Let's Talk Alnico Magnets

[pingu]

Good to know - just to satisfy my curiosity, please do tell us what pickup you got pingu, cheers.

A bare knuckles alnico 3 ...

[Meggy]

A bare knuckles alnico 3 ...

an excellent budget choice there! Bound to be good anyhow

[jads57]

Great Humbuckers for around $50 used? Seymour Duncan Jazz neck, DiMarzio 36th Anniversary, Ibanez Super 58 Japan.

Boutique ones used try Manluis Landmark PAF, Sheptone, Vintage Vibe (Peter Biltoft) these will be a bit more expensive $ wise

[GNAPPI]

Johnny Eleca (brand name) has some inexpensive pups on Ebay. Based on a batch of positive reviews I bought one but haven't installed it yet. For ~$16 I figured it's low risk.

[joegold]

Sorry to be resurrecting such an old thread, but I wanted to add my own 2c worth on this topic.

When I first switched from using EMG SA active pickups on my main working guitar (late 80s) I hit on the Duncan 59 as my favourite passive humbucker pickup especially on my jazz-oriented guitars.
And I swore up and down that this was the best pickup for jazz and recommended them to anyone who wold listen.

Around the millennium, the Gibson 57 Classics came out and I decided to try one.
I was blown away by the extra warmth.
I put them on all my guitars and swore up and down that these were the best humbuckers for jazz and recommended them to anyone who was listening.

But a few months ago I wasn't digging my tones and decided to put a Dimarzio 36th Anniversary PAF on my main jazz-oriented Tele.
And I like it so much better than the 57 Classics I'd been using.

The main difference between these two pickups is the magnet used.
The 57s use an A2 magnet and the Dimarzios use an A5.

Since I'm usually trying to cop a jazz tone in the range of Ed Bickert/Metheny/Martino, I'm rationalizing this that most of my fav players were using Gibson guitars made in the 60s which probably had A5 magnets.
Prior to around 61 Gibson used mostly A2 magnets although they used A3 and A5 too occasionally.

I find the A2 humbuckers get a bit too muddy, especially on the bass strings when you roll the tone pot back and the A5s retain some clarity.
I like the A2s better for bright r&b oriented stuff because of the extra warmth.

This was a big eye opener for me.
But I'm a bit neurotic and may change back.
Still... Something to consider.

[jorgemg1984]

Sorry to be resurrecting such an old thread, but I wanted to add my own 2c worth on this topic.

When I first switched from using EMG SA active pickups on my main working guitar (late 80s) I hit on the Duncan 59 as my favourite passive humbucker pickup especially on my jazz-oriented guitars.
And I swore up and down that this was the best pickup for jazz and recommended them to anyone who wold listen.

Around the millennium, the Gibson 57 Classics came out and I decided to try one.
I was blown away by the extra warmth.
I put them on all my guitars and swore up and down that these were the best humbuckers for jazz and recommended them to anyone who was listening.

But a few months ago I wasn't digging my tones and decided to put a Dimarzio 36th Anniversary PAF on my main jazz-oriented Tele.
And I like it so much better than the 57 Classics I'd been using.

The main difference between these two pickups is the magnet used.
The 57s use an A2 magnet and the Dimarzios use an A5.

Since I'm usually trying to cop a jazz tone in the range of Ed Bickert/Metheny/Martino, I'm rationalizing this that most of my fav players were using Gibson guitars made in the 60s which probably had A5 magnets.
Prior to around 61 Gibson used mostly A2 magnets although they used A3 and A5 too occasionally.

I find the A2 humbuckers get a bit too muddy, especially on the bass strings when you roll the tone pot back and the A5s retain some clarity.
I like the A2s better for bright r&b oriented stuff because of the extra warmth.

This was a big eye opener for me.
But I'm a bit neurotic and may change back.
Still... Something to consider.

Yeah, there's a certain myth around Alnico 2 (maybe because of the 1959 Les Paul?) but the 60s archtop sounds we like so much were probably made with Alnico 5s. I enjoy the 36th a lot, great pickup.

[sgosnell]

I have a hard time understanding how the exact alloy composition can affect tone, other than through magnet strength. My understanding of physics just doesn't have any explanation for how there can be any effect other than the strength of the magnetic field. Anything else seems to be just woo.

[JCat]

I have a hard time understanding how the exact alloy composition can affect tone, other than through magnet strength. My understanding of physics just doesn't have any explanation for how there can be any effect other than the strength of the magnetic field. Anything else seems to be just woo.

Electro magnetism and it's applications is a most fascinating subject and a complex science. There are things we still don't fully understand. But it's known for a long time that the magnetic material, its shape, surface texture and strength affect the magnetic field and the electric current frequency range. For example, it's well documented that a rough cast magnet has different properties than the same magnet when polished.

If we look at PAF humbuckers, it's well documented that there have been many different types of magnets over the years. Materials as well as size, surface and gauss have varied and this is one of the reasons behind the fact that PAFs are indeed different.

A pickup coil is what it is. We can't change the wire gauge, the bobbin or the number of winds. But we can change the magnet! Just slide in a different magnet and see for yourself. A5 is different than A2. It's not just a matter of gauss and physical shape. The actual magnetic field is different and this affects the frequency range. This is obviously not the only thing that sets pickups apart, but it's a parameter the user can in fact alter.

Within the guitar community there's a perception that A2 is smooth, warm and "singing" and that A5 supposedly is more edgy and therefore would be better suited for distortion and rock. This is nothing but an uneducated myth.

Fact: Most single coils over the years (Fender as well as Gibson P90) came with A5. If you like the clarity and articulation of a single coil PU, you probably also like A5 in your PAFs for Jazz.

[aquin43]

I have a hard time understanding how the exact alloy composition can affect tone, other than through magnet strength. My understanding of physics just doesn't have any explanation for how there can be any effect other than the strength of the magnetic field. Anything else seems to be just woo.

The various grades of alnico have low but different permeabilities. When they are used as pole pieces as in the Strat type pickups this directly affects the inductance to a modest degree. When they are used in humbuckers it affects the mutual coupling between the two coils. A higher permeability, such as in alnico 2 increases the coupling and hence the overall effective inductance. In addition, in a humbucker, increasing the flux density with a stronger magnet brings the pole pieces nearer to saturation, reducing their permeability slightly.

Small effects but noticeable to some it seems.

[Helliger]

I don't think you can really judge how a pickup will sound based on the magnet type. That's just part of the equation. A stronger magnet like an A5 can be louder with less winds than an A2. What type of wire, how many winds, how it was wound etc.. There's a lot of rabbit holes you can go down with guitar mods and I think pickups is probably the biggest one. Really hard to pinpoint how a pickup will sound in a particular guitar going by magnet type. I've spent lots of money on various pickups for guitars and a few times end up with the original pickups in there. LOL

[Jimmy Smith]

What I've done is utilize double thick magnets. This is good in the neck for jazz because it makes the tone deeper. You can also create hybrid double thick magnets where you epoxy 2 different types together and then remagnetize them as 1. So you could have A2 and A5 in one pickup. Or A3 and A6, or UOA5 and A2 etc.