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I'm certain you're correct. And in my experience, the less expensive the pickup, the more critical adjustment becomes. It seems that budget pickups have a narrower sweet spot than higher-end pickups.
Originally Posted by KirkP
Just as one example, I have an Epiphone Les Paul Classic that I bought used. When I got it, it was almost unplayable. After some fret leveling and an initial setup, I still wasn't happy with it. I'd play it, make adjustments, get frustrated, and put it away. A week or two later, I'd do it over again. It took about three months of that before I found the right combination of pickup height, bridge height, neck relief, and nut width to make this guitar sing. Now I'd match it with confidence against any off-the-rack Gibson, but it took a lot of patience and TLC to get there. Just replacing the pickups might have relieved a few symptoms but wouldn't have addressed the underlying problems.
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03-31-2019 07:16 PM
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I am curious why Alumitones did not catch on in the jazz guitar community. I have three on my Strat and I really like them. Originally Posted by ptchristopher3
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Good timing. I’m completing a semi hollow build and was just about to order some Alumitones. I can swap it out if I don’t like it, but they sure are intriguing. Originally Posted by medblues
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Hi,
I recently bought this guitar in the UK. Not cheap! I am having major issues with the Kent Armstrong pick up.
It's an HPAG-1 humbucker. I am getting a relentless mechanical buzz from the pick up or its housing ring mount. Also I am finding the natural brightness of the guitar is sounding harsh/brittle on the top end through this pick up. Anyone else have any issues with this pick up? Suggestions welcome.Last edited by md54; 05-30-2019 at 02:41 PM.
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Sounds like a loose ground. I have an Eastman (I assume that's what you meant, never heard of Eastwood
} T145, which is the predecessor to the T146, and it is somewhat bright, as most carved-top Eastmans are. On mine the pickup was miswired, which gave it a rather meh tone. Rewiring it to the specs on the Armstrong website cured that. But mine is dead quiet. Buzz from the pickup is usually caused by a poor ground. I suggest pulling the pickup out and checking the ground wires. There should be continuity from the ground side of the output jack to the case of the pickup. You can actually check that without pulling anything out.
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The buzz is not electrical it's mechanical. Unamplified it vibrates like crazy on certain chords/ notes. It's actually less noticable plugged in. I have contacted Kent Armstrong himself and he suggested bigger springs on the mount ring. Did that and it was worse! Currently I have removed the whole wiring harness and the pick up and I have slightly opened the plastic pick up ring aperture and filed/scraped the edges of the hole for the pick up wider open. That's because I now suspect the vibrations of the top were touching the edges of the humbucker. I am enjoying playing the guitar acoustically for the first time now I have removed all the electrics. Sounds surprisingly good and loud considering how skinny it is.
However, I am now in a quandary about should I re assemble this P/U or get a darker sounding Gibson 57. I should also point out that the Kent Armstrong has it's wire coming out of the wrong side. It looks like it actually should be a bridge pick up. If that's true would it be over wound or higher output for a neck P/U?? I really don't like the sound as it stands.....harsh, especially on the top strings. I cant find any tech info on this HPAG-1 model so I don't know if it's made in different bridge/neck outputs. All the K E units now have different names like 6 Shooter or Killer Grinder! Very confusing and depending who is selling the brand.
The pick up itself is not vibrating internally. I've tapped it several times and it seems sound.
I really don't want to find the $150 for another pick up. A guitar of this quality/price should have a decent one as standard.
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Changing the pickup is not likely to help. One common fix is to use rubber or silicone tubing instead of springs. I like to use both, if I have the correct sizes. The springs go inside the tubing, and that often cures the problem. If the pickup is rattling in the pickup ring, you can put something inside to stop that. I've used cut up foam earplugs, and other types of foam wedged between the pickup and the ring. It could also be something other than the pickup that's vibrating. I've had problems with pickguards and the wires inside the guitar. I had one guitar which had potentiometers that were worn, and the shafts vibrated with the knobs. Once it only happened with asymmetrical knobs, after I put some chicken-head knobs on. I had to go back to the old round ones. There are many, many things that can vibrate on an archtop, and even though it sounds like the pickup is the culprit, it may not be. Take time and investigate thoroughly.
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I am confident that it is the pick up mount. When it’s vibrating and I touch it it stops. I will do the plastic tube thing. Thanks very much. I’m still concerned that I have a bridge pick up but hey.....
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May not be any help, but I’ve just swapped the pickup in my Eastman AR371CE archtop (single pickup ES175-a-like). And I noticed that the wires on the Kent Armstrong pickup that I took out came out of the oppostite side of the pickup than those of the one I replaced it with (an Irongear Blues Machine). Originally Posted by md54
The reason I changed the pickup was that I found the Kent Armstrong a bit muddly and boomy - and yet this did not seem to have much in common with the acoustic voice of the guitar. The new pickup is much better - clearer and more articulate and more balanced, to my ears. Consistent with the common wisdom that Eastman guitars are bright-sounding, I do need to roll off the tone control to about half way down, but this is not a problem. Has improved the guitar a lot (to my ears).
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Thanks for this. The wire being on the wrong side bothers me. Does it mean they were using up stock of bridge P/Us, or Eastman didn't know the difference, or that K A Korea just made a model HPAG-1 in one configuration to save production costs? Does anyone have any tech info on this pick up? Originally Posted by geoff23
I have had issues with other K A pick ups in the past. However I do have an excellent UK made K A humbucker that I love (fitted to a Tele). I do have serious doubts about the Korean range. I believe they are just made in a generic factory in Korea and are of a middling/ just about OK standard with his name on for marketing purposes. However I can't prove that and they are cheap to buy relatively. But my guitar wasn't cheap! 2K $ US and that was after some serious negotiating. I suspect I will end up with a Seymour Duncan but Ill try the stock P/U one more time. If the damn thing stops vibrating I'll be inclined to play it more often even if it does sound on the brittle side.
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Have you tried raising the pickup? Raising it comresses the springs more, and sometimes fixes rattles/buzzes. If that doesn't do it, put something between the pickup and the ring, any type of foam should help. You can also try wedging something between the ring and the pickup, like a pick or a woodwind reed. The asset of the reed is that you can break it off flush. There are multiple threads on the forum about this, because it's such a common problem.
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Originally Posted by sgosnell
Yup, tried raising the pickup. Even with the extra long beefy springs I fitted no luck. I really don't like a high pickup especially on the bass side but it didn't work any way.
Interestingly the ring is almost dead flush with the pickup. I couldn't even get a piece of writing paper in the gap. Also when I re fitted the ring without the pickup I realised the neck side of the spruce top aperture was encroaching into the hole where the front edge of the pickup should be. I think the ring was mounted slightly backwards towards the bridge. I'm guessing that the vibrating top was actually touching the edge of the pickup. So I've enlarged both the ring and the hole in the top front edge. I will also try your rubber tube trick if I can find some tube and finally I will try some thin rubber washers between the ring and the guitar top to lift the ring off the top. I hope all that works! When I've done it I'll try to remember to come back on and let you know how I got on.
Cheers!
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Sometimes finding and stopping vibrations can be a journey, taking time and effort. Sometimes it's an instant fix. The possibilities are so numerous and so varied it's a crapshoot trying to do it via the internet. With experience and the guitar in hand, it's sometimes easier, but not always. Good luck with it.
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I used shrink tube on the springs as you suggested. I also opened the aperture in the pick up ring and the guitar top. Finally I found some tiny silicone washers and put them between the top and the pick up ring.
Ive just reassembled and I am pretty sure it’s worked! I’ll check tomorrow to confirm because I know these things come and go. I also think the sound of the pick up is better now that it’s not touching the vibrating top.
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On the Eastman guitars I have with humbuckers and pickup rings I found the fit in the ring is quite loose. I have card stock from business cards between the pickup rings and the pickup.
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I've never thought of using shrink tubing, but it might work. The usual material is either latex or silicone tubing, but whatever works...
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Not this one. Even after scraping it wider it’s still very tight. I might do one edge a bit more. I have a feeling that the ring used isn’t the one that is supplied originally. It’s had a lot of the bottom side slopped off to match the carve. Hmmmm.. I dunno. Originally Posted by DanielleOM
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A properly fitted ring will have the bottom fitted to the guitar top. Just putting it on flat stresses both the pickup ring and the guitar top, and can cause the screws to strip the threads in the top and loosen, even fall out.
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Hi Guys, my name is Steve. I'm new of course. I recently purchased a handmade archtop and I want to add a floater. I really like the sound of the KA 12 pole floater and the DeArmond 1100 reissue. I really love that classic warm jazz sound. That is what I'm after. Which pickup do you guys think would work better to help achieve this sound? I'd really appreciate you help and insight. Thanks!
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I like the DeArmond. I think it's an ideal pickup, and I love mine. But it's a subjective opinion, like everyone else's.
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Is it a lot different than the Kent Armstrong as far as sound?
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And just some trivia, Dan Armstrong was Kent's father (Dan Kent Armstrong). Originally Posted by rlrhett
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I don't know. I don't have an Armstrong 12-pole for comparison. All I know is that my search for a pickup is over. Originally Posted by stevefreeman
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Are all Kent Armstrong floaters as installed on Chinese factory archtops (like my Loar) humbuckers?
If so they shouldn't hum, right - not at all or just less?
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Well, you are comparing apples and oranges there. The DeArmond reissue is not a humbucker; the Kent Armstrong is. So right there you're going to have a significant difference in tonality. My experience with the Kent Armstrong is that it is a very firm and clear pick up; it does not have a soft attack like the original PAF, for example. From your attraction to these two pickups, however, it seems like you might appreciate that kind of sound (I prefer a softer attack and darker sound, so I don't use the KA pick up any longer and have never tried the DeArmond although have been quite interested in one). Originally Posted by stevefreeman
Both are highly regarded pickups in the jazz community. If you want a tone like Johnny Smith 50s-early 60s sound, for example, then the DeArmond would probably get the nod. Straightahead jazz, maybe bebop, swing era music, etc., would probably sound great with that. On the other hand, if you want a more modern tone and one that might work well with some overdrive (e.g. for fusiony things), the KA might be better suited.
One of the Johnny Smith style pickups such as from Kent Armstrong or Lollar, might sort of split the difference between those two.
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