Epiphone ES-175 Owners Club

[joaopaz]

As always some say changing things on guitars change the tone (pots, capacitors, wire...) and some write entire forums about it..
I don't have much experience in that domain, but I wonder if Joapaz will think (and hear) ?
Changing caps value must have an effect in the tone sweep somehow, or why would there be all those different types and materials (ceramic, paper in oil, mika...)?

I don't know much about it, either .. So I took a pragmatic approach: I went to the Gibson website and printed the specs of the current ES-175's and said I wanted that He said those were the values he'd use in any case - just advised me to go with the all audio pots - since that was what I already had asked on previous job to make the volume swells more gradual.

I did a similar job on a Gretsch; it's the Streamliner G2622, an Asian model. The guitar is incredible, great for its value but I couldn't work with those pots... they would dramatically change volume with minimum input and then would remain almost unaltered for the rest of the course of the knob. There was also noise involved, as soon as I reduced the volume from 10... same as I was getting on the Epiphone. His changes on the Gretsch really really made a difference.

I'm hoping for the same on the Epiphone! B-)

[3rdeyestringtheory]

Sorry for the crappy pics. I got really excited.. so now it's officially official! Just as I thought. It's sounds better in my ears than anything I've owned, including the afj95.. Love the neck and the finish. Just need to find a good bone nut. Now I can focus on practice finally. Any thoughts on tusq nuts vs bone? What did the gibbons come with?

[Little Jay]

Sorry for the crappy pics. I got really excited.. so now it's officially official! Just as I thought. It's sounds better in my ears than anything I've owned, including the afj95.. Love the neck and the finish. Just need to find a good bone nut. Now I can focus on practice finally. Any thoughts on tusq nuts vs bone? What did the gibbons come with?

Gibsons come with tusq nuts. When they changed to that I don't know.

[Little Jay]

As always some say changing things on guitars change the tone (pots, capacitors, wire...) and some write entire forums about it..
I don't have much experience in that domain, but I wonder if Joapaz will think (and hear) ?
Changing caps value must have an effect in the tone sweep somehow, or why would there be all those different types and materials (ceramic, paper in oil, mika...)?

Changing cap values (the uF) for sure has an effect. Same value but different material is another story. I am actually in the camp that believes that different materials do sound a little different, but I have only experienced that in guitar amps for coupling caps passing the whole signal thru it. In guitars I don't hear it (but it might be there). But quality pots with a workable slope are always a good investment!

[Jx30510]

Yes that's exactly what I think, the pots on the Epiphone work well, but are very annoying on the slope, especially when working with the 2 pickups.. volume goes from zero to full beetween graduation 1-2?! Really unusable for me.
Is it because the volume pots are logarithmic? Will audio pots change that?

[Little Jay]

Audio = logarithmic.

So your pots are probably linear. Although linear on paper looks like a straight line and suggest a graduate increase in volume, I have read that the human ear does not percieve it that way and actually log/audio pots are percieved as a graduate in-/decrease in volume.

I have seen in a lot of Asian guitars that volume changes from nothing to almost full in the first quarter of the dial or so.

Now there are also reverse log pots, maybe those are typically used in Asian builts?

Here's a nice explanation:
potentiometer - Why should I use a logarithmic pot for audio applications? - Electrical Engineering Stack Exchange

[KirkP]

Audio pots are only approximately logarithmic. I've read that some manufacturers get much closer to logarithmic than others, providing a more continuous transition of perceived volume through the range.

As an electrical engineer, I'm quite certain that two capacitors of precisely the same capacitance value will be indistinguishable in an audio circuit unless there is a defect in the dielectric. The choice of dielectric material is driven by factors such as cost, tolerances, working voltage, temperature, vibration, allowable drift with age, allowable failure rate, and progress in materials & manufacturing. If a "vintage" capacitor sounds different than a modern capacitor, I suspect it either has a different capacitance value or the dielectric is conducting some current, acting as a capacitor and resister in parallel. There's no harm in experimenting, but it helps to know the science behind what we're hearing.

(Gosh, when I reread this is comes across as condescending, but I'm just trying to share what I've learned.)

[joaopaz]

Great!
I'll be going this exact same route on mine next week.
Do you know if a US Switchcraft toggle switch will fit the original hole on the body?

That original nut is so sloppy looking

Don't forget to give your impressions.

Hi Jx! I asked my guitar tech today and he told me that no, he didn't need to work there. The replacement fit well... just there's another button I'll need to change because of the inches versus metric thing! I now have a black point on the toggle button but I want one of the same color the guitar came with(!)

[joaopaz]

Sorry for the crappy pics. I got really excited.. so now it's officially official! Just as I thought. It's sounds better in my ears than anything I've owned, including the afj95.. Love the neck and the finish. Just need to find a good bone nut. Now I can focus on practice finally. Any thoughts on tusq nuts vs bone? What did the gibbons come with?

Congrats!! Those are really some Black Beauties Looks super! Enjoy your new guitar - and lots of success with it

According to the Gibson site, their current 1959 VOS ES-175 comes with a Nylon nut..
1959 ES-175D

[joaopaz]

Audio pots are only approximately logarithmic. I've read that some manufacturers get much closer to logarithmic than others, providing a more continuous transition of perceived volume through the range.

As an electrical engineer, I'm quite certain that two capacitors of precisely the same capacitance value will be indistinguishable in an audio circuit unless there is a defect in the dielectric. The choice of dielectric material is driven by factors such as cost, tolerances, working voltage, temperature, vibration, allowable drift with age, allowable failure rate, and progress in materials & manufacturing. If a "vintage" capacitor sounds different than a modern capacitor, I suspect it either has a different capacitance value or the dielectric is conducting some current, acting as a capacitor and resister in parallel. There's no harm in experimenting, but it helps to know the science behind what we're hearing.

(Gosh, when I reread this is comes across as condescending, but I'm just trying to share what I've learned.)

Great post, keep them coming - knowledge is always a good thing to share!

To put it in "my words", I've heard/read many times that what makes some vintage guitars/gear unique is precisely their imperfections... the way a pickup is winded by hand will not distribute the wire as precisely as a machine... I think you meant something like that, right?

[joaopaz]

She's here

First impressions - with a little background.

I recently upgraded the neck PU on my Ibanez AFJ95, adding a Bare Knuckles "Manhattan" P90, humbucker size. The change was dramatic. Suddenly that guitar which I thought was perfect aside some uncharacteristic sound... now it had(has) everything. It's a joy to play and that pickup sound is amazing.

I posted a small comparison here in the forum and the guys' reactions confirmed that the Ibanez now sounded marginally better than the Epiphone. I though so too..

Last week I also managed to find/buy a Polytone Mini Brute I - and suddenly, again, I felt "at rest" Maybe you gear/GAS nutz will understand this.. I though finally "this is it".
With my previous amps/guitars I could manage to gt some wonderful tones, but at the same I always thought they were never "jazzy enough" (whatever that is...!)
With the new pair, now, it's a bit the opposite, I think it always sounds jazzy enough, in spite of the settings I dial in.
One thing that marveled me was that I was looking for a kind of early Jim Hall tone, P90 and a Polytone - and these new acquisitions matched it so close... I was listening today on my car to few Jim Hall records and smile to his tone thinking "I have this tone at home" OK, I'm sure you must take this enthousiasm with a grain of salt... but still.

So the Epiphone arrived.
All problems look like they're solved... no more noise, I can play with the volume knob now, without bringing in noise as soon as reduce from 10, and also the course of the knob has a direct and predictable match in the sound produced.
The jack input now makes a nice "clank" ..
And the nut is smooth on the edges - with the previous one I could risk some blood in my hands if I tried to finger an Fmaj7 in 1st position

About the sound - I felt the same way like with my Gretsch that went through a similar procedure. It's a "better" sound, unmistakably. Hard to explain, but it sounds like it has more depth, more warmth, is more round... and even in volume - or across the frequency spectrum.

My only point of comparison is the Ibanez, that's why I started with the long intro. The Ibanez felt "marginally" better, now for sure the Epiphone is sounding, to me, "marginally" better than the Ibanez - I confess I wasn't expecting that much - as I though the Epiphone sounded awsome already on its original configuration.
But it just got better and it's noticeable.

And now finally I can rest and just play, while marveling to the Epiphone/Polytone pair

I'll try to past a few clips ASAP

[KirkP]

Great post, keep them coming - knowledge is always a good thing to share!

To put it in "my words", I've heard/read many times that what makes some vintage guitars/gear unique is precisely their imperfections... the way a pickup is winded by hand will not distribute the wire as precisely as a machine... I think you meant something like that, right?

Just considering electronics (not wood) I think that there's some truth in that. Modern automated factories are able to maintain tighter tolerances than were typical in "vintage" components. Also, some vintage component values drift with time. I think Jason Lollar says he finds a lot of variation in the tone of vintage pickups, so he'll typically chose one he particularly likes, then tries to emulate it (or improve on it). So there's nothing inherently better about vintage electronics. I consider it just a marketing tool.

[citizenk74]

Sorry for the crappy pics. I got really excited.. so now it's officially official! Just as I thought. It's sounds better in my ears than anything I've owned, including the afj95.. Love the neck and the finish. Just need to find a good bone nut. Now I can focus on practice finally. Any thoughts on tusq nuts vs bone? What did the gibbons come with?

What a great looking guitar! Congratulations, and play it in good health! Also:

Also - If it were mine, I'd put creme mounting rings around the pickups. I just do that with all my black guitars. It looks great as is...I'm just babbling.... Enjoy!

[joaopaz]

Also - If it were mine, I'd put creme mounting rings around the pickups. I just do that with all my black guitars. It looks great as is...I'm just babbling.... Enjoy!

Great idea, it would look super cool matching the binding!

[392Hemi]

Mine is a natural, from the $440 deal GC had. I put TI 12 flats on it and removed the E from the PG. Run it mostly through my 2002 Rivera 55 Jazz Suprema. Other amps include a Blues Deluxe and a Peavey 4/10 Classic both from the early 90's. I would love to get a deal on a mint like mine in Wine Red.

[joaopaz]

Mine is a natural, from the $440 deal GC had. I put TI 12 flats on it and removed the E from the PG. Run it mostly through my 2002 Rivera 55 Jazz Suprema. Other amps include a Blues Deluxe and a Peavey 4/10 Classic both from the early 90's. I would love to get a deal on a mint like mine in Wine Red.

And that makes 14 entries on this thread - welcome, Sir!
Which of your amps do you think works best with the Epiphone?

[wmachine]

I just noticed a deviation to specs that I don't see has been mentioned. The pup specs are for '57 Classics, both positions. But the pics clearly show (at least 3 times) '57 Classic Plus in the bridge. I know this is a common parring, but the specs clearly show both pups to be the same. And this is true of the Gibson ES-175 (and higher models) specs. No Classic Plus.
Not a problem and fine with me, but just pointing out the difference.

[joaopaz]

I just noticed a deviation to specs that I don't see has been mentioned. The pup specs are for '57 Classics, both positions. But the pics clearly show (at least 3 times) '57 Classic Plus in the bridge. I know this is a common parring, but the specs clearly show both pups to be the same. And this is true of the Gibson ES-175 (and higher models) specs. No Classic Plus.
Not a problem and fine with me, but just pointing out the difference.

That was mentioned, yes (post #70)
Since it is on the bridge I have no problems with it - although this kind of inaccuracy bugs me quite a bit.

[392Hemi]

And that makes 14 entries on this thread - welcome, Sir!
Which of your amps do you think works best with the Epiphone?

Thanks for asking Joaopaz;

They all work well for the way I play which is in the house at pretty low volume between 3 and 5 on the amp, guitar volume just under 10. I like to play my archtops through the Rivera it has amazing clean tones on channel 2 with a touch of reverb (2 1/2). The Rivera has 2 channels with push/pull switches. The 175 is almost always played in the neck position with the tone at 5 or below. I hope this answers your question in some way. Short answer the Peavey LOL, just joking it's the Rivera. I will do more testing and report back later. Ron

[392Hemi]

I also find it curious the listed specs for the ES175 Premium doesn't mention the 57+ at the bridge. All the ones I have seen including mine have the plus. Maybe by not listing it they have an option.

[Blackbox]

Hello, I'm new to this forum. Last week I brought my black ES-175 to a luthier, and reading around here, I feel not alone: the toggle switch didn’t work well, there was some kind of buzzing, and I almost accidently broke the wood around the input jack. The luthier sad, he should straighten the neck, too.
I owned the guitar for about one and a half year and love the way it plays and sounds and looks. Hopefully, if he can fix it, in a few days even more than before. Then I’ll send a pic, too!

[citizenk74]

Hello, I'm new to this forum. Last week I brought my black ES-175 to a luthier, and reading around here, I feel not alone: the toggle switch didn’t work well, there was some kind of buzzing, and I almost accidently broke the wood around the input jack. The luthier sad, he should straighten the neck, too.
I owned the guitar for about one and a half year and love the way it plays and sounds and looks. Hopefully, if he can fix it, in a few days even more than before. Then I’ll send a pic, too!

[Dirk Kahuna]

Hi All,
Dirk here. I purchased the Sunburst version of the Epi ES175 Premium, new, about a month ago (from AMS). Love the guitar but, unlike most, I am not as enthused about the mat look. I like guitars with a high degree of shine/polish. BUT, it sounds great and I find no blems/defects.

I paired it with the DV Mark Little Jazz Combo and am still fine tuning the tone/settings. Super light weight.

[sgosnell]

I also have one of those. It sounds great for its size, and it's very transportable. It's not quite as good as my Clarus/RE rig, but it's very close, and in a gigging situation you really can't tell the difference. A lot of people seem to be using the Henriksen Bud, but that's 4 times the price of this, and I'm very skeptical that it's 4 times the amp, or even marginally better. I really like the Little Jazz.

[pingu]

What a great looking guitar! Congratulations, and play it in good health! Also:

Also - If it were mine, I'd put creme mounting rings around the pickups. I just do that with all my black guitars. It looks great as is...I'm just babbling.... Enjoy!

Cream put rings are cool !
I do that too , it makes them sound better to
<joking>