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  1. #51
    From what I heard it didn't seem much louder.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemark
    To be specific, the acoustic version. I edited the name of the thread to reflect that. I don't think Godin makes them anymore, that's why I got the name wrong.
    But they are essentially the same guitar.
    That's a totally different topic. Almost all of the success that the Kingpin lineup has enjoyed has been the electric versions. And no, once you mount a pickup and controls into a top, it is no longer the same guitar (even if the changes are mostly in perception).

  4. #53

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    I like my Kingpin. It serves a specific role. I can happily take it places I'm not comfortable taking a carved solid wood archtop. And I think I'm gonna go all vintagey and try some flat wounds on it just to see what happens. In 50 years I don't think I've ever touched a flat wound string...

  5. #54

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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemark
    To be specific, the acoustic version. I edited the name of the thread to reflect that. I don't think Godin makes them anymore, that's why I got the name wrong.
    But they are essentially the same guitar.
    As I mentioned before, I bought mine as the pure acoustic model and played it acoustically for three weeks before adding a pickup. I did this because I didn’t want a P90 (which I normally love, but not for this one) and because I wanted to be sure the guitar felt right. As a pure acoustic instrument is does not project sound like a solid top guitar (archtop or flattop) but with the heavier strings (12-53) it did really well. I put D’Addario chrome flatwounds on after I added the pickup and I actually like the unamplified sound a lot better. It also stays in tune better with those strings than with the acoustics that came with the instrument or the D’Addario roundwound jazz strings that I first tried (and didn’t like). I practice unamplified when it’s later in the evening and I don’t want to kee anyone up and still get asked to keep it down by the wife, so it’s loud enough.

    That said, I don’t think I’d gig with it without plugging in, but it’s not trash unamplified. But with the right pickup/amp combination, the tone is purely magical to me. I love this thing. I posted a sound clip earlier with the roundwound strings and the SS Carvin MB-12 bass amp, and it does it hold a candle now to the floatwounds and the Magnatone. I know it seems odd that the Magnatone didn’t do well with the electrlyzed jazz strings but it was noisy before playing a single note (probably more due to proximity of the magnet since I added rubber washers to the pickup mount under the pickguard to increase the distance, but sine I did it the same time as my string change, I guess I’ll never truly know).

  6. #55

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    So I put chromes on the Kingpin today and I like it even more. It's a fun change from my carved tops.

    Gotta say I never had a proper set up done and the thing plays really nice. I can play real music on it. And it's black. What a bargain!

  7. #56

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    I have a 5th Ave, the acoustic version. At some point I intend putting an old DeArmond "monkey on a stick" pickup on it to see what kind of sound it has when amplified, but I acquired it specifically for recording Freddie Green style rhythm parts. I had it for a month on trial from its previous owner, and had plenty of time to give it a thorough workout, and to compare it with other instruments. My initial impression was that it was brash and unsubtle, almost harsh in tone; however when I recorded it, the sound that came back through my speakers was exactly what I was looking for. It's also light in weight - important to me since I have longterm back problems - and for me, the neck is very comfortable to play. I'd searched from time to time over a period of several years for a guitar to use for that specific function, and my search is now over.

  8. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758
    lol is that a phrase?!
    It's a phase. I'm just going through a phase...

  9. #58

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  10. #59

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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemark
    Am I the only one who does not like the Godin, 5th Ave guitars. I see nothing but love for them on this forum but to me they sound like cardboard boxes with strings on them. Just awful.
    I think they are fine if you are looking for an entry level archtop. But, I could not imagine ever owning one if I wanted to enjoy hearing what I play.


    Please note, I do like Godin as a company and am glad a Canadian company is doing well, and getting people to play archtops.
    I guess you are an acoustic player. This guitar is supposed to be amplified and is capable of good Jazz tone; with a decent matching amp, it's all in your hands.

    A P-90, a hollow box, a Trapeze TP and a good set-up is all I need.

  11. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie
    I too had lately an opportunity to try out the famous Kingpin. Second hand, very cheap. Very veeery beautiful! Gorgeous!

    But when I changed the stock bridge to a brass TOM bridge I noticed that the original brigde – and the holder too – was plastic. No wonder that it sounded, uh, plasticky!

    The brass bridge didn’t bring it alive for me. I didn’t have enough patience to buy and try ebony bridge and holder, I was too disappointed and I sold it for same price I bought it.

    I hope everyone else have had better luck!
    I believe the bridge is a Resomax archtop bridge by GraphTech. It is Tusq. Definitely not plastic. It is a high quality bridge. Just FYI.

  12. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gumbojoe8
    I believe the bridge is a Resomax archtop bridge by GraphTech. It is Tusq. Definitely not plastic. It is a high quality bridge. Just FYI.
    So I have been told. But my ears didn't like the sound of it, so what can You do!

    Can change the guitar but can't change the ears!

  13. #62

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    Sorry, as I progressed through the thread I saw someone already mentioned it. And yep, everyone's ear is different. Cheers and thanks for the reply.

  14. #63

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    There's a Facebook ad close to where I live of someone selling the acoustic model for 280 €.. you can't really talk about these guitars disregarding their excellent price point.

  15. #64

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    Tusq is plastic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gumbojoe8
    I believe the bridge is a Resomax archtop bridge by GraphTech. It is Tusq. Definitely not plastic. It is a high quality bridge. Just FYI.

  16. #65

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    Quote Originally Posted by BickertRules
    Tusq is plastic.
    Actually, that's not quite correct. It is a resin derived from organic material (plant-based I presume), not from petrochemicals. (Plastics are resins--defined as a group of solid or semi-solid amorphous compounds--that are derived from petrochemicals.)

    Plastics per se are generally "harder" and more brittle than resins. Resins are easier to shape and carve after hardening, plus more resonant, hence their use in guitar production.

  17. #66

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    I've had a single PU, non-cutaway version for a dozen or so years. Pros: price/quality, looks, lightness, acoustic volume. Cons: P90 too shrill, noisy near the amp, sensitive to moisture changes, unsophisticated acoustic tone.

    Very difficult to decide which strings to put on, had three sets during the first week. Outdoor gig under a tent on a rainy day made the neck swell so much it became unplayable. OTOH, louder acoustically than my occasional duo partner's hand-carved 17" archtop, at home in half-acoustic big-band comping.

  18. #67

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    I liked mine enough to gift it to my grandson.

  19. #68

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    1st world problems...

    A good set up and you're good to go... perfect beginner's instruments.

    And if you can play like Sylvain no need to diss Godin.


  20. #69

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    He is an official Godin endorser though, he gets paid to play and advertise them..

  21. #70

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    I have loved mine, but looking to go back to solid body only.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  22. #71

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaShigsta
    1st world problems...

    A good set up and you're good to go... perfect beginner's instruments.

    And if you can play like Sylvain no need to diss Godin.

    That is the Jazz model that I had. See how he can't really go past the 12th fret because of the neck joint? That was one of my main issues with this model.

  23. #72

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    I have a Jazz and I have no problem going past the 12th fret. Sylvain Luc does not seem to either.

  24. #73

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    I like it. Has its style and vibe, but I realized this only after changing from flatwounds to roundwounds

  25. #74

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    I like the way my 5th Avenue sounds, but lately my hands have started hurting when I play it. I don’t get that with my Martin flattop. And I am saving to get back into a solid body.

  26. #75

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    Quote Originally Posted by joelf
    And I don't like Gibson 175s or L5s---and people swear by them.

    One man's meat...
    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758
    lol is that a phrase?!
    no, it is just a reflection on a boring night in the city... where are the good old days...

    ... I hope I did not break any rules and I am just being funny... what is that other word for funny, you know that one that is just not straight sounding...

  27. #76

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    Check out the tone he's getting here, amazing. This is what convinced me to get one

  28. #77
    I'm going to remind everyone, this thread is about the acoustic version. Not ones with pickups.

  29. #78

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    I started with the acoustic version and electrified mine with a floating CC pickup, does that count. Besides, the neck ergonomics are the same for the acoustic, Kingpin, and Kingpin II (aside from the cutaway).

    Am I the only one that doesn't like the Godin 5th Avenue?-3d0f7a83-6e3e-43b6-b99c-538bf187c43b-jpeg

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Last edited by zcostilla; 02-11-2021 at 12:04 AM.

  30. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chazmo
    I have a Jazz and I have no problem going past the 12th fret. Sylvain Luc does not seem to either.
    I forgot the obligatory YMMV.

  31. #80

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    I had a Godin 5th avenue, the acoustic non-cutaway model. I put a Vintage Vibe floating CC pickup on it.
    For a small bodied laminated guitar the acoustic sound was pretty good - that translated to a nice airy amplified sound. Not as feedback resistant as something like an ES175 but lots more acoustic presence.

    I sold mine as I found the 16" fingerboard radius combined with the very small frets uncomfortable to play. Despite that, if the person who I sold it to ever wanted to part with it, I'd gladly take it back again.

  32. #81

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    Acoustic 5th ave has a pleasing but quiet acoustic voice. Utterly useless for acoustic ensemble playing with anything other than other Godin 5th Avenues (IIRC it’s quieter than a comparable flat top). Great with a pickup and I daresay mikes well which might actually make it more practical for both recording and live work (whatever that is) than a proper acoustic cannon if you get a good mic.

    The Epiphone Masterbilts work quite well for acoustic playing. I was quite impressed.

  33. #82

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    I'm looking to get an inexpensive second hand archtop as an alternative to my ESP telecaster, just because I'm intrigued.
    So, as an introduction to the world of hollow body jazz guitars, do you think that it is worth the purchase compared to a similarly priced: Ibanez AF51 (floating pickup), Ibanez AF75, Epiphone Joe Pass Emperor II or a Washburn Oscar Schmidt OE40 (although I think this last one is a semi-hollow) that are all available second hand around my area in Europe?

  34. #83
    It depends on what you want.
    This thread was supposed to be about the acoustic version. Those other guitars are not acoustic archtops.

    To really like that they are made in Canada as opposed to the far East.
    Last edited by Littlemark; 04-11-2021 at 11:02 AM.

  35. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    I'm looking to get an inexpensive second hand archtop as an alternative to my ESP telecaster, just because I'm intrigued.
    So, as an introduction to the world of hollow body jazz guitars, do you think that it is worth the purchase compared to a similarly priced: Ibanez AF51 (floating pickup), Ibanez AF75, Epiphone Joe Pass Emperor II or a Washburn Oscar Schmidt OE40 (although I think this last one is a semi-hollow) that are all available second hand around my area in Europe?
    What sort of sound do you want? Any guitarists whose tone you like in particular?

  36. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    I'm looking to get an inexpensive second hand archtop as an alternative to my ESP telecaster, just because I'm intrigued.
    So, as an introduction to the world of hollow body jazz guitars, do you think that it is worth the purchase compared to a similarly priced: Ibanez AF51 (floating pickup), Ibanez AF75, Epiphone Joe Pass Emperor II or a Washburn Oscar Schmidt OE40 (although I think this last one is a semi-hollow) that are all available second hand around my area in Europe?
    JMO the Godin is better made and better sounding acoustically than any of those. Electrified, YMMV—I like the Joe Pass, especially with good pickups.

    But the Godin has a great tone with the P90’s. I have a floating pickup on my 5th Avenue, but wish I had another Kingpin with the P90. It’s got a cool vibe.

  37. #86

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    Well, I am new to jazz, I play classical, so I don't really have many references yet.
    I think something approximating the sound of Barney Kessel for example, maybe a bit darker still?
    Don't want bright tones, maybe you guys could in fact point me to a relevant guitarist for reference?

  38. #87

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    Also, I'm most comfortable when I play with fingers, so maybe Joe Pass style?
    I am getting myself a Roland Cube 20 from 1982, in the orange box.
    Does it pair well with any of the above mentioned archtops for a classic old school style? (I know I'm being very vague, apologies)

  39. #88

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    Also, I'm most comfortable when I play with fingers, so maybe Joe Pass style?
    I am getting myself a Roland Cube 20 from 1982, in the orange box.
    Does it pair well with any of the above mentioned archtops for a classic old school style? (I know I'm being very vague, apologies)
    I would say one of the Ibanez's might be your thing?

  40. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by consumerduck
    I love my single p-90 kingpin. Been gigging and playing it with my band for at least 8 years. I love the stock pickup and see no reason to change. It’s been set up with my preferred a bit higher than normal action. It plays, sounds and looks great.

    Here’s a recent live improv with cool video editing and a live artist drawing (and drinking and later singing).

    Hi, C,
    Break out the *Ripple . . . light some incense . . . and let's burn one!
    Play live . . . Man . . . Play live . . . Marinero


    • Ripple was a fortified and carbonated wine[7] that was popular in the United States, particularly in the 1970s (and made famous by Fred G. Sanford of Sanford and Son). Possessing a low 11% ABV (lower than modern table wines), it was originally marketed to "casual" drinkers.[8] Due to its low price, it gained a negative reputation as a drink for destitute alcoholics. It was popular among young drinkers, both underage and college students, due to its low price. It was later replaced with Boone's Farm.[9]

  41. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by zcostilla
    Wow!


    I like this Godin better!
    Play live . . . Marinero

  42. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by Littlemark
    This thread was supposed to be about the acoustic version. Those other guitars are not acoustic archtops.
    For what it's worth, that was not at all clear from your original post. Most of us who have praised these guitars in the past were referring to our experiences with the electric versions so that's what we responded to.

  43. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grigoris
    Well, I am new to jazz, I play classical, so I don't really have many references yet.
    I think something approximating the sound of Barney Kessel for example, maybe a bit darker still?
    Don't want bright tones, maybe you guys could in fact point me to a relevant guitarist for reference?
    Kessel usually had a pretty bright tone (sometimes very bright and piercing). Having had one I'd say you'd get closer to that with a Godin Kingpin than with the other guitars you listed because a P90 pickup comes much closer to the sound of the Charlie Christian pickup Kessel used than does any flavor of humbucker.

    For an example of a darker tone, I'd cite Pat Metheny on one of his small-group recordings (e.g., Question and Answer) or Adam Rogers. Lage Lund also has what I consider to be a dark tone. You can get a dark or a bright tone out of any guitar via tone control adjustments on guitar and amp.

    Out of the ones you listed, I've only played the Godin and the Epi Joe Pass. They're both good guitars that you can get a lot out of. The Godin is probably going to feel a little more familiar to a classical player because of the flatter fretboard and smaller frets, but whether that's a good or a bad thing is subjective. The Epi is a little more versatile, and the humbucking pickups won't buzz the way the P90s will.

    Honestly, it's almost impossible to recommend something to someone who doesn't yet have much familiarity with the gamut of electric guitar sounds. For all of us, it's trial and error. For your first archtop, you kind of have to just take the plunge and try one figure out whether you like it, and move on if you don't.

    John

  44. #93

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    I tried a Godin in a music store a few years ago, and was underwhelmed. I wanted to like it, but I just couldn't.

  45. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by John A.
    Kessel usually had a pretty bright tone (sometimes very bright and piercing). Having had one I'd say you'd get closer to that with a Godin Kingpin than with the other guitars you listed because a P90 pickup comes much closer to the sound of the Charlie Christian pickup Kessel used than does any flavor of humbucker.

    For an example of a darker tone, I'd cite Pat Metheny on one of his small-group recordings (e.g., Question and Answer) or Adam Rogers. Lage Lund also has what I consider to be a dark tone. You can get a dark or a bright tone out of any guitar via tone control adjustments on guitar and amp.

    Out of the ones you listed, I've only played the Godin and the Epi Joe Pass. They're both good guitars that you can get a lot out of. The Godin is probably going to feel a little more familiar to a classical player because of the flatter fretboard and smaller frets, but whether that's a good or a bad thing is subjective. The Epi is a little more versatile, and the humbucking pickups won't buzz the way the P90s will.

    Honestly, it's almost impossible to recommend something to someone who doesn't yet have much familiarity with the gamut of electric guitar sounds. For all of us, it's trial and error. For your first archtop, you kind of have to just take the plunge and try one figure out whether you like it, and move on if you don't.

    John
    Thanks for the references, I'm really liking Pat Metheny, I recently got his last album (Road to the Sun) on LP vinyl which he made with Jason Vieaux - a classical guitarist and the Los Angeles Guitar Quartet.

    Someone posted this on another thread earlier


    I guess this is the kind of sound I was after, maybe it doesn't classify as dark enough? The other examples John gave certainly sounded a lot fatter and darker.

  46. #95

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    Funny how many mentioned the Joe Pass.

    I only have experience (though quite a bit and all rather good) with the earlier Korean versions and a few drive by demos of the various Godin models and I could not put any Godin in the same class as the JP. Different animals.

    So far I've not (of the couple of models I tried) played a Godin I liked. It's been a while since I played one but my retained impressions of them they are thin sounding and not a joy to play. I guess I "could" get used to playing one but why? Anyway, The finish also rubs me wrong. I never owned one.

  47. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by GNAPPI
    Funny how many mentioned the Joe Pass.

    I only have experience (though quite a bit and all rather good) with the earlier Korean versions and a few drive by demos of the various Godin models and I could not put any Godin in the same class as the JP. Different animals.

    So far I've not (of the couple of models I tried) played a Godin I liked. It's been a while since I played one but my retained impressions of them they are thin sounding and not a joy to play. I guess I "could" get used to playing one but why? Anyway, The finish also rubs me wrong. I never owned one.
    I think it's one of thse cases where it depends on what you're looking for. The Kingpin archtops certainly have a thinner sound than most of the better Asian archtops but they also have a lighter, and I think more responsive build. They are certainly very different and are likely to appeal to different tastes.
    Last edited by Jim Soloway; 04-12-2021 at 09:31 PM.

  48. #97

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    I think they sound great, but if you like shiny objects, I guess get an Ibanez?


  49. #98

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    I get that the Kingpin has a cheap "student" instrument vibe. And there are some aspects of its construction that I don't love (but do tolerate). But, it's a very playable guitar that gets a good sound that I did not find thin at all.

    It's kind of odd to be defending its honor, since I just gave mine away. But I got a huge amount of use out of it. I found it to have more character and subtleties than any of the other bargain archtops I've tried; some of the not-so-bargain ones as well. I like what I have now more, but if I had room, I'd gladly have kept it. It is both a beater/beach guitar, and a legitimately gigable jazz box, which is a rare thing.

    John

  50. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by John A.
    ...It is both a beater/beach guitar, and a legitimately gigable jazz box...John
    That right there. You said it better than I could.