The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
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  1. #1

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    Found this on the net (not my caption, don't mind it). Sure looks like Ibanez is trying to keep Metheny playing Ibanez guitars, and might be working on a guitar based off of Pat's Slaman? Anyone seen anything about this?

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  3. #2

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    It’s a shame that Ibanez tries to copy Slaman’s design.

  4. #3

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    Yeah, Slaman's design is so original! :P

  5. #4

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    Yeah let's not get too upset that Ibanez also is paying tribute to that old Gibson model. I'd be game to try one of these out...

    Big

  6. #5

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    Slaman’s PM Sister guitar is not an ES-250 clone. It’s 16” not 17”, and has a Venetian cutaway as opposed to no cutaway. Plus the inlays are picture frame like a 1930s L-7 vs. the 250’s bow ties.

    It’s a mix of Gibson attributes obviously, but it’s not an ES-250.

  7. #6

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    There are also other MIJ CC choices to ponder:
    Westville Aruba Crest


    Archtop tribute ATC350BK (Barney Kessel Tribute


  8. #7

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    No trace of miccrophone on this caption.

    How can we guess which type of mic' will be installed ? Not necessarily a CC...

    Cheers

  9. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by rpguitar
    Slaman’s PM Sister guitar is not an ES-250 clone. It’s 16” not 17”, and has a Venetian cutaway as opposed to no cutaway. Plus the inlays are picture frame like a 1930s L-7 vs. the 250’s bow ties.

    It’s a mix of Gibson attributes obviously, but it’s not an ES-250.
    Fair enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Archtop
    No trace of miccrophone on this caption.

    How can we guess which type of mic' will be installed ? Not necessarily a CC...

    Cheers
    Good point. From the picture the routing looks wider and more slim than a typical humbucker. Pure speculation of course. I'm just assuming, from the tailpiece, that they're working on a "Slaman"

  10. #9

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    I think a Metheny CC model would be pretty welcome by a lot of people. . .depending on the price point.

    I'd be very curious what they would come up with, I can't think of too many Ibanez single-coil pickups, even P-90 style, maybe back in the clone era?

  11. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marwin Moody
    Good point. From the picture the routing looks wider and more slim than a typical humbucker. Pure speculation of course. I'm just assuming, from the tailpiece, that they're working on a "Slaman"
    That's a good guess !

  12. #11

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    I think that everything that can be designed in a practical platform has already been made. No cut, single cut, double cut, Venetian, Florentine, 12-19", thinline, long scale, short scale, hollow, semi-hollow, "F" hole, cats eye, diamond, markers, no markers. So who's copying? Splain' me.

  13. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Archtop
    No trace of miccrophone on this caption.

    How can we guess which type of mic' will be installed ? Not necessarily a CC...

    Cheers

    There are three holes in the top for the CC adjustment screws so ....

  14. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by fws6
    There are three holes in the top for the CC adjustment screws so ....
    Whoa! Good Eyes!

  15. #14

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    It is rubbing me the wrong way, mates. Ibanez did this once before with Joe Pass's D'Aquisto and lore has it that Jimmy wasn't pleased that Ibanez didn't so much as ask him.

    Pat Metheny plays Linda Manzer guitars onstage without a nod towards Ibanez. Why not allow him to continue to play his Daniel Slaman? Does Daniel have any say in this? Did Pat and Ibanez ask Daniel if it is all right by him? Is Daniel getting any emolument from the sales?

    Daniel isn't exactly rolling in guilders. It just strikes me as wrong. OK, you may argue that Daniel was in turn riffing off Gibson. But Gibson never made a guitar like this in recent memory and Daniel single-handedly made the CC Blade current again. The 16" Slaman Sister is his own re-imagining of Gibson. I don't have a problem with the Archtop Tribute guys doing the ES-150, ES-350BK and the Westville Aruba Crest is a unique design. Gibson have sort of abandoned these models. But Daniel, mates...this is like his bread and butter. And he is a one-man shop. This is not a re-imagining but a ripoff. I hope Pat Metheny and Ibanez do right by him.

  16. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
    It is rubbing me the wrong way, mates. Ibanez did this once before with Joe Pass's D'Aquisto and lore has it that Jimmy wasn't pleased that Ibanez didn't so much as ask him.

    Pat Metheny plays Linda Manzer guitars onstage without a nod towards Ibanez. Why not allow him to continue to play his Daniel Slaman? Does Daniel have any say in this? Did Pat and Ibanez ask Daniel if it is all right by him? Is Daniel getting any emolument from the sales?

    Daniel isn't exactly rolling in guilders. It just strikes me as wrong. OK, you may argue that Daniel was in turn riffing off Gibson. But Gibson never made a guitar like this in recent memory and Daniel single-handedly made the CC Blade current again. I don't have a problem with the Archtop Tribute guys doing the ES-150, ES-350BK and the Westville Aruba. Gibson have sort of abandoned these models. But Daniel, mates...this is like his bread and butter. And he is a one-man shop. I hope Pat Metheny and Ibanez do right by him.
    My take on this is that Ibanez is either making Pat a new artist model that he will actually use on stage (ala George Benson's ever-growing GB series), or simply another PM model that the masses will hopefully buy. Even Mr. Benson hasn't been seen playing the Chinese made LGB guitars.

    Have you ever seen Scofield play his 'signature' JSM100 supposedly modeled after his old AS200? Nope!
    But they sell JSM100's; JSM10's etc. all day long to the guitar buying public.

    We'll have to wait to see if Pat Metheny uses the new guitar...or not.

  17. #16

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    Pat Metheny will certainly appear in ads holding one. And to the uninitiated, it would appear as if Ibanez came up with it independently. I don't think Daniel Slaman is going to get any attribution in the ads.

    Is this going to hurt Daniel's sales? Maybe, maybe not. The irony is that I feared that Gibson would come down hard on Daniel with a C&D-Gibson objected to the open-book cleft in the headstock-but I didn't see Ibanez ripping him off. That is not exactly an AF105NT with 3 holes.

  18. #17

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    I just asked Daniel himself, and he sais that he wasnt involved or aware of this Ibanez until this morning

    Daniel acknowledges that the guitar looks like his but also sees some differences. He is somewhat flattered that a large builder is copying more or less his guitar

    Metheny BTW also uses another one of Daniels guitars at live performances, the “dome” nylonstring archtop guitar. Daniel also gets a lot of orders for that model due to Metheny playing it.

  19. #18

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    Yes, Ibanez is copying Slaman's design, but it's hardly like he reinvented the archtop here. It'd be one thing if they blatantly copied a Ken Parker design, but at it's heart it's still just a heavily gibson inspired archtop with a charlie christian pickup.

  20. #19

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    Not sure I see the Slaman connection in this thread. So only Slaman can copy the above guitar with a blade pickup he does not even make himself?

  21. #20

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    i only hope ibanez uses/or develops their own real vintage spec designed cc pup...with the 2 huge magnets suspended under the archtop..hence the need for the 3 screws

    like the guy in the uk makes...Charlie Christian Pickups - CC Pickups and slaman uses...to his credit!

    all the rest are bogus copies

    cheers

  22. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by neatomic
    i only hope ibanez uses/or develops their own real vintage spec designed cc pup...with the 2 huge magnets suspended under the archtop..hence the need for the 3 screws

    like the guy in the uk makes...Charlie Christian Pickups - CC Pickups and slaman uses...to his credit!

    all the rest are bogus copies

    cheers
    I'm assuming that includes the CC pickups on the new Westville/Archtop Tribute ES150 and ES350 copies? They state they use their own MiJ pickups, but I haven't been able to locate descriptions of those pickups.

  23. #22

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    am not familiar with type of cc used in the newest japanese copies...be great if they were getting the pup details right!!!..i hope so..but wouldnt count on...takes much extra $$$ and knowledge..why i give credit to cc pickups in uk...he stuck to the original design...bravo..and slaman knew enough to want to use them!!

    even the great pickup man jason lollar uses plexi plates...they are for retro mounting purposes only...otherwise the 3 screws are not needed

    be interested to find out tho!..i like those archtop tributes!

    cheers

  24. #23

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    for $5k, put a frickin' pickguard in the case compartment and put the neck heel strap button on. SMH!

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by lawson-stone
    I'm assuming that includes the CC pickups on the new Westville/Archtop Tribute ES150 and ES350 copies? They state they use their own MiJ pickups, but I haven't been able to locate descriptions of those pickups.
    You will have to visit Walkin's FB page. It is buried in the posts of 2017 to 2018 where their work to develop their own CC is laid out.

    Ibanez working on new Metheny model with CC?-31958071_1371315986345634_3295132710883819520_n-jpg

  26. #25

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    Pat now also has a prototype of the Westville Aruba Unity, a tribute guitar, which will become available in the course of this year. Similar to the Aruba Crest the guitar has a CC pickup. But while the Aruba Crest has a maple top the Unity will have a spruce top.

    The first prototype was finished and delivered to Pat early August. He loves it so much that nowadays on tour he has his Ibanez with him for the stage and the Westville to practice. On this particular guitar there were a few other nice design things like stars on the buttons, and arrows on the pickup similar to the arrows on the sleeve of Pat's Kin record (right upper corner). This guitar was in my hands after it was set up a day before it went to Pat. I only can testify that it is a fabulous guitar. I liked it more than the Crest. I made a few pictures of Pat's Westville Unity guitar and its details, but was asked not to share these on the internet.
    Last edited by stevus; 01-12-2019 at 06:43 AM.