a few bits in there.
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed

  21. #20

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    The only things that still work consistently on my whole body are my ears, and in my opinion that is an exceptionally lovely sound. If you haven't done so already, I'd advise documenting every possible setting in Reaper, on your guitar, and everything else that could affect the sound. Such things, once lost, are sometimes difficult to recreate. One sound might not be suitable for every song/situation, but that sure seems like a keeper. On a more busy piece the bass might get a little hard to control, but for something that quiet it sounds really nice. Just my two pesos.

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by strumcat View Post
    The only things that still work consistently on my whole body are my ears, and in my opinion that is an exceptionally lovely sound. If you haven't done so already, I'd advise documenting every possible setting in Reaper, on your guitar, and everything else that could affect the sound. Such things, once lost, are sometimes difficult to recreate. One sound might not be suitable for every song/situation, but that sure seems like a keeper. On a more busy piece the bass might get a little hard to control, but for something that quiet it sounds really nice. Just my two pesos.
    Thanks. The biggest variable in this recording is simply that I've gone back to my old guitar. I'm not sure exactly why I'm always looking for something else to play because this really is a special instrument in so many ways (as I get reminded every time I go back to it for any length of time).
    My CD "Bare Handed" is available as a download at Bandcamp.com
    http://jimsoloway.bandcamp.com/album/bare-handed