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ACK - I have the worst luck with used guitars. The guitar arrived today and appears to be heavily modified and has a chip not disclosed by the seller. Normally , that wouldn't bother me but with all the following issues, it adds up to a return I think:
1) Sound posts installed by the seller
2) Pickups have been reversed (neck is 7.7k, bridge is 7.2k)
3) tailrise in the fingerboard
4) missing screw in pickguard bracket (another sign it's been heavily modified)
5) Chip in the finish
Guitar actually sounds good but with the sound posts it's hard to know what it really sounds like, and I'm not about to remove the soundposts and risk damaging the guitar...
And to Jeff, it's not bright at all!
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02-21-2019 01:24 PM
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Well, hey, it's got that going for it.
That's a lot of mods not to disclose! Gee whiz...
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The guy's response was, "I never said it was mint. I'll send you a new screw"
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There's a comeback in here where you tell the guy to "screw himself" but I can't think of how to word it yet...
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lol, he now says i have to pay shipping to return it because the guitar is not broken. What a soap opera, lol.
Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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Jeez, what a bummer. Originally Posted by jzucker
There's a lesson in there I learned a while back. Before purchase, I send a note to the seller:
Does the truss rod work?
Is the neck (assuming normal relief) straight?
Have there been ANY mods / repairs done to it?
Are there any condition issues not in the pics that are hidden?
Finally: Please understand I have no problems with the git as described as long as there are no issues I cannot see in your pics, or read in your description.
Many times the seller will not write back, when they do if they're evasive... I pass on it. If they answer everything I've always had an excellent transaction.
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i do that if they do not offer an approval period. In this case, they offered me a 48hr approval period but based on the post-receiving conversations, none of these things he would have known about beforehand. He didn't see any issues in any of the pictures I sent him.
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Are the sound posts glued in? I could see where a dealer really wouldn't know about those being there. Originally Posted by jzucker
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no idea but i'm not about to try pulling them loose. When I had posts installed in one of my barney kessel guitars, it raised the top up about 1/16". So removing them is risky because it could crack a brace or the top or whatever. The guy should have taken care of it prior to selling such an expensive guitar. Originally Posted by skiboyny
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There was a Guy on YouTube from Australia and youtube Genie sent me his vids - He's a Benson Picker and very good - I was surprised by what I thought was the GB30 quality especially acoustically ..upon closer inspection it's a GB300 - that thing should sound great in your hands . Originally Posted by jzucker
I noticed the difference in a blind test [ I mean I thought he sounded better cause he plays better on the GB30 - but it was the GB300 - it's fuller and deeper sounding resonance and has a beautiful nearly acoustic sound if you dial it in played with fingers .
Sounds like this ?
EDIT - I have been informed that this is actually a GB 200 - Thanks for the Correction , Guitfiddler.Last edited by Robertkoa; 02-22-2019 at 08:42 AM.
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Oy. (Puts on mirrored sunglasses ...) What we have here is failure to communicate. Originally Posted by jzucker
I guess in your shoes I'd keep it and take a chance with the sound posts, but I'm a way less frequent flyer than you, and have way fewer scars. I hope it does work out, because I'm curious about the stuffing experiment.
John
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That's a GB200 in Errol Earl's video. Originally Posted by Robertkoa
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at this point it's a return. Too many mods that weren't disclosed (reversed pickups, sound-posts, who knows if there is top or back damage from the posts, etc., etc., ) Originally Posted by John A.
and frankly, i know it's not apples/apples since the soundposts are involved but it doesn't sound any better of feel any better than the lgb-30 I had and the thinner body of the 30 is more comfortable. At this point, I'll either just stand pat with the kessel and forget about the stuffing or get something cheaper, maybe order the the custom seventy seven I was mentioning...
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by the way, that gb200 sounds good in the video but I just did a quick recording of my kessel tonight and I still have never played a guitar that beats it in tone or playability...
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Yup, the BK sounds great.
John
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No expert , but the BK has an unusual combination of phatness warmth and transparency and note separation.
There's a video of Peter Farrel playing one that sounds a lot like yours - a '62.
Chords especially sound pretty amazing on those -even from top to bottom and separate but still warm .
Last edited by Robertkoa; 02-22-2019 at 09:31 AM.
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that kessel has roundwounds which sound great! A little more johnny smith than the flats I have which are a little more howard roberts? I may have to switch to rounds. Peter is so !@#$ amazing!
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fair point Jack .... Originally Posted by jzucker
for interest , my half foam stuffed guitars do have less zing and a bit more
percussive attack than before stuffing too
i do appreciate that cotton stuffing would do even more .....
possibly much more !
however it's not for me , In fact I had to remove half the foam to get it
to where it felt right to me ...
sorry to to here of your tribulations re. the LGB300
I'm with you , the seller should definitely have mentioned the mods ...
Especially the sound posts
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Thanks brother. One thing that I discovered was that when I first got the kessel, I was putting packing tape over the F holes when playing with a loud group and even the packing tape changes the sound so it has less archtop goodness though not as much as cotton. Later, I realized it wasn't necessary with my current setup so I don't tape it anymore. I'd only do the cotton with a 2nd guitar since I wouldn't want that sound all the time...
Maybe having the issue with the LGB300 was a blessing in disguise, i.e. better to stuff a cheaper guitar...
Originally Posted by pingu
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They might for you - I want to hear that Demo right now ! Originally Posted by jzucker
Can you play the legato and Fusion stuff on those in addition to straight Jazz ?
Sustain and bloom etc . Or does the trapeze kill that somewhat ?
Specifically - I am asking if with Vibrato etc is the sustain ( clean tones )on your Hawk Deep almost the same as your Exrubato stoptail ?Last edited by Robertkoa; 02-24-2019 at 01:18 PM.
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Damn Jack you can play.
once you find the guitar that fits you perfectly, all obstacles are removed. You are not listening to the guitar anymore, You are just playing the hell out of it. You, are doing just that with the Barney Kessel. If Barney himself heard you play his signature guitar, he might have said, damn, I did good and I should play the Gibson Barney Kessel more often.
In our lifelong quest for the best tool we can put to use, you my friend have found your match.
But that doesn’t mean you can’t keep looking for something that might be even better. Keep having fun. Life is complicated. But I can see in your face, that guitar brings you a certain euphoria that no other one does.
thanks for sharing Jack. It’s a real treat to listen to and watch you whale.
Joe D
Originally Posted by jzucker
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well, keep in mind that I don't have a hawk deep but when I had it, it was a spruce top, maple back/sides, 5pc maple neck/walnut neck. It had excellent sustain and had the kind of note bloom you could easily use for fusion. It did not have the sustain of the exrubato but still sounded great. I would easily be happy using one for fusion stuff. I have been using the following strings on my exrubato and love it for fusion *AND* jazz. Originally Posted by Robertkoa
.013 .016 .022(p) .028 .038 .050
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Thanks so much Joe. At this point, I am no longer looking for something better. As you know, I have owned multiple L5s, 2 or 3 Wes models, a '48 super 400, multiple 175s, tal farlows, etc., etc. This is the best sounding guitar I've ever owned. I'm utterly convinced there is something about the old wood or the properties of aging that make it special...
I'm returning the LGB-300 but I just bought an LGB-30 and I plan to stuff it and set it up with Martino style strings just for a variation in tone...
Originally Posted by Max405
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Damn Joe, if they were obstacles I have a new nightly prayer. Originally Posted by Max405
Lord... Grant me the obstacles that Jack Zucker has. :-)
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Thanks for all the kind words, guys!
You'd actually be surprised at the some of the obstacles I have. Due to nerve damage from a spinal injury and accompanying surgery i had in 2004, I cannot play from the wrist. This makes it difficult for me to do intricate string changes with the pick on alternate strings, particularly between the E and A strings. This is one reason I have flirted with fingerstyle and hybrid players. There is one simple pattern that I am so horrible at and that is playing the following pattern between those strings.
C A C A C A C A using down on C and Up on the A. It's ridiculously hard for me and currently, I can't do it faster than about 1/16 notes at 111. I spend 20 minutes a day practicing this thinking that someday it'll improve but so far it has not...
When I improvise, I usually cheat by using a "hammer-on-from-nowhere" to do the lower notes when playing a pattern like this. Back in my 20s and 30s it was such a no brainer for me but now I find that I have to get creative at playing certain lines because I'll never have the pick dexterity I once had.
But like anything else, it becomes part of your vocabulary and I find that the hammer-on-from-nowhere ends up helping my playing in other ways. It gives my playing more of the pat metheny feel so I guess it's ok...
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