Looking for new guitar dream (Tal Farlow, L-5, 350t, ES-125)

**jzjazz** · 06-10-2017, 09:06 AM

Thanks to all of you - this has been very interesting. My conclusion - after this and listening over and over again to YT samples (unfortunately there is a minimal chance of anyone having any of these in Poland) is:

- either get a Tal to replace my Aria, which would be a shame since the Tal wouldn't be vintage, and my Aria is 40 years old. So only a matter of time that I'll miss the Aria

- or get an ES-125 and keep the Aria. The 125 is a completely different animal, more vintage, less thunky, so these would complement each other better
- get both - Tal and ES-125 and keep the Aria, yeah!

Thanks for other suggestions, but I don't want a floating pickup guitar for sure. I also feel that the L4 or 350 have less character and are pretty transparent (as is the L-5), that's not what I'm after right now. I'll let you know when I pull the trigger on something (this might be in far future though)

**jzjazz** · 06-10-2017, 12:41 PM

Great Anthony Wilson sound on his Byrdland found accidentally today:

**Little Jay** · 06-11-2017, 05:10 AM

Anthony's sound is great in that vid indeed! Very nice!

**Philco** · 06-11-2017, 05:49 AM

My guess is that you are chasing something that only exists on very expensive recordings.

Out of all your examples, the Byrdland is the killer. That is also my dream tone.

But ask yourself this.......have you ever heard another Byrdland on YouTube sound like that?

I can answer the question for you. No, you haven't.

No jazz box sounds like that.

It's a "recorded" sound. Some engineer has earned his wage by running it through the right chain of equipment and then "sat" it in the mix so that it lives with all the other instruments. It's been cut and it's been boosted, it's been compressed and heaven knows what else.

We all fall for it....."I'm going to buy a such and such cos it sounded so good on Joe Blogs album". Well good luck with that.
Even "live" albums are mixed in a studio by someone.

Jesse Van Ruller has a great.....actually freaking unbelievable tone.....on the album "live at murphy's law" but his Levin doesn't sound much like that on any other YT live recordings.

The best I've heard Martin Van Iterson's 125 is on a live but mixed after the gig performance. All other YT clips sound ...so so.

BTW your recorded sounds are some of the best I've heard on the net. I think you have a great ear for it and no matter what you buy, you will coax a great sound from it.

But you know I'm happy to fall for the same trap over and over....cos if you ever get that Byrdland tone on one of your recordings then I will buy whatever guitar and amp you are using

**Little Jay** · 06-11-2017, 06:24 AM

This what the P90 of an ES-125 can also sound like:

Recorded with no effects, no eq. Just the spring reverb of a Session Bluesbaby 22, Sennheiser e609 into a small mixer and from there thru an iRig into my iPhone, which was the recording device.

**Little Jay** · 06-11-2017, 06:25 AM

This what the P90 of an ES-125 can also sound like:

Recorded with no effects, no eq. Just the spring reverb of a Session Bluesbaby 22, Sennheiser e609 into a small mixer and from there thru an iRig into my iPhone, which was the recording device.

**jzjazz** · 06-11-2017, 06:53 PM

Originally Posted by Philco

Out of all your examples, the Byrdland is the killer. That is also my dream tone.
But ask yourself this.......have you ever heard another Byrdland on YouTube sound like that?
I can answer the question for you. No, you haven't.

Agreed, that's why it's unlikely that it's going to be a Birdland. This and the price ;-)

Originally Posted by Philco

The best I've heard Martin Van Iterson's 125 is on a live but mixed after the gig performance. All other YT clips sound ...so so.

I listened today to two albums of Mr. Iterson - great playing and a very good guitar sound out of his 125. But I didn't think it was exceptional. Everything very correct - cuts through, doesn't sound thin. But there wasn't a single moment where I thought "wow, that's the tone I'm after", so not too sure about that 125 anymore...

Originally Posted by Philco

BTW your recorded sounds are some of the best I've heard on the net. I think you have a great ear for it and no matter what you buy, you will coax a great sound from it.

Thank you, that's very kind! But doesn't solve my dilemma ;-)

Originally Posted by Philco

But you know I'm happy to fall for the same trap over and over....cos if you ever get that Byrdland tone on one of your recordings then I will buy whatever guitar and amp you are using

That's a deal, I'll let you know ;-)

Maybe I should think of a es-165 with set-in pickup? Very inexpensive (seems to cost less than a 125) and sounds great on most YT clips. Isn't vintage and the build quality isn't too great, but who cares?

**Burrellesque** · 06-12-2017, 02:00 AM

I've owned my Gibson ES-350N for a few years now. I absolutely love this guitar and lusted after it for so long. Now I'm struggling to think of another 'dream' archtop that I would want and that would add something different.

However I'm beginning to think I really should have an acoustic archtop with a Rhythm Chief... perhaps an L-7? Any thoughts?

And I would still like a single P90 ES=175 too... maybe even a Guild CE100?

**jzjazz** · 06-12-2017, 08:38 AM

Are there any professionals playing a Tal these days? There is the great Martijn Van Iterson with the 125 with a lot of stuff to listen too, but are there any modern studio recordings of guitarists playing a Tal?

**mr. beaumont** · 06-12-2017, 09:07 AM

Originally Posted by jzjazz

Are there any professionals playing a Tal these days? There is the great Martijn Van Iterson with the 125 with a lot of stuff to listen too, but are there any modern studio recordings of guitarists playing a Tal?

Chicago's Andy Brown does. Check out "Direct Call" on Delmark. Pretty much perfect jazz guitar tone to me.

**jzjazz** · 06-12-2017, 09:11 AM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

Chicago's Andy Brown does. Check out "Direct Call" on Delmark. Pretty much perfect jazz guitar tone to me.

Great stuff, thanks! Listening to it now, amazing sound - has something acoustic to it in the heights though I doubt that there was anything else than the amp sound recorded.

**jzjazz** · 06-13-2017, 04:21 AM

Now I need to have a Tal. Thanks Jeff :-(

**vinlander** · 06-13-2017, 05:23 AM

**stoneground** · 06-13-2017, 06:46 AM

Originally Posted by jzjazz

Agreed, that's why it's unlikely that it's going to be a Birdland. This and the price ;-)

I listened today to two albums of Mr. Iterson - great playing and a very good guitar sound out of his 125. But I didn't think it was exceptional. Everything very correct - cuts through, doesn't sound thin. But there wasn't a single moment where I thought "wow, that's the tone I'm after", so not too sure about that 125 anymore...

Thank you, that's very kind! But doesn't solve my dilemma ;-)

That's a deal, I'll let you know ;-)

Maybe I should think of a es-165 with set-in pickup? Very inexpensive (seems to cost less than a 125) and sounds great on most YT clips. Isn't vintage and the build quality isn't too great, but who cares?

I think something should be said in defence of the early 165 build quality. My 1995 model is pretty much perfect in that respect and I must say that except for the well documented tailpiece issue I have not heard any negative remarks about the 165 from that era. In my case it was a affordable choice when vintage single p/u 175s were out of my price range. Having owned it for 22 years I cannot really think of a guitar I would exchange it for. I put a decent zig zag tailpiece on mine and installed a Classic 57 humbucker for the quintessential 175 tone. I think these guitars are fantastic value and would recommend grabbing one while there are some left at reasonable prices. I would agree that Mr Iterson's playing is great but I wouldn't exchange my 165 for his 125.

**rio** · 06-13-2017, 10:54 AM

I don't know why there aren't more Tals out here in the wild. Lots of 175's out on gigs but I have never played with anyone or seen a gig where the guitarist is using one. It's a mystery.

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**vinlander** · 06-13-2017, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by rio

I don't know why there aren't more Tals out here in the wild. Lots of 175's out on gigs but I have never played with anyone or seen a gig where the guitarist is using one. It's a mystery.

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I guess for 2 reasons basically :
1) A Tal being a signature instrument from a relatively recently passed away musician, I suspect many pros don't want to play with someone else name on their instrument.
2) Its special appointments are not to everyone's taste.
As long as it stays like this it will remain affordable at least on the 2nd hand market